Main Menu

NPC militaries

Started by Kaiser Kirk, November 11, 2023, 02:25:27 PM

Previous topic - Next topic

Kaiser Kirk

Snip was reticent about releasing the 'Tiers' each NPC nation belonged in.
However, that was at the very beginning, and the world may have a better idea of who has what.

Conceptually, NPC tend to the Japanese model of a highly regulated trade port or two but otherwise very isolationist.
...which is a storytelling bit so that we don't have to 'role play' the various NPCs.

The way NPC militaries are figured are based off the original PC's current average values.
Different NPCs were assigned different % of the PC average for their Land and then for their Naval strengths.

NPCs tend to be ranked based on
A) being next to an original player nation, and B)historical wealth/strength.

Each NPC has a very short summary under their write up.

Scouting : Scouting can find additional information.  "Role playing" does apply, as a player's scheme is evaluated.
I also use opposed dice roles.  I will use Desertfox's attempt to illustrate.  He sent an Aux "Fishing Boat" to investigate a Deccan holding.
The plan was to pretend and engine breakdown and let them tow it into a closed port to get a good look without alerting them.

The first part worked.  Foxy's initial ploy, the camouflaged vessel - that's enough for the scheme to work in most cases.
The dice then did not cooperate- wasn't great but wasn't a disaster.
However, the 'fishing boat' was brand new with a diesel-electric drive and lots of radio gear. Very unusual for an old fishing boat suffering engine problems, and
Which was very much noticed when the Deccans boarded to verify the 'broken engine'. That turned a poor dice role into a Bad outcome.
Since it was also officially not there, and too far to have been in radio contact...the crew was shot as spies, the vessel stripped and sank and the Deccans claim no knowledge
of any fishing boat....and increased their naval activity.


What is known :
The Golden Horde has the strongest land force, superior to any of the PCs. They have weak navy.
Player nations such as Japan, the Aztecs, China were all top end NPCs originally.
The Maya were the next notch down.
The Inca below that.





      Naval Tonnage   Aux Tonnage      Land Units   Air Units   Deployment Units   Fort Points
   Original PC Numbers:    7026679   972554      1077   194   443   384
   Original PC Averages :   1171113   162092      180   32   74   64

Did they beat the drum slowly,
Did they play the fife lowly,
Did they sound the death march, as they lowered you down,
Did the band play the last post and chorus,
Did the pipes play the flowers of the forest

Kaiser Kirk

#1
Snip's Tiers vs. Player desires for "what do the NPCs have ?"

As I recall, Snip didn't even want to divulge what tier various NPCs fell in until a player declared intentions,
and THEN the trouble of generating a military would be done.
(see below table for my blathering on how I try to do my role in this)

I think this presentation meets 'following the vision' 
while also not divulging specifics that might then have to be redone.

It presents a summary of relative standings in both Naval (all Military + Aux/4 tonnage) and Other Military (Land+Air+DP+Fort).
Some of these rankings are very very close, with Azteca and Byzantine being a mere 1 point separate in 'Other Military'.
Meanwhile the Norse have 99.3% of the tonnage Wilno has...

As some Nations - Rome, Japan - are behind, they are probably stronger than listed. Indeed, Snip builds enough Other Military
that he will certainly take the #2 'Other Military' spot behind the Horde when he catches up.
Likewise Japan will likely change rankings a little.


Rankings of Nations by BP cost   Naval Assets   Other Military
Parthian Empire   1   2
Byzantine Empire   2   9
Wilno   3   4
Northern Kingdom   4   5
Iberian Kingdom   5   8
Roman Empire   6   3
Japanese Empire   7   16
Azteca Dominon   8   10
China   9   6
Rajasthan   10   7
Five Nations (Iroquois)   11   14
Deccan Sultanates   12   13
Peoples Republic of Maya   13   11
Kingdom of Laksmanavati   14   12
Kingdom of Thailand   15   17
Unified Berber States   16   15
4th Incan Empire   17   18
The Golden Horde   18   1



I generally view this N7 as Snip's vision and ruleset.  I had input, but he had the final say.
When I agreed to play, I signed up for that vision and ruleset- not mine.
I presume that applies to the others.

So when the Mod duties came to me, I try to adhere to that vision and ruleset.
I know I've veered wildly off course in a couple areas, without even realizing it,
but as a general rule I try to continue on.

New rules implemented are thereby by a sort of guided consensus that is meant to fit the prior vision while meeting playerbase needs.

Why this blathering ?
Did they beat the drum slowly,
Did they play the fife lowly,
Did they sound the death march, as they lowered you down,
Did the band play the last post and chorus,
Did the pipes play the flowers of the forest

Kaiser Kirk

#2
I noticed that Ethiopia got left off the list.
It should be ranked 12 and 14,
So I rectified that.

Ranked by 'Other Military' :


Rankings of Nations by BP cost   Naval Assets   Other Military
The Golden Horde   19   1
Parthian Empire   1   2
Roman Empire   6   3
Wilno   3   4
Northern Kingdom   4   5
China   9   6
Rajasthan   10   7
Iberian Kingdom   5   8
Byzantine Empire   2   9
Azteca Dominon   8   10
Peoples Republic of Maya   13   11
Kingdom of Ethiopia   14   12
Deccan Sultanates   12   13
Five Nations (Iroquois)   11   14
Kingdom of Thailand   16   15
Japanese Empire   7   16
Kingdom of Laksmanavati   15   17
Unified Berber States   17   18
4th Incan Empire   18   19


Ranked by Total Naval


Parthian Empire   12
Byzantine Empire   2   9
Wilno   3   4
Northern Kingdom   4   5
Iberian Kingdom   5   8
Roman Empire   6   3
Japanese Empire   7   16
Azteca Dominon   8   10
China   9   6
Rajasthan   10   7
Five Nations (Iroquois)   11   14
Deccan Sultanates   12   13
Peoples Republic of Maya   13   11
Kingdom of Ethiopia   14   12
Kingdom of Laksmanavati   15   17
Kingdom of Thailand   16   15
Unified Berber States   17   18
4th Incan Empire   18   19
The Golden Horde   19   1

Did they beat the drum slowly,
Did they play the fife lowly,
Did they sound the death march, as they lowered you down,
Did the band play the last post and chorus,
Did the pipes play the flowers of the forest

The Rock Doctor

I'm kind of surprised I'm #4 for non-naval, would've thought I'd be a couple rungs lower.

Kaiser Kirk

The territory counts include militaries.
Among players you are #3 in Land Units, #6 in Air Units, #2 in Deployment and #2 in Fort,
So the Horde taking 1st spot overall bumps you down to #4/7/3/3,
but  overall Wilno is quite strong.
Ironically, her army is sandwiched between #1 and #2 and her air force is dwarfed by at least Rome's.
The limitation of Deployment points means her offensive power is more than Rome's.
Only Parthia..barely...has more Deployment points. 
Did they beat the drum slowly,
Did they play the fife lowly,
Did they sound the death march, as they lowered you down,
Did the band play the last post and chorus,
Did the pipes play the flowers of the forest

The Rock Doctor

Airpower is definitely a point to improve on, it's just hard to spend money on "points" when I could instead invest them in glorious, specifically-designed and drawn ships.

TacCovert4

In my case it doesn't help that I'm sandwiched between an aggressive NPC and great powers.  So I have a need to build up a navy.  And an air force.  My Army is actually probably my weakest point, but when you note that my most threatened avenues have some of the most dense fortifications on earth.......it balances out.
His Most Honorable Majesty,  Ali the 8th, Sultan of All Aztecs,  Eagle of the Sun, Jaguar of the Sun, Snake of the Sun, Seal of the Sun, Whale of the Sun, Defender of the Faith, Keeper of the Teachings of Allah most gracious and merciful.

Kaiser Kirk

On Points
I keep meaning to set aside a set amount of BP to buy LP/AP/DP/FP for Parthia...and I keep stealing
from that fund to build more ships, because...I never have enough BP for my ships...  Even now
there's A Battleship, Coast Battleship,  Armored Cruiser,  Carrier,  Light Carrier,  and Cruiser designs that I'd like to lay down. If I only had another... 24 or so BP, I could afford that. Then there's the extra subs, destroyers, MTBs, Aux, docks....never seem to have enough BP..
Perhaps if I ran a storyline where Rajasthan voluntarily became part of Parthia?  That would help alot.... the player council may not accede to it.

Points were a way to extremely simplify the non-naval aspects and keep the focus naval,
while minimizing book keeping and demands on player time.

Past sims indulging in the other direction have strongly suggested that requiring/encouraging armor and plane designs for evaluation led to fierce arguments.

On relative strengths
The Aztec, China and Japan were among the strongest NPCs, and were rolled into Playerdom...which should
give an idea of the strength of the NPCs. Therefore they had more 'catchup' to do, but were closer to the territories to start. The Aztec were immediately engaged in a war,  Japan tangled in a couple, so setbacks and other priorities in development

As I recall the Aztec have the most 'fort points' of us all.

One measure of strength I think is truly not heavily considered is deployment points.
You need them to support attacking, but not defending armies.
One may have 1000 armies, but if you only have 10 deployment points,
then you can only attack with 10 armies and risk loosing the Deployment points with them....though supply columns tend to be lost last. 

Which means while the Romans and Mayans are on both sides, both lack the ability to invade the Aztec homeland.
Territories are a different matter.
This happens to be why Parthia can send a considerable chunk of it's army overseas, as the Horde can only attack with so many...and faces both the forces stationed in Khorasan and the Forts there,

One unresolved issue is how logistics work.
I've made a couple statements that it basically governs how deep and how far your forces can conquer.
For something like Costa Rica, a little irrelevant, but should be limiting for larger territories.
I suppose that should get clarified.
I'll add it to the to do list.
Did they beat the drum slowly,
Did they play the fife lowly,
Did they sound the death march, as they lowered you down,
Did the band play the last post and chorus,
Did the pipes play the flowers of the forest

Jefgte

QuoteOne measure of strength I think is truly not heavily considered is deployment points.
You need them to support attacking, but not defending armies.
One may have 1000 armies, but if you only have 10 deployment points,
then you can only attack with 10 armies and risk loosing the Deployment points with them....though supply columns tend to be lost last.

The secret decision taken in 1928 to invade Laksmanavati in 1931 allowed Byzantium to send thousands of soldiers (5,000 per rotation), tons of equipment, fuel, ammunition, etc. by transport.

However, I will increase my deployment points.
"You French are fighting for money, while we English are fighting for honor!"
"Everyone is fighting for what they miss. "
Surcouf

The Rock Doctor

Three years is a long time to keep something like that secret.

TacCovert4

In fairness a roll could be made every HY leading up, to see how much of an inkling they get of Byzantine plans.  I'm sure the Byzantines are going to take every effort, but 5,000 troops, even moved over a period of months, isn't going to be unnoticeable, especially out in those regions towards Oceana that aren't heavily populated.
His Most Honorable Majesty,  Ali the 8th, Sultan of All Aztecs,  Eagle of the Sun, Jaguar of the Sun, Snake of the Sun, Seal of the Sun, Whale of the Sun, Defender of the Faith, Keeper of the Teachings of Allah most gracious and merciful.

TacCovert4

Of course, all this talk of war in what had been the most peaceful spot on the planet.....is going to make me have to do the Typical Aztec thing with our Zealand colony.....aka make it a fortress and an unsinkable aircraft carrier.
His Most Honorable Majesty,  Ali the 8th, Sultan of All Aztecs,  Eagle of the Sun, Jaguar of the Sun, Snake of the Sun, Seal of the Sun, Whale of the Sun, Defender of the Faith, Keeper of the Teachings of Allah most gracious and merciful.

Jefgte

#12
QuoteThree years is a long time to keep something like that secret.

Position of the Byzantine government.

"Byzantium strengthens the protection of its insufficiently protected colonies against the Parthians and the Japanese.
The bases of Diego Suarez and Darwin require significant defensive contributions...Salvador too"
"You French are fighting for money, while we English are fighting for honor!"
"Everyone is fighting for what they miss. "
Surcouf

Kaiser Kirk

Quote from: The Rock Doctor on November 24, 2023, 07:06:25 PM
Three years is a long time to keep something like that secret.

The increased traffic would be obvious to those who are looking. Which includes Parthia who maintains ships and planes monitoring the Gulf of Aden and the sea routes across the Indian Ocean. 

Parthia would be quite interested in where they are going, and a build up near Phenix Yehud /New Jeruselum/N. New Zealand would be viewed with some alarm. 

Parthia would presumably share this information with powers deemed friendly in an effort to learn what insights they have.
That would include the Aztecs.

The Laksmanavati write up says :
Quote
Friendly Power(s) : Parthia, Byzantine, China, Thailand, Ethiopia, Rome
Hostile Powers(s) : Rajasthan, Deccan Sultanates

While the Rajasthani write up says:
Quote
Traditional Friendly Power(s) : Byzantium, Thailand, China.
Traditional Competing Powers(s) : Parthia, Deccan, Laksmanavati

So Parthia would be likely to discuss these matters with Laksmanavati, but not likely to do so with Rajasthan...or Japan or Iberia.
Did they beat the drum slowly,
Did they play the fife lowly,
Did they sound the death march, as they lowered you down,
Did the band play the last post and chorus,
Did the pipes play the flowers of the forest

The Rock Doctor

Having received yearly production values from Kirk, what if I simply build one maximum-sized unit each year...?