Iberia BB Design Study

[miketr]

I made some updates to the drawing.  When I updated the 150's I realized that the 350's weren't big enough so I increased the barbette size and barrel length.  The 150's are in open mounts so they are 26 feet long assuming L50's and a breach of about 18 inches.  From the layout I could fit more 150's stations midships.  Now should I move from twin 150's to singles or add some more mounts?  Or I could just spread the 150's out some more.

Michael

[Sachmle]

More 15cm...if those are twins 8 per side won't scare many TB/DD captains anyway.

[Jefgte]

I agree, 8x150 are not enough vs TBs & DDs.

Protect also the 150 mounts from the blast of the 350.
Casemates mounts or close mounts...

Thanks for the Gunners of the 150.


;)

[P3D]

The only irl BB with stronger than 8x15cm/6" broadside was the Agincourt. Why it should not scare away destroyer captains?

[miketr]

About open mount vs. close mount...  I am leery of making a jump straight to a closed mount setup from casements.  Also when I do I would like to go to full turrets; which would require 1920 CL tech so a 1922 or perhaps 1923 design.  I might go to a fully enclosed mount next then move on to the turret.

P3D does have a valid point...  I am mounting Sixteen 5.9" weapons few ships matched that number plus I will have a number of 75's above the main deck. That will be a great deal of 3" and 6" fire to rain down on a TB attack.  I might consider putting one more pair of twins to increase the total to twenty or perhaps four singles midships (assuming Q turret might put a cramp on space).  Five turrets a side I think would be max. 

Michael

[Sachmle]

Didn't know about the 75mm guns.  :P

[Tanthalas]

Our Mount and hoist is equivilant to what was used on the Iowa class ships for secondaries (based on the armor load anyway)

[maddox]

The secundaries on Iowa are  Mount and Hoist.  The turret pivots on a big gear mountend on the deck. And everything below deck is stationary.  I was surprised when I did find that drawing of the twin 5".

[miketr]

Made some changes to the beam and free board which saved up some structural strength.  So I added some armor to the upper belt and other places.  Still the same ship over all.  Any comments on the drawing back one page?

Michael

BB-1917-D, Iberia Battleship laid down 1917 (Engine 1916)

Displacement:
   28,001 t light; 29,666 t standard; 32,743 t normal; 35,205 t full load

Dimensions: Length overall / water x beam x draught
   650.00 ft / 650.00 ft x 96.00 ft x 28.33 ft (normal load)
   198.12 m / 198.12 m x 29.26 m  x 8.63 m

Armament:
      10 - 13.78" / 350 mm guns (5x2 guns), 1,308.20lbs / 593.39kg shells, 1917 Model
     Breech loading guns in turrets (on barbettes)
     on centreline, evenly spread, 3 raised mounts
      16 - 5.91" / 150 mm guns (8x2 guns), 102.98lbs / 46.71kg shells, 1917 Model
     Breech loading guns in deck mounts with hoists
     on side, all amidships
      8 - 2.95" / 75.0 mm guns in single mounts, 12.87lbs / 5.84kg shells, 1917 Model
     Quick firing guns in deck mounts
     on side, evenly spread, all raised mounts
      8 - 0.49" / 12.5 mm guns in single mounts, 0.06lbs / 0.03kg shells, 1917 Model
     Quick firing guns in deck mounts
     on side, evenly spread, all raised mounts
      4 - 1.57" / 40.0 mm guns in single mounts, 1.95lbs / 0.89kg shells, 1917 Model
     Anti-aircraft guns in deck mounts
     on side, all amidships, all raised mounts - superfiring
   Weight of broadside 14,841 lbs / 6,732 kg
   Shells per gun, main battery: 120
   4 - 21.0" / 533.4 mm submerged torpedo tubes

Armour:
   - Belts:      Width (max)   Length (avg)      Height (avg)
   Main:   13.0" / 330 mm   420.00 ft / 128.02 m   12.00 ft / 3.66 m
   Ends:   4.00" / 102 mm   230.00 ft / 70.10 m   12.00 ft / 3.66 m
   Upper:   7.50" / 191 mm   420.00 ft / 128.02 m   10.50 ft / 3.20 m
     Main Belt covers 99 % of normal length

   - Torpedo Bulkhead:
      1.50" / 38 mm   420.00 ft / 128.02 m   27.19 ft / 8.29 m

   - Gun armour:   Face (max)   Other gunhouse (avg)   Barbette/hoist (max)
   Main:   13.0" / 330 mm   10.0" / 254 mm      13.0" / 330 mm
   2nd:   3.00" / 76 mm   2.00" / 51 mm      3.00" / 76 mm
   3rd:   1.00" / 25 mm         -               -
   4th:   1.00" / 25 mm         -               -

   - Armour deck: 3.00" / 76 mm, Conning tower: 13.78" / 350 mm

Machinery:
   Coal and oil fired boilers, steam turbines,
   Direct drive, 3 shafts, 48,000 shp / 35,808 Kw = 22.59 kts
   Range 18,000nm at 10.00 kts
   Bunker at max displacement = 5,539 tons (67% coal)

Complement:
   1,216 - 1,582

Cost:
   £5.100 million / $20.399 million

Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
   Armament: 1,855 tons, 5.7 %
   Armour: 11,659 tons, 35.6 %
      - Belts: 4,715 tons, 14.4 %
      - Torpedo bulkhead: 634 tons, 1.9 %
      - Armament: 3,358 tons, 10.3 %
      - Armour Deck: 2,649 tons, 8.1 %
      - Conning Tower: 304 tons, 0.9 %
   Machinery: 1,904 tons, 5.8 %
   Hull, fittings & equipment: 11,679 tons, 35.7 %
   Fuel, ammunition & stores: 4,743 tons, 14.5 %
   Miscellaneous weights: 903 tons, 2.8 %

Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
   Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
     43,470 lbs / 19,717 Kg = 33.2 x 13.8 " / 350 mm shells or 7.0 torpedoes
   Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1.10
   Metacentric height 5.6 ft / 1.7 m
   Roll period: 17.0 seconds
   Steadiness   - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 50 %
         - Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0.60
   Seaboat quality  (Average = 1.00): 1.21

Hull form characteristics:
   Hull has a flush deck
   Block coefficient: 0.648
   Length to Beam Ratio: 6.77 : 1
   'Natural speed' for length: 25.50 kts
   Power going to wave formation at top speed: 45 %
   Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 41
   Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): 0.00 degrees
   Stern overhang: 0.00 ft / 0.00 m
   Freeboard (% = measuring location as a percentage of overall length):
      - Stem:      24.00 ft / 7.32 m
      - Forecastle (20 %):   21.00 ft / 6.40 m
      - Mid (50 %):      16.50 ft / 5.03 m
      - Quarterdeck (15 %):   15.00 ft / 4.57 m
      - Stern:      15.00 ft / 4.57 m
      - Average freeboard:   17.83 ft / 5.43 m
   Ship tends to be wet forward

Ship space, strength and comments:
   Space   - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 85.0 %
      - Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 128.1 %
   Waterplane Area: 47,726 Square feet or 4,434 Square metres
   Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 105 %
   Structure weight / hull surface area: 183 lbs/sq ft or 895 Kg/sq metre
   Hull strength (Relative):
      - Cross-sectional: 0.99
      - Longitudinal: 1.09
      - Overall: 1.00
   Hull space for machinery, storage, compartmentation is adequate
   Room for accommodation and workspaces is excellent
   Good seaboat, rides out heavy weather easily

[P3D]

Freeboard is on the low side for such a large ship. How much of the belt is above/below WL?

[Borys]

I don't like smaller than 7ft difference between decks.
Apart from that, I like it.
Borys

[miketr]

How much of the belt is above/below WL?

I am not following the question here...  With a freeboard at midpoint of 16.5' and a 10.5' upper belt that leaves 6' of main hull to cover so... 12/2 = 6...  Mainbelt is split evenly between above and below waterline.

As to the overall freeboard its within a foot of the suggested freeboard.

Michael

[miketr]

I don't like smaller than 7ft difference between decks.

Not following your comment either...

Michael

[miketr]

Made a change to the armor layout.  Ditched about 400 tons of misc weight and increased the height of the main belt to 14' and decreased the height of upper belt to 9.5'.

Michael

BB-1917-D1, Iberia Battleship laid down 1917 (Engine 1916)

Displacement:
   28,001 t light; 29,666 t standard; 32,743 t normal; 35,205 t full load

Dimensions: Length overall / water x beam x draught
   650.00 ft / 650.00 ft x 96.00 ft x 28.33 ft (normal load)
   198.12 m / 198.12 m x 29.26 m  x 8.63 m

Armament:
      10 - 13.78" / 350 mm guns (5x2 guns), 1,308.20lbs / 593.39kg shells, 1917 Model
     Breech loading guns in turrets (on barbettes)
     on centreline, evenly spread, 3 raised mounts
      16 - 5.91" / 150 mm guns (8x2 guns), 102.98lbs / 46.71kg shells, 1917 Model
     Breech loading guns in deck mounts with hoists
     on side, all amidships
      8 - 2.95" / 75.0 mm guns in single mounts, 12.87lbs / 5.84kg shells, 1917 Model
     Quick firing guns in deck mounts
     on side, evenly spread, all raised mounts
      8 - 0.49" / 12.5 mm guns in single mounts, 0.06lbs / 0.03kg shells, 1917 Model
     Quick firing guns in deck mounts
     on side, evenly spread, all raised mounts
      4 - 1.57" / 40.0 mm guns in single mounts, 1.95lbs / 0.88kg shells, 1917 Model
     Anti-aircraft guns in deck mounts
     on side, all amidships, all raised mounts - superfiring
   Weight of broadside 14,841 lbs / 6,732 kg
   Shells per gun, main battery: 120
   4 - 21.0" / 533.4 mm submerged torpedo tubes

Armour:
   - Belts:      Width (max)   Length (avg)      Height (avg)
   Main:   13.0" / 330 mm   420.00 ft / 128.02 m   14.00 ft / 4.27 m
   Ends:   4.00" / 102 mm   230.00 ft / 70.10 m   14.00 ft / 4.27 m
   Upper:   7.50" / 191 mm   420.00 ft / 128.02 m   9.50 ft / 2.90 m
     Main Belt covers 99 % of normal length

   - Torpedo Bulkhead:
      1.50" / 38 mm   420.00 ft / 128.02 m   27.19 ft / 8.29 m

   - Gun armour:   Face (max)   Other gunhouse (avg)   Barbette/hoist (max)
   Main:   13.0" / 330 mm   10.0" / 254 mm      13.0" / 330 mm
   2nd:   3.00" / 76 mm   2.00" / 51 mm      3.00" / 76 mm
   3rd:   1.00" / 25 mm         -               -
   4th:   1.00" / 25 mm         -               -

   - Armour deck: 3.00" / 76 mm, Conning tower: 13.78" / 350 mm

Machinery:
   Coal and oil fired boilers, steam turbines,
   Geared drive, 3 shafts, 48,000 shp / 35,808 Kw = 22.59 kts
   Range 18,000nm at 10.00 kts
   Bunker at max displacement = 5,539 tons (67% coal)

Complement:
   1,216 - 1,582

Cost:
   £5.100 million / $20.399 million

Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
   Armament: 1,855 tons, 5.7 %
   Armour: 12,067 tons, 36.9 %
      - Belts: 5,122 tons, 15.6 %
      - Torpedo bulkhead: 634 tons, 1.9 %
      - Armament: 3,358 tons, 10.3 %
      - Armour Deck: 2,649 tons, 8.1 %
      - Conning Tower: 304 tons, 0.9 %
   Machinery: 1,904 tons, 5.8 %
   Hull, fittings & equipment: 11,673 tons, 35.7 %
   Fuel, ammunition & stores: 4,743 tons, 14.5 %
   Miscellaneous weights: 501 tons, 1.5 %

Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
   Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
     44,540 lbs / 20,203 Kg = 34.0 x 13.8 " / 350 mm shells or 7.2 torpedoes
   Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1.11
   Metacentric height 5.7 ft / 1.7 m
   Roll period: 16.9 seconds
   Steadiness   - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 50 %
         - Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0.59
   Seaboat quality  (Average = 1.00): 1.21

Hull form characteristics:
   Hull has a flush deck
   Block coefficient: 0.648
   Length to Beam Ratio: 6.77 : 1
   'Natural speed' for length: 25.50 kts
   Power going to wave formation at top speed: 45 %
   Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 41
   Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): 0.00 degrees
   Stern overhang: 0.00 ft / 0.00 m
   Freeboard (% = measuring location as a percentage of overall length):
      - Stem:      24.00 ft / 7.32 m
      - Forecastle (20 %):   21.00 ft / 6.40 m
      - Mid (50 %):      16.50 ft / 5.03 m
      - Quarterdeck (15 %):   15.00 ft / 4.57 m
      - Stern:      15.00 ft / 4.57 m
      - Average freeboard:   17.83 ft / 5.43 m
   Ship tends to be wet forward

Ship space, strength and comments:
   Space   - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 83.3 %
      - Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 128.1 %
   Waterplane Area: 47,726 Square feet or 4,434 Square metres
   Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 105 %
   Structure weight / hull surface area: 183 lbs/sq ft or 895 Kg/sq metre
   Hull strength (Relative):
      - Cross-sectional: 0.98
      - Longitudinal: 1.09
      - Overall: 1.00
   Hull space for machinery, storage, compartmentation is excellent
   Room for accommodation and workspaces is excellent
   Good seaboat, rides out heavy weather easily

[Borys]

I don't like smaller than 7ft difference between decks.

Not following your comment either...

Michael

What I wanted to say is that I like to have the f'castle and quarter deck to be a full deck higher or lower than the weatherdeck, i.e. 7-9ft. I sometimes do use less fore, to represent a raising hull shape.
Sorry for lack of clarity.

I lovbe the piccie! Would look great in the KKK as a Juan de Austria follow up.
Borys