Parthian Ships 1928 +

[Kaiser Kirk]

I've been assuming we need to research new guns, not just new mountings, so we might need to pin down expectations there.

Excellent question !

So far it hasn't come up.
I've been developing smaller guns for AA roles, so just tag them with AA in gun research as a tracking system.

I was presuming that
"Guns: Caliber - Shell diameter/barrel length" governed the type of things you researched new Guns for.
"type of gun" drop-down governed the type of things you researched new mounts for.
The obvious exception being going from muzzle loading to breech or quick fire...

The question is....IS that doable?
AND Is that how we want to handle it ??

First step..is it doable.
Looking at NavWeaps I was able to find several examples that indicate it is.

Looking at http://www.navweaps.com/Weapons/WNUS_3-50_mk10-22.php with it's 1910 date of development, I doubt it was designed as an AA gun at that time.
So the mounting came after.

This http://www.navweaps.com/Weapons/WNBR_3-40_mk1.php was designed in 1893, provided with HA mounts in WW1, and note 1b is they made a HA/LA mount for it.
"^Some PI mountings were modified to allow gunlayer firing, being redesignated as HA/LA IX* for Mark IA and IIA guns while HA/LA IX** were for Mark V and AV guns."

This http://www.navweaps.com/Weapons/WNBR_4-45_mk5.php
"The Mark V was first introduced as a low angle weapon on HMS Arethusa in 1914 and it was later chosen for use as an AAA gun near the end of World War I."
and looking at mountings, it was later provided in a twin HA/LA mount.
   Mark V Guns - Open Single Mounts
   Arethusa [1914] (6), Caroline (8), Calliope (8) and Cambrian (8): PX Mark I
   "V" (4) and "W" (4) Destroyers: LA CP Mark II
   Sloops and patrol boats of the 1920s: LA CP Mark II
   Hood (4), Emerald (3), Kent (4) and London (4): HA Mark III or Mark III* or Mark III** 4a
   Dorsetshire (4), York (4), Leander (4), Modified Leander (4), Arethusa [1935] (4): HA Mark IV 4a
   Destroyers "O" (5) and "P" (4 or 5): HA Mark III or HA Mark IV 4a
Mark XV Guns - Twin Mount 5a
   Resolution (1): HA/LA BD Mark XVII
   Repulse (2): HA/LA BD Mark XVIII

SO....is that how we want to do it ?

[quote ]
I'm coming around to visualizing this ship as an age-of-sail frigate with double hangers on top.
[/quote]

That's not it - my concept is the hangers are long smoothwalled areas, and the casements can be worked into the walls of the hangers.
So there's a clear area of hull below, which means the casements should be high and dry with lovely fields of fire.

[The Rock Doctor]

I guess my frame of reference is that Springsharp lists DP along with BL, QF and AA guns rather than as a type of mounting like a deck mount.

I don't mind the faster, cheaper option of new mounts, I just need the certainty before 1/29 rolls around.

[Kaiser Kirk]

Good point on the night ops issues.  I've recognized it too, which is why all of my carriers come with full-up Night Fighting equipment.  The big 25t Capital Ship setups.  Not as a way to actually fight at night, but as a way to avoid fights at night if possible.  Plus, while my newest DDs will be NF beasts, there's a strong chance that any escort for the carriers in a war situation will wind up being second-line destroyers with my fleet DDs out doing their night attack role.  So having the carriers able to see and try to get away from threats quickly will be important.

I expect my 'sentry frigates' will need more numbers to serve as pickets for my carriers.

One thing that finally shows up in Seekrieg V is 'haze' and visibility limitations. There are daylight times where you just can't see far, and recon aircraft won't work well, not to mention bad weather grounds them. All of which may do nothing to a cruiser or even destroyer. So, all those climatic conditions, plus the 50% of the time it's night....

But its' the ' can't catch them all' aspect.  Especially in bad weather or haze or night.
Expected visibility in the North Sea was what...12000m ? Starshell is about 12km. A The Hulesmeyer was only good out to about 10km, and only gives "something that direction" - very crude, but good for avoiding collisions in night/poor visibility formations/steaming. Even when radar comes out, not reliable in the early years.

So, the operational concern is that my carrier will be tooling along at it's cruise speed because fuel is a logistical limiter, and a cruiser pops out of the haze or night 12km off my port bow and opens fire.  I have to come about and get up to speed as the range falls, then run for it..... that's not a winner.
The alternative is to expect the carrier to run at nearly full speed all night, which collapses the range dramatically and means it can spend a couple days at sea at a time...max.
So the carrier will usually be at cruise speed. While a raider might be moving faster to start, particularly if the 'get the drop' , or as a smaller ship (cruiser/DD) can accelerate faster.

ed : Also thinking I may use a dispersed squadron, which then turns and runs towards any contact - but countering that means if a carrier 'runs for it' it may just  run into a different cruiser, and have no clean escape route.

I suppose with at-sea refueling, you could expect a positive train of oilers to refuel it....which would then make great alternative targets for raiders. If the IJN had it's subs focused on tankers instead of warships...and I think would stretch the handwaved fleet train assets. IRL, the USN had a massive fleet train for just that purpose, but also set up forward bases and produced the majority of the worlds oil....which actually I think Parthia does....

[TacCovert4]

Obviously none of us have developed doctrine yet.  But I'm thinking that the RAN will be escorting a carrier with a single cruiser and a DD Division for the 'Fleet Strike' Carriers.....and probably as part of a Cruiser force for the 'Light Fleet' Carrier types.

[Kaiser Kirk]

Actually I'm thinking the doctrine will be an ever changing target...

I actually like the idea of this beast with a DP outfit better,
between the deck, TDS and heavy AA ability, tough out.

[Kaiser Kirk]

Looking at my 1929 turn,
I can lay down a 4th "Bazdari" fighter carrier - giving 1 per main fleet,
or I can start moving towards a larger vessel with a flying off deck to allow a faster rate of fighter launch.

With low-wing loading biplanes and the expectation that sprint speed is not required, the same speed as the Bazdaris is used.
I happily aknowledge that may be an issue later, the next series of carriers will be faster.

This does have that "Three-tier" broadside outlined earlier.
This is a pre-DP style loadout.

I'm tickled by it, and figure I should field at least one vessel with it.
Flight Deck ------Edge 90mm AA  All Air
Upper Hanger --Case 90mm AA  vs. Torpedo Bombers
Lower Hanger -- Case 165mm QF vs. DDs.

I expect to abandon the "H" twin control tower arrangement.
While the Brits originally planned on it, testing found it was more turbulent.
The Parthians have been rushing to get ships in the water, so I've gone forward with that mistake.

but ..I'm just not sure if as a storyline thing I should refurbish my experimental carrier.
Or just assume wind tunnel was sufficient. Or perhaps "acquired" data from another nation who may not know it's been "acquired"

Hawk, Parthian Hawk Flight Deck Carrier laid down 1929

Displacement:
   14,750 t light; 15,435 t standard; 17,489 t normal; 19,133 t full load

Dimensions: Length (overall / waterline) x beam x draught (normal/deep)
   (570.87 ft / 564.30 ft) x 75.46 ft x (27.33 / 29.31 ft)
   (174.00 m / 172.00 m) x 23.00 m  x (8.33 / 8.93 m)

Armament:
      12 - 6.50" / 165 mm 43.0 cal guns - 143.30lbs / 65.00kg shells, 204 per gun
     Quick firing guns in casemate mounts, 1929 Model
     12 x Single mounts on sides, evenly spread
      12 hull mounts in lower casemates- Limited use in heavy seas
      12 - 3.54" / 90.0 mm 54.0 cal guns - 24.25lbs / 11.00kg shells, 400 per gun
     Anti-air guns in casemate mounts, 1929 Model
     12 x Single mounts on side ends, evenly spread
      12 hull mounts in casemates- Limited use in heavy seas
      12 - 3.54" / 90.0 mm 54.0 cal guns - 24.25lbs / 11.00kg shells, 400 per gun
     Anti-air guns in deck and hoist mounts, 1929 Model
     12 x Single mounts on sides, evenly spread
      36 - 0.59" / 15.0 mm 90.0 cal guns - 0.11lbs / 0.05kg shells, 5,000 per gun
     Machine guns in deck mounts, 1929 Model
     10 x Twin mounts on sides, evenly spread
     4 x Quad mounts on side ends, evenly spread
      Weight of broadside 2,306 lbs / 1,046 kg

Armour:
   - Belts:      Width (max)   Length (avg)      Height (avg)
   Main:   1.97" / 50 mm   366.80 ft / 111.80 m   9.84 ft / 3.00 m
   Ends:   Unarmoured
     Main Belt covers 100 % of normal length
     Main belt does not fully cover magazines and engineering spaces

   - Torpedo Bulkhead - Additional damage containing bulkheads:
      1.50" / 38 mm   366.80 ft / 111.80 m   31.82 ft / 9.70 m
   Beam between torpedo bulkheads 49.87 ft / 15.20 m

   - Hull void:
      0.00" / 0 mm     0.00 ft / 0.00 m   0.00 ft / 0.00 m

   - Gun armour:   Face (max)   Other gunhouse (avg)   Barbette/hoist (max)
   Main:   1.97" / 50 mm   1.57" / 40 mm      1.57" / 40 mm
   2nd:   0.31" / 8 mm   0.31" / 8 mm      0.31" / 8 mm
   3rd:   0.31" / 8 mm   0.31" / 8 mm      0.31" / 8 mm
   4th:   0.31" / 8 mm         -               -

   - Armoured deck - single deck:
   For and Aft decks: 1.57" / 40 mm
   Forecastle: 1.57" / 40 mm  Quarter deck: 1.57" / 40 mm

   - Conning towers: Forward 2.95" / 75 mm, Aft 0.00" / 0 mm

Machinery:
   Oil fired boilers, steam turbines,
   Geared drive, 4 shafts, 55,461 shp / 41,374 Kw = 26.00 kts
   Range 9,860nm at 16.00 kts
   Bunker at max displacement = 3,698 tons

Complement:
   759 - 988

Cost:
   £3.518 million / $14.071 million

Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
   Armament: 425 tons, 2.4 %
      - Guns: 425 tons, 2.4 %
   Armour: 1,974 tons, 11.3 %
      - Belts: 302 tons, 1.7 %
      - Torpedo bulkhead: 646 tons, 3.7 %
      - Armament: 130 tons, 0.7 %
      - Armour Deck: 853 tons, 4.9 %
      - Conning Tower: 43 tons, 0.2 %
   Machinery: 1,703 tons, 9.7 %
   Hull, fittings & equipment: 6,130 tons, 35.0 %
   Fuel, ammunition & stores: 2,739 tons, 15.7 %
   Miscellaneous weights: 4,518 tons, 25.8 %
      - Hull below water: 2,315 tons
      - Hull void weights: 50 tons
      - Hull above water: 2,020 tons
      - On freeboard deck: 5 tons
      - Above deck: 128 tons

Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
   Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
     42,094 lbs / 19,093 Kg = 307.1 x 6.5 " / 165 mm shells or 5.7 torpedoes
   Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1.29
   Metacentric height 5.2 ft / 1.6 m
   Roll period: 14.0 seconds
   Steadiness   - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 70 %
         - Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0.22
   Seaboat quality  (Average = 1.00): 2.00

Hull form characteristics:
   Hull has low forecastle,
     a ram bow and a cruiser stern
   Block coefficient (normal/deep): 0.526 / 0.537
   Length to Beam Ratio: 7.48 : 1
   'Natural speed' for length: 23.76 kts
   Power going to wave formation at top speed: 52 %
   Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 35
   Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): 13.00 degrees
   Stern overhang: -6.56 ft / -2.00 m
   Freeboard (% = length of deck as a percentage of waterline length):
            Fore end,    Aft end
      - Forecastle:   20.00 %,  22.97 ft / 7.00 m,  22.97 ft / 7.00 m
      - Forward deck:   30.00 %,  39.37 ft / 12.00 m,  39.37 ft / 12.00 m
      - Aft deck:   35.00 %,  39.37 ft / 12.00 m,  39.37 ft / 12.00 m
      - Quarter deck:   15.00 %,  39.37 ft / 12.00 m,  39.37 ft / 12.00 m
      - Average freeboard:      36.09 ft / 11.00 m
   Ship tends to be wet forward

Ship space, strength and comments:
   Space   - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 102.0 %
      - Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 287.1 %
   Waterplane Area: 29,059 Square feet or 2,700 Square metres
   Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 158 %
   Structure weight / hull surface area: 105 lbs/sq ft or 515 Kg/sq metre
   Hull strength (Relative):
      - Cross-sectional: 0.81
      - Longitudinal: 6.13
      - Overall: 1.00
   Adequate machinery, storage, compartmentation space
   Excellent accommodation and workspace room
   Ship has slow, easy roll, a good, steady gun platform
   Excellent seaboat, comfortable, can fire her guns in the heaviest weather

Intended as an evolution of the Bazdari fighter carrier.

This discards the standard Parthian "H" Towers in favor of one set to oneside of the flight deck.

A flying off deck is adopted, allowing a higher 'surge' of fighters.

The ship is still...slow...by N7 international standards as it's meant to shadow a battleline doing at most 26 knots. With the low wing loading of pre-metal pre-monoplane planes this is not an issue.

The ship has tiered AA defences, able to engage high altitude bombers, dive bombers, and especially torpedo bombers.
and a battery of heavy 165mm is mounted in case of surface raiders.

Flight Deck ------Edge 90mm AA  All Air
Upper Hanger --Case 90mm AA  vs. Torpedo Bombers
Lower Hanger -- Case 165mm QF vs. DDs.

The vessel is 'sized' for 48 planes
allowing 3x 16 to be carried.
This woud be 2x Fighter, 1 x Scout/Torpedo

Concerns over reliability mean the Parthians expect this to be 3 groups of 12 in practice.

A single "mail plane" is carried, with a removable set of seats allowing
either critical cargo or passengers.

Flight Calculations
Single Hanger : wp/65
Dual Hanger : wp/55

80 tons / plane

9m FD = 1 hanger
12m FD = 2 hangers
(note - the actual levels are higher, this is to address the structural steel)
-5m forecastle = Flying off deck.

2709 / 55 = 49.05
49 * 80 = 3920
HAW = 1960
HBW = 1960

Misc Weight
Reserve :
50t

AD
43t-  Fire Control 1918
25t-  Hulesmeyer
25t- Searchlights (NF)
25t-  LR Radio
10t-  SR Radio - Air Command
  0t-  SR Radio

OD
  5t  - Paravanes

HAW
1960 - Airgroup (24)
30t - 2x Additional Ventilation
30t - 2x Additional Fire Suppresion.

HBW
15t - Additional Fire Suppression
15t - Additional pumps
1960 - Airgroup (24)
100t - additional fuel in doublewall tanks
30t - additional  munitions
180t - Torpedo Nets.
30t - Auxiliary Diesel Generator

Decks :
7.00  1st Hanger Deck - 90mm, flying off deck)
4.50   Battery Deck - 165mm
2.00   Armored Deck, Top TDS
-0.50  2nd Deck, lower edge of fore/aft PD.
          -1.0 Bottom Belt
-3.00  1st Deck
-6.50  Engineering
-7.52  Double Bottom
-8.6  Keel

[TacCovert4]

Could adopt it from the Aztec.  We went with a small single island to save cost and topweight.

[Kaiser Kirk]

Could adopt it from the Aztec.  We went with a small single island to save cost and topweight.

I think everyone is going with Single-island superstructures, and while I'm sure there's a
faction of Parthians who go "Hah, we're the only one that came up with the superior way"
there's probably those that are saying "Um, yeah, but what if everyone else is doing it the other for a good reason ?"

Perhaps 1929.0 I'll refurbish the experimental,
then I can lay this down in 1929.5 with the brand new guns finishing in 1929.0.
Or maybe just do a 4th Bazdari in 1929.0.

[Kaiser Kirk]

While I like the Sibari class gunboats, I really wouldn't mind spending less on a secondary role.
Looking up gunboats for the Iberians, I came back to this design, which is a downsized version of the Sibari. 58% the size/cost.
Still very nasty foe for a marauding destroyer or many of the lighter cruisers out there.
Very much able to withdraw to shallows.

I really considered an armored box over magazines and machinery,
but the ends of the vessel wind up very exposed to QF.

This way, the armor deck + belt should cover the middle 50%, and the ends are protected by protective decks, all splinter-proof.

Gunboat, Parthian Coastal Gunboat laid down 1929

Displacement:
   1,750 t light; 1,872 t standard; 1,940 t normal; 1,994 t full load

Dimensions: Length (overall / waterline) x beam x draught (normal/deep)
   (244.16 ft / 239.50 ft) x 45.93 ft x (9.84 / 10.07 ft)
   (74.42 m / 73.00 m) x 14.00 m  x (3.00 / 3.07 m)

Armament:
      3 - 6.50" / 165 mm 43.0 cal guns - 133.89lbs / 60.73kg shells, 240 per gun
     Quick firing guns in deck and hoist mounts, 1929 Model
     3 x Single mounts on centreline ends, majority aft
      1 raised mount aft - superfiring
      1 - 6.42" / 163 mm 21.0 cal gun - 118.76lbs / 53.87kg shells, 200 per gun
     Quick firing gun in deck and hoist mount, 1929 Model
     1 x Single mount on centreline, forward deck centre
      1 raised mount
      8 - 1.46" / 37.0 mm 90.0 cal guns - 1.79lbs / 0.81kg shells, 1,000 per gun
     Anti-air guns in deck and hoist mounts, 1929 Model
     2 x 2-gun mounts on sides amidships
      2 raised mounts
     2 x 2-gun mounts on centreline ends, evenly spread
      2 double raised mounts
      12 - 0.91" / 23.0 mm 90.0 cal guns - 0.44lbs / 0.20kg shells, 3,000 per gun
     Machine guns in deck mounts, 1929 Model
     2 x Single mounts layout not set
     4 x Twin mounts on side ends, evenly spread
      4 double raised mounts
      Weight of broadside 540 lbs / 245 kg

Armour:
   - Belts:      Width (max)   Length (avg)      Height (avg)
   Main:   2.95" / 75 mm   119.75 ft / 36.50 m   11.48 ft / 3.50 m
   Ends:   Unarmoured
     Main Belt covers 77 % of normal length

   - Hull void:
      0.00" / 0 mm     0.00 ft / 0.00 m   0.00 ft / 0.00 m

   - Gun armour:   Face (max)   Other gunhouse (avg)   Barbette/hoist (max)
   Main:   2.95" / 75 mm   1.57" / 40 mm      1.57" / 40 mm
   2nd:   2.95" / 75 mm   1.57" / 40 mm      1.57" / 40 mm
   3rd:   0.31" / 8 mm         -               -
   4th:   0.31" / 8 mm         -               -

   - Armoured deck - single deck:
   For and Aft decks: 1.57" / 40 mm
   Forecastle: 1.57" / 40 mm  Quarter deck: 1.57" / 40 mm

   - Conning towers: Forward 3.94" / 100 mm, Aft 0.00" / 0 mm

Machinery:
   Diesel Internal combustion generators,
   Electric motors, 2 shafts, 5,179 shp / 3,864 Kw = 18.00 kts
   Range 3,000nm at 10.00 kts
   Bunker at max displacement = 122 tons

Complement:
   145 - 189

Cost:
   £0.519 million / $2.076 million

Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
   Armament: 130 tons, 6.7 %
      - Guns: 130 tons, 6.7 %
   Armour: 514 tons, 26.5 %
      - Belts: 198 tons, 10.2 %
      - Armament: 61 tons, 3.1 %
      - Armour Deck: 242 tons, 12.5 %
      - Conning Tower: 13 tons, 0.7 %
   Machinery: 159 tons, 8.2 %
   Hull, fittings & equipment: 549 tons, 28.3 %
   Fuel, ammunition & stores: 190 tons, 9.8 %
   Miscellaneous weights: 397 tons, 20.5 %
      - Hull below water: 161 tons
      - Hull void weights: 35 tons
      - Hull above water: 68 tons
      - On freeboard deck: 50 tons
      - Above deck: 83 tons

Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
   Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
     3,247 lbs / 1,473 Kg = 23.7 x 6.5 " / 165 mm shells or 1.4 torpedoes
   Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1.26
   Metacentric height 2.4 ft / 0.7 m
   Roll period: 12.5 seconds
   Steadiness   - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 70 %
         - Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0.43
   Seaboat quality  (Average = 1.00): 1.21

Hull form characteristics:
   Hull has a flush deck,
     a ram bow and a cruiser stern
   Block coefficient (normal/deep): 0.627 / 0.630
   Length to Beam Ratio: 5.21 : 1
   'Natural speed' for length: 15.48 kts
   Power going to wave formation at top speed: 59 %
   Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 58
   Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): 15.00 degrees
   Stern overhang: -3.28 ft / -1.00 m
   Freeboard (% = length of deck as a percentage of waterline length):
            Fore end,    Aft end
      - Forecastle:   25.00 %,  17.39 ft / 5.30 m,  14.93 ft / 4.55 m
      - Forward deck:   25.00 %,  14.93 ft / 4.55 m,  12.47 ft / 3.80 m
      - Aft deck:   25.00 %,  12.47 ft / 3.80 m,  12.47 ft / 3.80 m
      - Quarter deck:   25.00 %,  12.47 ft / 3.80 m,  12.47 ft / 3.80 m
      - Average freeboard:      13.64 ft / 4.16 m

Ship space, strength and comments:
   Space   - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 64.8 %
      - Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 141.8 %
   Waterplane Area: 8,250 Square feet or 766 Square metres
   Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 116 %
   Structure weight / hull surface area: 54 lbs/sq ft or 266 Kg/sq metre
   Hull strength (Relative):
      - Cross-sectional: 0.66
      - Longitudinal: 2.34
      - Overall: 0.75
   Caution: Hull subject to strain in open-sea
   Excellent machinery, storage, compartmentation space
   Excellent accommodation and workspace room
   Ship has slow, easy roll, a good, steady gun platform
   Good seaboat, rides out heavy weather easily

Warning: Beam between bulkheads too wide


Guns :
165mm are primary direct fire.
163mm HOW are bombardment or ASW
37mm are primary AA sited for 6 Fore/aft/beam
Paired GAST 23mm are anti-strafing.

Borrowed from submarines are 4 bow tubes
firing 21" torpedoes


Armor :
Armored Deck at 1.3m caps Belt
Belt extends from 1.3m to -1.3m
Bow and Stern are protective decks.

Strong consideration was given to a 135mm box over magazines and machinery.


TDS :
The ship has no TDS,
relying on it's small size, high manueverability via electric drive, and really shallow draft.
...really shallow.
The Standard torpedo settings of 11ft will go under the ship. Shallower torpedo settings risk breaching a wave trough in even light seas.



Engines:
Diesel electric will allow full speed forward and reverse, making a more difficult target....but also allowing navigation up streams far easier.

159 x 0.3 = 47.7 = 48
159 x 0.25 = 39.75 = 40

Range : +50% = 4500 , enough to go between two bases, and return if the base is gone.

Reserve : 35t

AD :
13t FC
25t NF - Aft Con searchlight tower, etc.
0t SR Radio
10t SR Radio for Spotting
25t Hulesmeyer
10t Squadron Plot Room

OD
5t paravanes
20t - Scout Floatplane in "Q"
5t - Gunpowder catapult
2t "Y" DC throwers
8t  DC
10t - Mine rails


HAW
4t -    CO2 Compressor AC
64t-   Marines

HBW

24t - 4 bow torpedo tubes,  4 torpedoes 21" x 3t
15t - Enhanced Hydrophone
10t - Sonar
40t - Turbogenerators
46t - Diesel Engines
10t - Batteries



Decks
3.8  Weather Deck
1.3  Main Deck, top of Armored box
-1.2 Deck/Engineering spaces
-2.3 Engineering  , bottom of Armored 8ox
-2.86 Bilges, Double bottom

[Kaiser Kirk]

This one I've actually posted an older version of.
Did not wind up having room in the build schedule.
I don't really in 1929 either.... may fit it in, may come in 1929.5 or 1930.
If 1930, you'll see a third version of it...

The Parthians currently want their cruisers to have scouting ability and some air cover.

There are 4 'shells' outside the battlefleet, allowing a wide net to locate the opposing force.
When faced with a heavy enemy force, the shells will collapse in to the next heavier shell, while support vectored in.
A truely overwhelming force would see scatter instead. 
So the Europa class of Byzantine BCs would see the cruisers fall back to the armored cruisers, but then the Stormbringers would vector in.
The Stormbringers can trade shots with any vessel out there, so
Or that's been the plan.

-Cruisers / Scout Cruiser
-Armored Cruisers
-Stormbringer faster BBs
-Sentry Cruisers
-Battleline

The Flight Deck Cruisers are meant to accompany the Armored Cruisers, offering Fighter cover for those and nearby shells. 
I'd like to have a vessel that can launch scouts way up front, and potentially intercept/disrupt/shoot down enemy recon.
Building carriers and flight deck cruisers for each cruiser squadron is prohibitive.
So I borrowed a concept from Tone for a seaplane cruiser.
Except instead of the fugly forward turrets, this has pairs in A/B and P/Q.

Pasbanendag "Watcher Bird", Parthian Seaplane Cruiser laid down 1929

Displacement:
   7,999 t light; 8,453 t standard; 9,690 t normal; 10,680 t full load

Dimensions: Length (overall / waterline) x beam x draught (normal/deep)
   (557.74 ft / 551.18 ft) x 61.22 ft x (21.85 / 23.45 ft)
   (170.00 m / 168.00 m) x 18.66 m  x (6.66 / 7.15 m)

Armament:
      8 - 7.09" / 180 mm 47.0 cal guns - 187.39lbs / 85.00kg shells, 165 per gun
     Breech loading guns in deck and hoist mounts, 1929 Model
     2 x 2-gun mounts on centreline, forward deck forward
      1 raised mount - superfiring
     2 x 2-gun mounts on centreline, forward deck aft
      1 raised mount - superfiring
      12 - 4.72" / 120 mm 43.0 cal guns - 51.50lbs / 23.36kg shells, 260 per gun
     Quick firing guns in deck and hoist mounts, 1929 Model
     6 x 2-gun mounts on sides, forward evenly spread
      2 raised mounts
      16 - 1.46" / 37.0 mm 70.0 cal guns - 1.72lbs / 0.78kg shells, 900 per gun
     Anti-air guns in deck and hoist mounts, 1929 Model
     2 x 4-gun mounts on sides amidships
      2 raised mounts
     2 x 4-gun mounts on centreline ends, evenly spread
      2 double raised mounts
      16 - 0.91" / 23.0 mm 90.0 cal guns - 0.44lbs / 0.20kg shells, 5,000 per gun
     Machine guns in deck mounts, 1929 Model
     8 x Twin mounts on sides, evenly spread
      8 double raised mounts
      Weight of broadside 2,152 lbs / 976 kg

Armour:
   - Belts:      Width (max)   Length (avg)      Height (avg)
   Main:   3.94" / 100 mm   358.27 ft / 109.20 m   12.57 ft / 3.83 m
   Ends:   Unarmoured
     Main Belt covers 100 % of normal length
     Main Belt inclined -15.00 degrees (positive = in)

   - Hull void:
      0.00" / 0 mm     0.00 ft / 0.00 m   0.00 ft / 0.00 m

   - Gun armour:   Face (max)   Other gunhouse (avg)   Barbette/hoist (max)
   Main:   5.12" / 130 mm   1.57" / 40 mm      3.94" / 100 mm
   2nd:   1.57" / 40 mm   0.98" / 25 mm      0.98" / 25 mm
   3rd:   0.59" / 15 mm         -               -
   4th:   0.12" / 3 mm         -               -

   - Armoured deck - single deck:
   For and Aft decks: 2.17" / 55 mm
   Forecastle: 1.57" / 40 mm  Quarter deck: 1.57" / 40 mm

   - Conning towers: Forward 4.92" / 125 mm, Aft 0.00" / 0 mm

Machinery:
   Oil fired boilers, steam turbines,
   Geared drive, 4 shafts, 65,356 shp / 48,756 Kw = 30.00 kts
   Range 8,466nm at 16.00 kts
   Bunker at max displacement = 2,227 tons

Complement:
   487 - 634

Cost:
   £3.080 million / $12.320 million

Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
   Armament: 586 tons, 6.0 %
      - Guns: 586 tons, 6.0 %
   Armour: 1,758 tons, 18.1 %
      - Belts: 730 tons, 7.5 %
      - Armament: 147 tons, 1.5 %
      - Armour Deck: 832 tons, 8.6 %
      - Conning Tower: 48 tons, 0.5 %
   Machinery: 2,007 tons, 20.7 %
   Hull, fittings & equipment: 3,082 tons, 31.8 %
   Fuel, ammunition & stores: 1,691 tons, 17.5 %
   Miscellaneous weights: 566 tons, 5.8 %
      - Hull below water: 73 tons
      - Hull void weights: 75 tons
      - Hull above water: 16 tons
      - On freeboard deck: 248 tons
      - Above deck: 154 tons

Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
   Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
     11,426 lbs / 5,183 Kg = 64.2 x 7.1 " / 180 mm shells or 1.7 torpedoes
   Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1.09
   Metacentric height 2.8 ft / 0.9 m
   Roll period: 15.3 seconds
   Steadiness   - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 70 %
         - Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0.67
   Seaboat quality  (Average = 1.00): 1.20

Hull form characteristics:
   Hull has rise forward of midbreak,
     a ram bow and a cruiser stern
   Block coefficient (normal/deep): 0.460 / 0.472
   Length to Beam Ratio: 9.00 : 1
   'Natural speed' for length: 23.48 kts
   Power going to wave formation at top speed: 55 %
   Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 58
   Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): 13.00 degrees
   Stern overhang: -6.56 ft / -2.00 m
   Freeboard (% = length of deck as a percentage of waterline length):
            Fore end,    Aft end
      - Forecastle:   20.00 %,  25.92 ft / 7.90 m,  23.29 ft / 7.10 m
      - Forward deck:   40.00 %,  23.29 ft / 7.10 m,  22.64 ft / 6.90 m
      - Aft deck:   25.00 %,  14.44 ft / 4.40 m,  14.44 ft / 4.40 m
      - Quarter deck:   15.00 %,  14.44 ft / 4.40 m,  3.28 ft / 1.00 m
      - Average freeboard:      18.99 ft / 5.79 m

Ship space, strength and comments:
   Space   - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 89.5 %
      - Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 167.1 %
   Waterplane Area: 21,704 Square feet or 2,016 Square metres
   Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 116 %
   Structure weight / hull surface area: 97 lbs/sq ft or 476 Kg/sq metre
   Hull strength (Relative):
      - Cross-sectional: 0.85
      - Longitudinal: 1.50
      - Overall: 0.90
   Caution: Hull subject to strain in open-sea
   Adequate machinery, storage, compartmentation space
   Excellent accommodation and workspace room
   Ship has slow, easy roll, a good, steady gun platform

Warning: Beam between bulkheads too wide

Pasban = Watcher
-endag =  bird
winjisk - sparrow
Xrad - wisdom
ustan - ghost
wad - wind/spirit

Xursedendag = Sunbird


Intended to provide a cruiser with a decent "punch"
of fast rotating 180mm guns, but high speed and range..
while also providing a fleet scout role.

This results in guns in "A/B" and "P/Q"  amidships but a aft deck and stern cleared for aircraft handling ala Tone


This is modeled by a long foredeck covering 20+40=60% of the ship,
with A/B being "Fore deck foreward", and "P/Q" being "fore deck aft"
This leaves the 40% of the ship aft - 67.2m / 202.4ft for handling aircraft.

This handling deck is a deck level lower than the forecastle deck, allowing the aft guns to fire over with only shallow elevations to clear.

The stern slopes down to make a ramp, allowing planes to be brought on board more readily.


Main armor belt is outsloped 15 degrees
3.7 / cos (15) =3.8305= 3.83

Forecastle/Quarterdeck are protectivedecks


Misc
75t - Reserve weight.

AD
59 - FC
25 - LR radio
0t - SR Radio
25t - Hulesmeyer prox detection
35t - Searchlight tower (NF)  & ATC Observation station
10t - SR Radio, dedicated AC

OD
On Forecastle deck
49t - 10% tonnage - power assist for Main Battery
5t Paravanes
24t 2TT4 21"

On aft deck :
10t - 2x Gunpowder Catapults
50t - 2x Fighter Float
100t - 4x Scout Float (normal, able to fit Ftr)
(cranes and nets for recovery part of floatplane cost)
10t - rail system.

HAW
8t - CO2 A/C
8t- Enhanced Fire Suppresion.

HBW
8t - Enhanced Pumps
15t - Enhanced Hydrophones
50t - Additional AvGas in double tank (5t +45t gas)

Decks
+6.9
+4.4
+1.9  Main Armor Deck, Top Main Belt.
-0.60 2nd Deck
          -1.8 Bottom Main Belt
-3.10 1st Deck
-5.59 Double Bottom, Engineering
-6.66 Keel

[The Rock Doctor]

I'm not sure you can get six gun mounts and a plane on the centreline of a 70m ship...

[Kaiser Kirk]

I suppose I could stand on the Springsharp soapbox and point to the 'excellent' scores for accommodation meaning it fits...therefore by the sim it's ok...
but I never liked that that argument overly much.

Probably the Evertsen's and 5x centerline + 2 x centerline torps with 1x seaplane over the aft torps should be my minimum guidance.
And she was 98m.

Hmm. So either move some stuff off centerline, reduce the amount of stuff, or stretch the ship....

[Jefgte]

Byzance also designed for 1928 a 7300t - 30kts cruiser with 3T3x191 ala Tone with 4 seaplanes. Not retained in the Plan.
Byzantium favors fighters, not seaplanes.

[Kaiser Kirk]

Byzance also designed for 1928 a 7300t - 30kts cruiser with 3T3x191 ala Tone with 4 seaplanes. Not retained in the Plan.
Byzantium favors fighters, not seaplanes.

The arrangement on the seaplane cruiser has a default of 2x floatplane fighter and 4x floatplane scout,
but the tonnage is there for all fighters if that winds up being superior.

[Kaiser Kirk]

Ok second go at the Gunboat,

I added 5m length, .5m width.
I changed the 37s to Quad 37s down to deck level and put them on the sides amidships.
That should be the widest part of the vessel.
Considering the Atlanta class was 16m, with a lower BC and had twin 5" in S1 and S2,
So they they should 'fit there' and the cat can be rotate to launch over either set.
Between another 'spot' in length and moving mounts off centerline,
I figure that should address the concern over the centerline mounts.

I also reduced the 23mm Gast to 4 mounts in the corners.

In the process of refiguring deck heights post the new freeboard from the longer ship,
I noticed my belt was 'taller' than desired, so that's fixed and freed the tonnage
to pay for the longer hull.

Gunboat E, Parthian Coastal Gunboat laid down 1929

Displacement:
   1,750 t light; 1,869 t standard; 1,940 t normal; 1,996 t full load

Dimensions: Length (overall / waterline) x beam x draught (normal/deep)
   (260.65 ft / 255.91 ft) x 47.57 ft x (9.84 / 10.07 ft)
   (79.45 m / 78.00 m) x 14.50 m  x (3.00 / 3.07 m)

Armament:
      3 - 6.50" / 165 mm 43.0 cal guns - 133.89lbs / 60.73kg shells, 240 per gun
     Quick firing guns in deck and hoist mounts, 1929 Model
     3 x Single mounts on centreline ends, majority aft
      1 raised mount aft - superfiring
      1 - 6.42" / 163 mm 21.0 cal gun - 118.76lbs / 53.87kg shells, 200 per gun
     Quick firing gun in deck and hoist mount, 1929 Model
     1 x Single mount on centreline, forward deck centre
      1 raised mount
      8 - 1.46" / 37.0 mm 90.0 cal guns - 1.79lbs / 0.81kg shells, 1,000 per gun
     Anti-air guns in deck mounts, 1929 Model
     2 x 4-gun mounts on sides amidships
      8 - 0.91" / 23.0 mm 90.0 cal guns - 0.44lbs / 0.20kg shells, 3,000 per gun
     Machine guns in deck mounts, 1929 Model
     4 x Twin mounts on side ends, evenly spread
      4 double raised mounts
      Weight of broadside 538 lbs / 244 kg

Armour:
   - Belts:      Width (max)   Length (avg)      Height (avg)
   Main:   2.95" / 75 mm   119.75 ft / 36.50 m   9.68 ft / 2.95 m
   Ends:   Unarmoured
     Main Belt covers 72 % of normal length
     Main Belt inclined -10.00 degrees (positive = in)

   - Hull void:
      0.00" / 0 mm     0.00 ft / 0.00 m   0.00 ft / 0.00 m

   - Gun armour:   Face (max)   Other gunhouse (avg)   Barbette/hoist (max)
   Main:   2.95" / 75 mm   1.57" / 40 mm      1.57" / 40 mm
   2nd:   2.95" / 75 mm   1.57" / 40 mm      1.57" / 40 mm
   3rd:   0.31" / 8 mm         -               -
   4th:   0.31" / 8 mm         -               -

   - Armoured deck - single deck:
   For and Aft decks: 1.57" / 40 mm
   Forecastle: 1.57" / 40 mm  Quarter deck: 1.57" / 40 mm

   - Conning towers: Forward 3.94" / 100 mm, Aft 0.00" / 0 mm

Machinery:
   Diesel Internal combustion generators,
   Electric motors, 2 shafts, 4,866 shp / 3,630 Kw = 18.00 kts
   Range 3,200nm at 10.00 kts
   Bunker at max displacement = 127 tons

Complement:
   145 - 189

Cost:
   £0.505 million / $2.019 million

Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
   Armament: 125 tons, 6.5 %
      - Guns: 125 tons, 6.5 %
   Armour: 495 tons, 25.5 %
      - Belts: 168 tons, 8.7 %
      - Armament: 60 tons, 3.1 %
      - Armour Deck: 253 tons, 13.0 %
      - Conning Tower: 13 tons, 0.7 %
   Machinery: 149 tons, 7.7 %
   Hull, fittings & equipment: 588 tons, 30.3 %
   Fuel, ammunition & stores: 190 tons, 9.8 %
   Miscellaneous weights: 392 tons, 20.2 %
      - Hull below water: 161 tons
      - Hull void weights: 30 tons
      - Hull above water: 68 tons
      - On freeboard deck: 50 tons
      - Above deck: 83 tons

Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
   Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
     3,673 lbs / 1,666 Kg = 26.8 x 6.5 " / 165 mm shells or 1.5 torpedoes
   Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1.35
   Metacentric height 2.8 ft / 0.8 m
   Roll period: 12.0 seconds
   Steadiness   - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 70 %
         - Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0.35
   Seaboat quality  (Average = 1.00): 1.40

Hull form characteristics:
   Hull has a flush deck,
     a ram bow and a cruiser stern
   Block coefficient (normal/deep): 0.567 / 0.570
   Length to Beam Ratio: 5.38 : 1
   'Natural speed' for length: 16.00 kts
   Power going to wave formation at top speed: 55 %
   Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 50
   Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): 15.00 degrees
   Stern overhang: -3.28 ft / -1.00 m
   Freeboard (% = length of deck as a percentage of waterline length):
            Fore end,    Aft end
      - Forecastle:   25.00 %,  17.72 ft / 5.40 m,  15.26 ft / 4.65 m
      - Forward deck:   25.00 %,  15.26 ft / 4.65 m,  12.80 ft / 3.90 m
      - Aft deck:   25.00 %,  12.80 ft / 3.90 m,  12.80 ft / 3.90 m
      - Quarter deck:   25.00 %,  12.80 ft / 3.90 m,  12.80 ft / 3.90 m
      - Average freeboard:      13.96 ft / 4.26 m

Ship space, strength and comments:
   Space   - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 62.1 %
      - Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 152.0 %
   Waterplane Area: 8,629 Square feet or 802 Square metres
   Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 121 %
   Structure weight / hull surface area: 55 lbs/sq ft or 268 Kg/sq metre
   Hull strength (Relative):
      - Cross-sectional: 0.66
      - Longitudinal: 2.28
      - Overall: 0.75
   Caution: Hull subject to strain in open-sea
   Excellent machinery, storage, compartmentation space
   Excellent accommodation and workspace room
   Ship has slow, easy roll, a good, steady gun platform
   Good seaboat, rides out heavy weather easily

Warning: Beam between bulkheads too wide


Guns :
165mm are primary direct fire.
163mm HOW are bombardment or ASW
37mm are primary AA sited for 6 Fore/aft/beam
Paired GAST 23mm are anti-strafing.

Borrowed from submarines are 4 bow tubes
firing 21" torpedoes


Armor :
Armored Deck at 1.4m caps Belt
Belt extends from 1.4m to -1.5m
Bow and Stern are protective decks.

Belt is sloped outwards at 10 degrees
2.9/cos(10) = 2.9447 = 2.95

TDS :
The ship has no TDS,
relying on it's small size, high manueverability via electric drive, and really shallow draft.
...really shallow.
The Standard torpedo settings of 11ft will go under the ship. Shallower torpedo settings risk breaching a wave trough in even light seas.



Engines:
Diesel electric will allow full speed forward and reverse, making a more difficult target....but also allowing navigation up streams far easier.

159 x 0.3 = 47.7 = 48
159 x 0.25 = 39.75 = 40

Range : +50% = 4500 , enough to go between two bases, and return if the base is gone.

Reserve : 35t

AD :
13t FC
25t NF - Aft Con searchlight tower, etc.
0t SR Radio
10t SR Radio for Spotting
25t Hulesmeyer
10t Squadron Plot Room

OD
5t paravanes
20t - Scout Floatplane in "Q"
5t - Gunpowder catapult
2t "Y" DC throwers
8t  DC
10t - Mine rails


HAW
4t -    CO2 Compressor AC
64t-   Marines

HBW

24t - 4 bow torpedo tubes,  4 torpedoes 21" x 3t
15t - Enhanced Hydrophone
10t - Sonar
40t - Turbogenerators
46t - Diesel Engines
10t - Batteries



Decks
3.9  Weather Deck
1.4  Main Armored Deck
-1.2 Deck/Engineering spaces
           -1.5  Bottom Armored Belt
-2.3 Engineering
-2.86 Bilges, Double bottom