Spending Spree (NOT OFFICIAL!!!!)

[Nobody]

Players are allowed to bank 5% of their GDP turn to turn.  All players will start with a economy of N$2,000 bucks.  So you could have your bank account full to start with.

I thought it was 3333$? So that 3% of it would be 100$.

[Desertfox]

Well that sucks... only 5% reserves? And a country with 20% Army and plenty of cash reserves can most definitely beat a country with 30% Army and no cash reserves. I ran the numbers wars will be completely unsustainable without cash reserves.

[Nobody]

Well that sucks... only 5% reserves? And a country with 20% Army and plenty of cash reserves can most definitely beat a country with 30% Army and no cash reserves. I ran the numbers wars will be completely unsustainable without cash reserves.

Either that or they won't be really serious for the first 2-3 years.

[snip]

snip (pun potentially intended)  ;)

Thanks for your response. I am going to join in the ranks of those who are displeases about the change to N$2000 from N$3333 for our startup economies. I currently have a spreadsheet set up to help with calculating the startup costs that I am likely to incur including a rough estiment of the matinece costs. I reaslise thing may have been changed since the rules that are currently posted were published, so my gripes may be out of date in light of what will be the current ruleset that us normal folk do not yet have access to. But here we go.

As it stands right now, I am set to spend only N$604.13 split ~60-40% between the Navy and Army. Running with the assumption of an N$3333 starting GDP, I was able to bring my Estimated Upkeep to N$73.19 with an Estimated income of N$99.99 this gave me ~N$27 per reporting period (year IIRC from other threads). Changing that to an starting GDP of N$2000 slashes Estimated Income by 40%, without changing my Estimated Upkeep that leaves me N$13.19 in the hole on day one. At this point, they only way for me to lower my upkeep significantly is to start slashing drydocks, as elimiating army units or forts will knock me below the 25% limit, unless that applies to total spending and not the total amount given. This is beginning to look even tighter then the IC-BP system. Also, seeing as reasearch is tied to GDP as of the last posted rules, we only get two establishments to start if we can afford them? I am more then happy to share my data with the mods so you can see if I am messing anything up.

As of right now, from what I can see, it is looking like things will start very very slow. Im going to vote (if I get a say) that we bump the economies for startup back to N$3333. By what I have looked at, this will give us some wiggle room when it comes to setup and during the first few years when we are all becoming familiar with the ruleset. I for one don't want to be stuck in a situation where I have to tweek individual ship's activity levels just to make ends meet year after year, let alone be unable to build new ships or keep up with the latest tech in any one category. I will wait until the rules are posted to bring this up in other places, but I think something needs to be done a bit differently with regards to startup economies.

[Logi]

Guinness has rules for it, we should be publishing them this coming week.  It is a gun energy system in terms of limits.

Should note - if you are using the P3D system of gun energy.

The average gun energy coefficient (the 0.04 in N3) for guns of the mid 1865s-1890s is ~0.032.
The average gun energy coefficient for guns before the 1865s is ~0.0135 or 0.013.
The average gun energy coefficient for the guns after the 1890s (ie: 1900s) is ~0.038

These give fairly accurate muzzle velocity for guns of the period. The changes are properly in line with the period of propellant change.

[miketr]

Players are allowed to bank 5% of their GDP turn to turn.  All players will start with a economy of N$2,000 bucks.  So you could have your bank account full to start with.

I thought it was 3333$? So that 3% of it would be 100$.

I will have to check the threads, but last Guinness settled on 2K.

5% reserve IS the bank limit.

Michael

[miketr]

Well that sucks... only 5% reserves? And a country with 20% Army and plenty of cash reserves can most definitely beat a country with 30% Army and no cash reserves. I ran the numbers wars will be completely unsustainable without cash reserves.

5%

As to who wins, we will see.  I will say this one more time.  Mods do NOT want long wars, figure half a year on the outside.  In effect opening battles are fought, the results are known and we go from there.  1864 / 66 / 1870 as the template.  Not WW1, ACW, etc. 

If you give the enemy a 50% edge in combat size and assuming equal  quality armies I would not expect a positive result DF.  You are making a number of assumptions without seeing the final product.

Michael

[miketr]

CUT of snips long note

I will again ask Mike and Charles about these two issues, core economy size and spending spree. 

I suggest people that object to the current situation to please post your examples.  It would be helpful to your case I believe.

Regards,

Michael

[snip]

EDIT: No Peeking!

[miketr]

OK talked to Guinness and the starting economy is N$3,333.  My mistake, we talked about using lower  budget at one point and got confused in my mind.  So again my mistake.

With that starting budget total roll over allowed would be N$166.65, bank turn to turn to be 5% of GDP.

Michael

[snip]

Ok, glad to hear it.  ;D

[Desertfox]

If you give the enemy a 50% edge in combat size and assuming equal  quality armies I would not expect a positive result DF.  You are making a number of assumptions without seeing the final product.

True, but if you can field and support your entire army while the enemy can only support half of his , then you can win even if your army is 33% smaller than his.

Good to hear about the $3,333 , no way you could support anything with less. I also think that $1,000 is a good starting number.

[miketr]

If you give the enemy a 50% edge in combat size and assuming equal  quality armies I would not expect a positive result DF.  You are making a number of assumptions without seeing the final product.

True, but if you can field and support your entire army while the enemy can only support half of his , then you can win even if your army is 33% smaller than his.

Good to hear about the $3,333 , no way you could support anything with less. I also think that $1,000 is a good starting number.

Game was always going to have war time only taxation levels.  Issue isn't going to be not being able to support your entire army, issue is going to be what do you do after the opening battles are done and one or both sides armies have collapsed.

Michael

[Darman]

.....issue is going to be what do you do after the opening battles are done and one or both sides armies have collapsed.
Michael

REVOLUTION!!

[Tanthalas]

.....issue is going to be what do you do after the opening battles are done and one or both sides armies have collapsed.
Michael

REVOLUTION!!

Proly in Mexico.