BB 20, Esc Bb laid down 1920
Displacement:
46.754 t light; 49.063 t standard; 52.336 t normal; 54.954 t full load
Dimensions: Length overall / water x beam x draught
819,01 ft / 814,96 ft x 108,27 ft x 31,99 ft (normal load)
249,63 m / 248,40 m x 33,00 m x 9,75 m
Armament:
6 - 15,94" / 405 mm guns (2x3 guns), 2.026,91lbs / 919,39kg shells, 1920 Model
Breech loading guns in turrets (on barbettes)
on centreline ends, evenly spread
4 - 15,94" / 405 mm guns (2x2 guns), 2.026,91lbs / 919,39kg shells, 1920 Model
Breech loading guns in turrets (on barbettes)
on side, all amidships, all raised mounts - superfiring
16 - 5,91" / 150 mm guns (8x2 guns), 102,98lbs / 46,71kg shells, 1920 Model
Quick firing guns in deck mounts with hoists
on side, evenly spread
6 - 1,57" / 40,0 mm guns in single mounts, 1,95lbs / 0,89kg shells, 1920 Model
Anti-aircraft guns in deck mounts
on side, evenly spread, all raised mounts
Weight of broadside 21.928 lbs / 9.947 kg
Shells per gun, main battery: 100
Armour:
- Belts: Width (max) Length (avg) Height (avg)
Main: 13,8" / 350 mm 459,32 ft / 140,00 m 15,78 ft / 4,81 m
Ends: Unarmoured
Upper: 5,91" / 150 mm 459,32 ft / 140,00 m 8,01 ft / 2,44 m
Main Belt covers 87 % of normal length
Main belt does not fully cover magazines and engineering spaces
- Torpedo Bulkhead:
1,97" / 50 mm 660,43 ft / 201,30 m 29,72 ft / 9,06 m
- Gun armour: Face (max) Other gunhouse (avg) Barbette/hoist (max)
Main: 13,8" / 350 mm 9,84" / 250 mm 13,8" / 350 mm
2nd: 13,8" / 350 mm 9,84" / 250 mm 13,8" / 350 mm
3rd: 2,95" / 75 mm 1,97" / 50 mm -
- Armour deck: 5,91" / 150 mm, Conning tower: 13,78" / 350 mm
Machinery:
Oil fired boilers, steam turbines,
Electric cruising motors plus geared drives, 4 shafts, 135.192 shp / 100.853 Kw = 28,00 kts
Range 9.500nm at 14,00 kts
Bunker at max displacement = 5.891 tons
Complement:
1.729 - 2.249
Cost:
£10,874 million / $43,497 million
Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
Armament: 2.741 tons, 5,2 %
Armour: 18.676 tons, 35,7 %
- Belts: 5.394 tons, 10,3 %
- Torpedo bulkhead: 1.430 tons, 2,7 %
- Armament: 4.059 tons, 7,8 %
- Armour Deck: 7.378 tons, 14,1 %
- Conning Tower: 415 tons, 0,8 %
Machinery: 4.727 tons, 9,0 %
Hull, fittings & equipment: 19.860 tons, 37,9 %
Fuel, ammunition & stores: 5.582 tons, 10,7 %
Miscellaneous weights: 750 tons, 1,4 %
Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
68.650 lbs / 31.139 Kg = 33,9 x 15,9 " / 405 mm shells or 10,5 torpedoes
Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1,11
Metacentric height 6,9 ft / 2,1 m
Roll period: 17,3 seconds
Steadiness - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 54 %
- Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0,63
Seaboat quality (Average = 1.00): 1,08
Hull form characteristics:
Hull has a flush deck
Block coefficient: 0,649
Length to Beam Ratio: 7,53 : 1
'Natural speed' for length: 28,55 kts
Power going to wave formation at top speed: 49 %
Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 50
Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): 10,00 degrees
Stern overhang: 0,00 ft / 0,00 m
Freeboard (% = measuring location as a percentage of overall length):
- Stem: 22,97 ft / 7,00 m
- Forecastle (10 %): 20,77 ft / 6,33 m
- Mid (50 %): 20,77 ft / 6,33 m
- Quarterdeck (15 %): 20,77 ft / 6,33 m
- Stern: 20,77 ft / 6,33 m
- Average freeboard: 20,86 ft / 6,36 m
Ship tends to be wet forward
Ship space, strength and comments:
Space - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 86,7 %
- Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 154,5 %
Waterplane Area: 67.530 Square feet or 6.274 Square metres
Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 103 %
Structure weight / hull surface area: 219 lbs/sq ft or 1.069 Kg/sq metre
Hull strength (Relative):
- Cross-sectional: 0,99
- Longitudinal: 1,06
- Overall: 1,00
Hull space for machinery, storage, compartmentation is adequate
Room for accommodation and workspaces is excellent
Armor disposition as in Ocean class
Misc Weight:
2x FC :500t
L/RW/L:25 t
Seendes augen :25 t
Flag faciliteies:50 t
Starshells :50 t
Reserve:100t
You did that turret thing again w/ the twin where you listed them as "On side, raised" instead of "On centerline, raised".
GRRRRRRRRR: :D :D :D
BB 20, Esc Bb laid down 1920
Displacement:
46.754 t light; 49.063 t standard; 52.336 t normal; 54.954 t full load
Dimensions: Length overall / water x beam x draught
819,01 ft / 814,96 ft x 108,27 ft x 31,99 ft (normal load)
249,63 m / 248,40 m x 33,00 m x 9,75 m
Armament:
6 - 15,94" / 405 mm guns (2x3 guns), 2.026,91lbs / 919,39kg shells, 1920 Model
Breech loading guns in turrets (on barbettes)
on centreline ends, evenly spread
4 - 15,94" / 405 mm guns (2x2 guns), 2.026,91lbs / 919,39kg shells, 1920 Model
Breech loading guns in turrets (on barbettes)
on centreline ends, evenly spread, all raised mounts
16 - 5,91" / 150 mm guns (8x2 guns), 102,98lbs / 46,71kg shells, 1920 Model
Quick firing guns in deck mounts with hoists
on side, evenly spread
6 - 1,57" / 40,0 mm guns in single mounts, 1,95lbs / 0,88kg shells, 1920 Model
Anti-aircraft guns in deck mounts
on side, evenly spread, all raised mounts
Weight of broadside 21.928 lbs / 9.947 kg
Shells per gun, main battery: 100
Armour:
- Belts: Width (max) Length (avg) Height (avg)
Main: 13,8" / 350 mm 459,32 ft / 140,10 m 15,78 ft / 4,81 m
Ends: Unarmoured
Upper: 5,91" / 150 mm 459,32 ft / 140,10 m 8,01 ft / 2,44 m
Main Belt covers 88 % of normal length
- Torpedo Bulkhead:
1,97" / 50 mm 660,43 ft / 201,30 m 29,72 ft / 9,06 m
- Gun armour: Face (max) Other gunhouse (avg) Barbette/hoist (max)
Main: 13,8" / 350 mm 9,84" / 250 mm 13,8" / 350 mm
2nd: 13,8" / 350 mm 9,84" / 250 mm 13,8" / 350 mm
3rd: 2,95" / 75 mm 1,97" / 50 mm -
- Armour deck: 5,91" / 150 mm, Conning tower: 13,78" / 350 mm
Machinery:
Oil fired boilers, steam turbines,
Electric cruising motors plus geared drives, 4 shafts, 135.192 shp / 100.853 Kw = 28,00 kts
Range 9.500nm at 14,00 kts
Bunker at max displacement = 5.891 tons
Complement:
1.729 - 2.249
Cost:
£10,874 million / $43,497 million
Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
Armament: 2.741 tons, 5,2 %
Armour: 18.676 tons, 35,7 %
- Belts: 5.394 tons, 10,3 %
- Torpedo bulkhead: 1.430 tons, 2,7 %
- Armament: 4.059 tons, 7,8 %
- Armour Deck: 7.378 tons, 14,1 %
- Conning Tower: 415 tons, 0,8 %
Machinery: 4.727 tons, 9,0 %
Hull, fittings & equipment: 19.860 tons, 37,9 %
Fuel, ammunition & stores: 5.582 tons, 10,7 %
Miscellaneous weights: 750 tons, 1,4 %
Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
68.650 lbs / 31.139 Kg = 33,9 x 15,9 " / 405 mm shells or 10,5 torpedoes
Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1,11
Metacentric height 6,9 ft / 2,1 m
Roll period: 17,3 seconds
Steadiness - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 54 %
- Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0,63
Seaboat quality (Average = 1.00): 1,08
Hull form characteristics:
Hull has a flush deck
Block coefficient: 0,649
Length to Beam Ratio: 7,53 : 1
'Natural speed' for length: 28,55 kts
Power going to wave formation at top speed: 49 %
Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 50
Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): 10,00 degrees
Stern overhang: 0,00 ft / 0,00 m
Freeboard (% = measuring location as a percentage of overall length):
- Stem: 22,97 ft / 7,00 m
- Forecastle (10 %): 20,77 ft / 6,33 m
- Mid (50 %): 20,77 ft / 6,33 m
- Quarterdeck (15 %): 20,77 ft / 6,33 m
- Stern: 20,77 ft / 6,33 m
- Average freeboard: 20,86 ft / 6,36 m
Ship tends to be wet forward
Ship space, strength and comments:
Space - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 86,7 %
- Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 154,5 %
Waterplane Area: 67.530 Square feet or 6.274 Square metres
Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 103 %
Structure weight / hull surface area: 219 lbs/sq ft or 1.069 Kg/sq metre
Hull strength (Relative):
- Cross-sectional: 0,99
- Longitudinal: 1,06
- Overall: 1,00
Hull space for machinery, storage, compartmentation is adequate
Room for accommodation and workspaces is excellent
Armor disposition as in Ocean class
Misc Weight:
2x FC :500t
L/RW/L:25 t
Seendes augen :25 t
Flag faciliteies:50 t
Starshells :50 t
Reserve:100t
You need cruisers. A lot of them
Quote from: TexanCowboy on December 16, 2009, 05:39:57 PM
You need cruisers. A lot of them
Cruisers are so so BORING though... BBs are alot more fun to build
Quote from: TexanCowboy on December 16, 2009, 05:39:57 PM
You need cruisers. A lot of them
Nah...he lets the Bavarian's bring the cruisers...and the Dutch bring the MiniLightCruisers, er Detroyers.
Quote from: Sachmle on December 16, 2009, 06:58:06 PM
Quote from: TexanCowboy on December 16, 2009, 05:39:57 PM
You need cruisers. A lot of them
Nah...he lets the Bavarian's bring the cruisers...and the Dutch bring the MiniLightCruisers, er Detroyers.
... you know my DDs kind of resemble that remark
The 18" option:
BB 21, Esc Bb laid down 1921
Displacement:
48.620 t light; 51.257 t standard; 54.594 t normal; 57.264 t full load
Dimensions: Length overall / water x beam x draught
819,01 ft / 814,96 ft x 108,27 ft x 31,99 ft (normal load)
249,63 m / 248,40 m x 33,00 m x 9,75 m
Armament:
9 - 17,91" / 455 mm guns (3x3 guns), 2.874,11lbs / 1.303,67kg shells, 1921 Model
Breech loading guns in turrets (on barbettes)
on centreline ends, majority forward, 1 raised mount - superfiring
16 - 5,91" / 150 mm guns (8x2 guns), 102,98lbs / 46,71kg shells, 1921 Model
Quick firing guns in deck mounts with hoists
on centreline ends, evenly spread, 2 raised mounts - superfiring
6 - 1,57" / 40,0 mm guns (4 mounts), 1,95lbs / 0,88kg shells, 1921 Model
Anti-aircraft guns in deck mounts
on side, evenly spread, all raised mounts
Weight of broadside 27.526 lbs / 12.486 kg
Shells per gun, main battery: 100
Armour:
- Belts: Width (max) Length (avg) Height (avg)
Main: 13,8" / 350 mm 508,53 ft / 155,00 m 15,78 ft / 4,81 m
Ends: Unarmoured
Upper: 5,91" / 150 mm 508,53 ft / 155,00 m 8,01 ft / 2,44 m
Main Belt covers 96 % of normal length
- Torpedo Bulkhead:
1,97" / 50 mm 660,43 ft / 201,30 m 29,72 ft / 9,06 m
- Gun armour: Face (max) Other gunhouse (avg) Barbette/hoist (max)
Main: 13,8" / 350 mm 9,84" / 250 mm 13,8" / 350 mm
2nd: 0,67" / 17 mm 1,97" / 50 mm -
3rd: 0,59" / 15 mm - -
- Armour deck: 5,91" / 150 mm, Conning tower: 13,78" / 350 mm
Machinery:
Oil fired boilers, steam turbines,
Electric cruising motors plus geared drives, 4 shafts, 140.221 shp / 104.605 Kw = 28,00 kts
Range 9.500nm at 14,00 kts
Bunker at max displacement = 6.007 tons
Complement:
1.785 - 2.321
Cost:
£13,409 million / $53,637 million
Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
Armament: 3.441 tons, 6,3 %
Armour: 19.062 tons, 34,9 %
- Belts: 5.856 tons, 10,7 %
- Torpedo bulkhead: 1.430 tons, 2,6 %
- Armament: 3.780 tons, 6,9 %
- Armour Deck: 7.568 tons, 13,9 %
- Conning Tower: 427 tons, 0,8 %
Machinery: 4.829 tons, 8,8 %
Hull, fittings & equipment: 20.539 tons, 37,6 %
Fuel, ammunition & stores: 5.974 tons, 10,9 %
Miscellaneous weights: 750 tons, 1,4 %
Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
64.893 lbs / 29.435 Kg = 22,6 x 17,9 " / 455 mm shells or 9,2 torpedoes
Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1,12
Metacentric height 7,0 ft / 2,1 m
Roll period: 17,2 seconds
Steadiness - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 52 %
- Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0,74
Seaboat quality (Average = 1.00): 1,05
Hull form characteristics:
Hull has a flush deck
Block coefficient: 0,677
Length to Beam Ratio: 7,53 : 1
'Natural speed' for length: 28,55 kts
Power going to wave formation at top speed: 50 %
Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 50
Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): 10,00 degrees
Stern overhang: 0,00 ft / 0,00 m
Freeboard (% = measuring location as a percentage of overall length):
- Stem: 22,97 ft / 7,00 m
- Forecastle (10 %): 20,77 ft / 6,33 m
- Mid (50 %): 20,77 ft / 6,33 m
- Quarterdeck (15 %): 20,77 ft / 6,33 m
- Stern: 20,77 ft / 6,33 m
- Average freeboard: 20,86 ft / 6,36 m
Ship tends to be wet forward
Ship space, strength and comments:
Space - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 95,4 %
- Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 153,5 %
Waterplane Area: 69.275 Square feet or 6.436 Square metres
Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 96 %
Structure weight / hull surface area: 222 lbs/sq ft or 1.083 Kg/sq metre
Hull strength (Relative):
- Cross-sectional: 0,99
- Longitudinal: 1,03
- Overall: 1,00
Hull space for machinery, storage, compartmentation is adequate
Room for accommodation and workspaces is excellent
Armor disposition as in Ocean class
Misc Weight:
2x FC :500t
L/RW/L:25 t
Seendes augen :25 t
Flag faciliteies:50 t
Starshells :50 t
Reserve:100t
Ahoj!
I think that such guns are deserving of a better fire platform than 52% ... and my general feeling about this ship is that it would be much better with one or two knots less, but thicker armour.
Borys
Admittedly but I seriously doubt that I ever will build ships with a 455mm gun,I think ill rather improve my 405 mm gun to a 405mm cal 55 gun.
BUILD CRUISERS!!! BUILD CRUISERS!!!
A 16'' L55 would wear very quickly, something like 150-175 shots per barrel.
Ahoj!
Quote from: TexanCowboy on December 27, 2009, 10:35:35 AM
BUILD CRUISERS!!! BUILD CRUISERS!!!
A 16'' L55 would wear very quickly, something like 150-175 shots per barrel.
Design the gun for quick barrel/liner change. That's what the Italians did in OTL.
Borys
Quote from: ledeper on December 21, 2009, 12:39:48 PM
Admittedly but I seriously doubt that I ever will build ships with a 455mm gun,I think ill rather improve my 405 mm gun to a 405mm cal 55 gun.
thats what im planing to do with Rohan
Quote from: Borys on December 27, 2009, 12:58:36 PM
Design the gun for quick barrel/liner change. That's what the Italians did in OTL.
Borys
Asfaloth & Maethor 8X15.5/45 1951 pound shell
Dagor & Hathel 8X15.5/50 2200 pound shell
Draug & Ohtar 8X15.5/55 2500 pound shell
Ahoj!
Quote from: Tanthalas on December 27, 2009, 01:13:07 PM
Dagor & Hathel 8X15.5/50 2200 pound shell
Draug & Ohtar 8X15.5/55 2500 pound shell
Hmm ... not too heavy? I see 2200 lbs as fitting for a 16", and the 2500 lbs as appropriate for 16,5" or so.
Borys
US super-heavy 2,700 shell. It can be done, but with a corresponding loss in MV and, therefore, penetration.
Quote from: TexanCowboy on December 27, 2009, 01:47:49 PM
US super-heavy 2,700 shell. It can be done, but with a corresponding loss in MV and, therefore, penetration.
I know that it can be done. But with battle range of 15K yards, there is no reason to do it. But then again, belt pentration of the USN superheavy was simillar to 15" weapons, so at this point in time it might simply be a waste of tonnage ...
Borys
Quote from: Borys on December 27, 2009, 01:46:29 PM
Ahoj!
Quote from: Tanthalas on December 27, 2009, 01:13:07 PM
Dagor & Hathel 8X15.5/50 2200 pound shell
Draug & Ohtar 8X15.5/55 2500 pound shell
Hmm ... not too heavy? I see 2200 lbs as fitting for a 16", and the 2500 lbs as appropriate for 16,5" or so.
Borys
the 15.5/45 is the Italian 15/50 the rest are averages drawn from various 16/50 and the Italian 15/50. I dont htink ght 15.5/50 is to heavy, and the 15.5/55 is strictly speculative atm.
Ahoj!
I expressly did NOT mention the 15"/45 :)
Apart from the oddball Vickers designed Russian 16" (of unproven utility), the "first generation" (RN, USN, IJN) sixteen-inchers had 2050/2100/2200 lbs shells.
Borys