Maps

[P3D]

You might want to keep EK to scuffle with, but a nation with a realistic population of about 50,000 would only be a speedbump for NS.

[Ithekro]

Well my adjustments leave  North America and the Pacific like this.   The cluster of larger Islands in the South Atlantic become the enlarged Azores to handle some of the extra stuff there, which goes to the UK as per storyline (I suppose).



Removed Numenor entirely and formed a small cluster of islands rougle between Hawaii and the Marshals.  If we want Numenor it will probably have to be place for Hawaii, or more accurately, as Hawaii.  Since it would have been raised from the sea again, it would have no Numenorian population and would be filled with Hawaiians and others that came later.  Two big sets of islands in th Pacific doesn't look right for some reason without a continent there.  Maybe its just me.  Or are you taking about Numenor being near the Artic like in Swamphen's maps?   I didn't know if Swamphen wanted the other island in the south still or not.  Also removed extra continents in South Pacific.  Should be have one out there anyway as an unknown?  Or something to go with Easter Island and the ACM directorate that was suppose to be there?

[Desertfox]

NS is a tad too big but looks good.

Larger Easter would be nice.

Add EK as a small Japanese colony, it makes the  Alskan Black Sea interesting. ;D

[BattleofthePyramids]

So, Austria is just that little green blob in the middle of Europe?  Humbling :-\

Judging from this, Austria was punching way above her weight class in the sim.  Anyone think this is a problem? ???

[Ithekro]

Better? (or worse?)


The Hasburgs have always be hitting above there class, they just seem to be it fairly well.  A though passing around was to have the Hapsurgs have Italy as well (with her African Colony on the Eastern part of Africa, not North Africa.  That can be reserved for someone else).  Another thought to to have the Hapsburgs still be both Austria and Spain (and maybe "Spanish Neatherlands", but that might be going too far).  However that is a judgement call that should be looked at verses other factors including where new people should go, and what is fair in terms of the position a "major" nation is in after all our mucking about.

[P3D]

Ithreko, I just do not understand why do you really need
a/ California as a separate state
b/ EK as a separate state?

If you agree that we should redraw borders to justify geographic situation, then Rohan as is should be limited to ~30 million people. EK by your map has a justifiable population of ~20000 of trappers and lumberjacks. Please do not post maps that just has no relation whatsoever to the physical geography of the region. If you want 70-80, you need to occupy at least the California valley, plus have water resoruces to make aqueduct to your coastal cities in the Californian desert (LA/SD or whatever).

[swamphen]

I agree that the EK should be dropped. However I don't see what's the problem with Rohan, they have the fertile Puget Sound region and on these maps they have a very large "new land" region, presumably with plenty of resources.

LA and SD are Confederate property.


Revised S-Map. Note Habsburgs have Poland.  ;D  Also revised Rohirrim and Haven/Turtle Island borders...

[Ithekro]

Hmmm.

Did a modification with Rohan absorbing both Cailfornia and the Eastern Kingdom and moving north.  The Haven relates on the Middle Earth Map to Nurn and Near Harad.  Though California was to be free and could afford to be free by the gold they mined, being a sorts of Hong Kong of America.  With the map layover, California translates to Umbar (what was San Francisco).

Rohan itself was to hold about 10MP at start with New Beleriand to have 4MP at start.  Spoils of war added 2.3MP to New Beleraind and the surrounding area plus 1.5 added throughout the lands from immigration and birth rates between 1898 to 1906.  Part of this could be cinsidered the absorption of the tiny Eastern Kingdom and maybe California in 1905 if you still think there is not enough land?

[The Rock Doctor]

The fact that certain areas of North America historically have a certain population does not mean that they can not actually support a larger population.  The Yukon and the northern parts of the western Canadian provinces can support a larger population - they just don't because historical population migration has only happened in the past few decades.  They are quite undeveloped.

The terrain of Scandinavia is probably a good comparison for the historical EK turf, and I think a population of a couple million can be supported there if there's been sufficient time to generate it.  In this sim, there can be that time.

But, EK can go away if we assume Mesoamerica is somehow responsible for the IC conflict.  They're as good a rival for GC in the region as anybody else.

[Ithekro]

Foxy:  Are you going to keep Siam in play? 

Pheonix:  Should we keep the modifications to Indochina in relations to Siam and China?

I agree with Rocky:  I didn't really want Rohan sprialling out everywhere at the start.  California was made to be a place to protect aside from the Haven.  Also a place to sell used warships.  We don't need California, but it was one of those places to be different and yet the same I suppose.

Any other thoughs on Califoria?  If Rohan absorbed it (in story) there needed to be a reason for it...default loans (not my style), Swiss attempt to overthrow the government with a puppet Austrian?  Or alternately, the Republic of California votes to join Rohan as a state under a Austian governor? (heh...I live in California by the way).

[P3D]

Norway that time had ~2 million population. And the Gulf current is IMO less restricted than the Alaskan current, with IMO higher warming effect.

California? I think it had to be some prolonged parliamentary scandal that disillusioned most of the Californians, nevermind that Rohad had lower taxes ...

My vision of North America. Alaska is fivided between Rohan and NS - good place for conflict when the gold is discovered along the Yukon  :P

The big white blob in the center of the continent is unclaimed/disputed tribal areas, with Haven somewhere there - between the Rockies and the colonized western region.

[Ithekro]

So like this..more or less.



The Haven would be for those that don't want to join Rohan but also don't want to fight the Europeans anymore. (Nurn and Near Harad would be classified as freed servants of the enemy back in the Fourth Age)  The area you are talking about in the middle...that would be the whole (or nearly the whole) Sioux Nation along with the Cree, Ojibwe, Iowa, Kickapoo, Omaha, Santee, and Chippewa Nations.   That is if the UK is only up to the Mississppi River and Rohan is only to the Missouri River until just at Pierre.  The Haven, in present day terms would be the Ute, Paiute, and Shoshone Nations.

If we have a strong Sioux (backed perhaps by Rohan) there is no way the Europeans are advancing across the Great Plains on anything but friendly terms.

[P3D]

Zulus take two? Well, Earl wanted a conflict...

Problem is that the Indian nations in the plains are not the same as those 500 years ago, when the European diseases wiped out the North American civilizations IRL.

[Ithekro]

I guess the real question is: are we satified with the geographical land/sea masses of this world?

Any other changes to the lands that isn't geopolitical?

Do we want Hawaii (actual chain of islands) or Numenor in its place?

Is the smallish continent in the South Pacific acceptable?

Do we need anything larger in the Atlantic Ocean anywhere?

(Does Antartica matter for our maps at all?  Probably not since exploration doesn't really get going until the 1920s and 1930 historically if I recall.)

[P3D]

Zeelandia should be enough as a South Pacific continent.

We still have the following possible player nations in America:
- CSA
- U.S.A.
- Mesoamerica.
- Inca/Peru at the expense of GC and U.S.A?

I'd guess the Americas are more or less ettled then?