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Main Archive => Navalism 3 Armed Forces => Armed Forces => New Ship Designs => Topic started by: Borys on October 20, 2009, 03:25:51 AM

Title: Perfect match for drawing ... Habsburg 3x4x13,5" ship
Post by: Borys on October 20, 2009, 03:25:51 AM
(http://www.wunderwaffe.narod.ru/Magazine/MK/2000_03/Draw/96.jpg)
Well, almost perfect match - I have to work on the lowered quarterdeck ...

SMS Todleben, Habsburgs Schlachtiff laid down 1920 (Engine 1916)

Displacement:
   29 685 t light; 31 267 t standard; 32 420 t normal; 33 342 t full load

Dimensions: Length overall / water x beam x draught
   700,00 ft / 700,00 ft x 102,00 ft x 29,00 ft (normal load)
   213,36 m / 213,36 m x 31,09 m  x 8,84 m

Armament:
      12 - 13,50" / 343 mm guns (3x4 guns), 1 400,00lbs / 635,03kg shells, 1920 Model
     Breech loading guns in turrets (on barbettes)
     on centreline ends, majority forward
      4 - 6,00" / 152 mm guns in single mounts, 100,00lbs / 45,36kg shells, 1920 Model
     Breech loading guns in casemate mounts
     on side, all aft
      12 - 6,00" / 152 mm guns in single mounts, 100,00lbs / 45,36kg shells, 1920 Model
     Quick firing guns in deck mounts with hoists
     on side, evenly spread
     8 guns in hull casemates - Limited use in heavy seas
      4 - 1,25" / 31,8 mm guns (2x2 guns), 1,00lbs / 0,45kg shells, 1920 Model
     Anti-aircraft guns in deck mounts
     on side, all aft, all raised mounts - superfiring
      8 - 0,43" / 11,0 mm guns in single mounts, 0,04lbs / 0,02kg shells, 1920 Model
     Machine guns in deck mounts
     on side, evenly spread, all raised mounts
   Weight of broadside 18 404 lbs / 8 348 kg
   Shells per gun, main battery: 90
   4 - 20,0" / 508 mm submerged torpedo tubes

Armour:
   - Belts:      Width (max)   Length (avg)      Height (avg)
   Main:   13,0" / 330 mm   430,00 ft / 131,06 m   16,00 ft / 4,88 m
   Ends:   4,00" / 102 mm   270,00 ft / 82,30 m   12,00 ft / 3,66 m
   Upper:   8,00" / 203 mm   430,00 ft / 131,06 m   8,00 ft / 2,44 m
     Main Belt covers 95% of normal length
     Main belt does not fully cover magazines and engineering spaces

   - Torpedo Bulkhead:
      1,50" / 38 mm   430,00 ft / 131,06 m   43,00 ft / 13,11 m

   - Gun armour:   Face (max)   Other gunhouse (avg)   Barbette/hoist (max)
   Main:   14,0" / 356 mm   6,00" / 152 mm      12,0" / 305 mm
   3rd:   5,00" / 127 mm   2,00" / 51 mm      2,00" / 51 mm
   4th:   0,50" / 13 mm         -               -

   - Armour deck: 3,25" / 83 mm, Conning tower: 14,00" / 356 mm

Machinery:
   Coal and oil fired boilers, steam turbines,
   Direct drive, 4 shafts, 66 387 shp / 49 524 Kw = 25,00 kts
   Range 7 000nm at 10,00 kts
   Bunker at max displacement = 2 075 tons (25% coal)

Complement:
   1 207 - 1 570

Cost:
   £7,387 million / $29,548 million

Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
   Armament: 2 062 tons, 6,4%
   Armour: 11 934 tons, 36,8%
      - Belts: 5 604 tons, 17,3%
      - Torpedo bulkhead: 1 026 tons, 3,2%
      - Armament: 2 007 tons, 6,2%
      - Armour Deck: 2 990 tons, 9,2%
      - Conning Tower: 307 tons, 0,9%
   Machinery: 2 531 tons, 7,8%
   Hull, fittings & equipment: 12 708 tons, 39,2%
   Fuel, ammunition & stores: 2 735 tons, 8,4%
   Miscellaneous weights: 450 tons, 1,4%

Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
   Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
     37 661 lbs / 17 083 Kg = 30,6 x 13,5 " / 343 mm shells or 6,4 torpedoes
   Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1,10
   Metacentric height 6,2 ft / 1,9 m
   Roll period: 17,2 seconds
   Steadiness   - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 69 %
         - Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0,56
   Seaboat quality  (Average = 1.00): 1,08

Hull form characteristics:
   Hull has low quarterdeck
   Block coefficient: 0,548
   Length to Beam Ratio: 6,86 : 1
   'Natural speed' for length: 26,46 kts
   Power going to wave formation at top speed: 46 %
   Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 64
   Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): 0,00 degrees
   Stern overhang: 0,00 ft / 0,00 m
   Freeboard (% = measuring location as a percentage of overall length):
      - Stem:      22,00 ft / 6,71 m
      - Forecastle (20%):   16,00 ft / 4,88 m
      - Mid (25%):      16,00 ft / 4,88 m
      - Quarterdeck (7%):   10,00 ft / 3,05 m (16,00 ft / 4,88 m before break)
      - Stern:      10,00 ft / 3,05 m
      - Average freeboard:   16,06 ft / 4,90 m
   Ship tends to be wet forward

Ship space, strength and comments:
   Space   - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 95,3%
      - Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 125,6%
   Waterplane Area: 49 736 Square feet or 4 621 Square metres
   Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 96%
   Structure weight / hull surface area: 195 lbs/sq ft or 953 Kg/sq metre
   Hull strength (Relative):
      - Cross-sectional: 0,99
      - Longitudinal: 1,08
      - Overall: 1,00
   Hull space for machinery, storage, compartmentation is adequate
   Room for accommodation and workspaces is excellent

Title: Re: Perfect match for drawing ... Habsburg 3x4x13,5" ship
Post by: Sachmle on October 20, 2009, 06:51:32 AM
You're belts too short and trying to put the 6" mounts "below deck level" as in the pic defaults them to casemates. Other than that..kinda nice, if you like quads.
Title: Re: Perfect match for drawing ... Habsburg 3x4x13,5" ship
Post by: The Rock Doctor on October 20, 2009, 07:03:51 AM
I think the sim would need to have the aft turret considered superfiring, since it's being simmed as having a deck break forward of the secondaries.  Otherwise, it's probably a fair approximation of the thing.
Title: Re: Perfect match for drawing ... Habsburg 3x4x13,5" ship
Post by: mentat on October 21, 2009, 05:58:43 AM

Nice pic  :)  - but shouldn't it be 8 x 6" single mounts in casemates, 12 x 6" in twin mounts, and need quad main turrets in the pic ..
Title: Re: Perfect match for drawing ... Habsburg 3x4x13,5" ship
Post by: Borys on October 26, 2009, 12:35:14 PM
A perfect match with this:
(http://www.wunderwaffe.narod.ru/Magazine/MK/2000_03/Draw/95.jpg)

KKK Schlachtschiff
laid down 1920 (Engine 1916)

Displacement:
   28 877 t light; 30 468 t standard; 31 956 t normal; 33 146 t full load

Dimensions: Length overall / water x beam x draught
   650,00 ft / 650,00 ft x 105,00 ft x 28,50 ft (normal load)
   198,12 m / 198,12 m x 32,00 m  x 8,69 m

Armament:
      12 - 13,50" / 343 mm guns (3x4 guns), 1 400,00lbs / 635,03kg shells, 1920 Model
     Breech loading guns in turrets (on barbettes)
     on centreline, evenly spread
     Aft Main mounts separated by engine room
      24 - 5,30" / 135 mm guns in single mounts, 75,00lbs / 34,02kg shells, 1920 Model
     Breech loading guns in casemate mounts
     on side, all amidships
     24 guns in hull casemates - Limited use in heavy seas
      4 - 3,00" / 76,2 mm guns in single mounts, 13,50lbs / 6,12kg shells, 1920 Model
     Anti-aircraft guns in deck mounts
     on side, evenly spread, all raised mounts
      8 - 1,25" / 31,8 mm guns (4x2 guns), 1,00lbs / 0,45kg shells, 1920 Model
     Anti-aircraft guns in deck mounts
     on side, evenly spread, all raised mounts
   Weight of broadside 18 662 lbs / 8 465 kg
   Shells per gun, main battery: 90

Armour:
   - Belts:      Width (max)   Length (avg)      Height (avg)
   Main:   14,0" / 356 mm   405,00 ft / 123,44 m   12,00 ft / 3,66 m
   Ends:   4,00" / 102 mm   245,00 ft / 74,68 m   12,00 ft / 3,66 m
   Upper:   8,00" / 203 mm   405,00 ft / 123,44 m   9,00 ft / 2,74 m
     Main Belt covers 96% of normal length

   - Torpedo Bulkhead:
      1,50" / 38 mm   405,00 ft / 123,44 m   43,00 ft / 13,11 m

   - Gun armour:   Face (max)   Other gunhouse (avg)   Barbette/hoist (max)
   Main:   14,0" / 356 mm   9,00" / 229 mm      13,0" / 330 mm
   2nd:   2,00" / 51 mm   1,00" / 25 mm      1,00" / 25 mm

   - Armour deck: 3,50" / 89 mm, Conning tower: 15,00" / 381 mm

Machinery:
   Coal and oil fired boilers, steam turbines,
   Direct drive, 4 shafts, 68 918 shp / 51 413 Kw = 25,00 kts
   Range 6 500nm at 12,00 kts
   Bunker at max displacement = 2 678 tons (25% coal)

Complement:
   1 194 - 1 553

Cost:
   £7,381 million / $29,523 million

Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
   Armament: 2 076 tons, 6,5%
   Armour: 11 445 tons, 35,8%
      - Belts: 4 740 tons, 14,8%
      - Torpedo bulkhead: 967 tons, 3,0%
      - Armament: 2 255 tons, 7,1%
      - Armour Deck: 3 157 tons, 9,9%
      - Conning Tower: 325 tons, 1,0%
   Machinery: 2 627 tons, 8,2%
   Hull, fittings & equipment: 12 228 tons, 38,3%
   Fuel, ammunition & stores: 3 078 tons, 9,6%
   Miscellaneous weights: 500 tons, 1,6%

Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
   Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
     36 246 lbs / 16 441 Kg = 29,5 x 13,5 " / 343 mm shells or 6,4 torpedoes
   Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1,10
   Metacentric height 6,4 ft / 2,0 m
   Roll period: 17,4 seconds
   Steadiness   - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 69 %
         - Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0,49
   Seaboat quality  (Average = 1.00): 1,04

Hull form characteristics:
   Hull has rise forward of midbreak
   Block coefficient: 0,575
   Length to Beam Ratio: 6,19 : 1
   'Natural speed' for length: 25,50 kts
   Power going to wave formation at top speed: 50 %
   Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 66
   Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): 0,00 degrees
   Stern overhang: 0,00 ft / 0,00 m
   Freeboard (% = measuring location as a percentage of overall length):
      - Stem:      28,00 ft / 8,53 m
      - Forecastle (20%):   23,00 ft / 7,01 m
      - Mid (25%):      23,00 ft / 7,01 m (15,00 ft / 4,57 m aft of break)
      - Quarterdeck (15%):   15,00 ft / 4,57 m
      - Stern:      15,00 ft / 4,57 m
      - Average freeboard:   17,40 ft / 5,30 m
   Ship tends to be wet forward

Ship space, strength and comments:
   Space   - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 95,7%
      - Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 121,5%
   Waterplane Area: 48 762 Square feet or 4 530 Square metres
   Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 95%
   Structure weight / hull surface area: 193 lbs/sq ft or 941 Kg/sq metre
   Hull strength (Relative):
      - Cross-sectional: 0,97
      - Longitudinal: 1,26
      - Overall: 1,00
   Hull space for machinery, storage, compartmentation is adequate
   Room for accommodation and workspaces is excellent

Title: Re: Perfect match for drawing ... Habsburg 3x4x13,5" ship
Post by: Borys on October 26, 2009, 12:45:59 PM
Or a 3x4x15" version of the piccie:
KKK Schlachtshiff
laid down 1920 (Engine 1916)

Displacement:
   33 241 t light; 35 260 t standard; 36 892 t normal; 38 198 t full load

Dimensions: Length overall / water x beam x draught
   670,00 ft / 670,00 ft x 110,00 ft x 30,00 ft (normal load)
   204,22 m / 204,22 m x 33,53 m  x 9,14 m

Armament:
      12 - 15,00" / 381 mm guns (3x4 guns), 1 950,00lbs / 884,51kg shells, 1920 Model
     Breech loading guns in turrets (on barbettes)
     on centreline, evenly spread
     Aft Main mounts separated by engine room
      24 - 5,30" / 135 mm guns in single mounts, 75,00lbs / 34,02kg shells, 1920 Model
     Breech loading guns in casemate mounts
     on side, all amidships
     24 guns in hull casemates - Limited use in heavy seas
      4 - 3,00" / 76,2 mm guns in single mounts, 13,50lbs / 6,12kg shells, 1920 Model
     Anti-aircraft guns in deck mounts
     on side, evenly spread, all raised mounts
      8 - 1,25" / 31,8 mm guns (4x2 guns), 1,00lbs / 0,45kg shells, 1920 Model
     Anti-aircraft guns in deck mounts
     on side, evenly spread, all raised mounts
   Weight of broadside 25 262 lbs / 11 459 kg
   Shells per gun, main battery: 90

Armour:
   - Belts:      Width (max)   Length (avg)      Height (avg)
   Main:   14,0" / 356 mm   445,00 ft / 135,64 m   12,00 ft / 3,66 m
   Ends:   4,00" / 102 mm   225,00 ft / 68,58 m   12,00 ft / 3,66 m
   Upper:   8,00" / 203 mm   445,00 ft / 135,64 m   9,00 ft / 2,74 m
     Main Belt covers 102% of normal length

   - Torpedo Bulkhead:
      1,50" / 38 mm   445,00 ft / 135,64 m   43,00 ft / 13,11 m

   - Gun armour:   Face (max)   Other gunhouse (avg)   Barbette/hoist (max)
   Main:   14,0" / 356 mm   9,00" / 229 mm      13,0" / 330 mm
   2nd:   2,00" / 51 mm   1,00" / 25 mm      1,00" / 25 mm

   - Armour deck: 3,50" / 89 mm, Conning tower: 15,00" / 381 mm

Machinery:
   Coal and oil fired boilers, steam turbines,
   Direct drive, 4 shafts, 74 893 shp / 55 870 Kw = 25,00 kts
   Range 6 500nm at 12,00 kts
   Bunker at max displacement = 2 938 tons (25% coal)

Complement:
   1 330 - 1 730

Cost:
   £9,179 million / $36,717 million

Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
   Armament: 2 762 tons, 7,5%
   Armour: 12 468 tons, 33,8%
      - Belts: 5 070 tons, 13,7%
      - Torpedo bulkhead: 1 062 tons, 2,9%
      - Armament: 2 539 tons, 6,9%
      - Armour Deck: 3 438 tons, 9,3%
      - Conning Tower: 358 tons, 1,0%
   Machinery: 2 855 tons, 7,7%
   Hull, fittings & equipment: 14 656 tons, 39,7%
   Fuel, ammunition & stores: 3 651 tons, 9,9%
   Miscellaneous weights: 500 tons, 1,4%

Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
   Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
     38 184 lbs / 17 320 Kg = 22,6 x 15,0 " / 381 mm shells or 6,4 torpedoes
   Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1,10
   Metacentric height 6,9 ft / 2,1 m
   Roll period: 17,5 seconds
   Steadiness   - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 66 %
         - Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0,54
   Seaboat quality  (Average = 1.00): 1,02

Hull form characteristics:
   Hull has rise forward of midbreak
   Block coefficient: 0,584
   Length to Beam Ratio: 6,09 : 1
   'Natural speed' for length: 25,88 kts
   Power going to wave formation at top speed: 49 %
   Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 65
   Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): 0,00 degrees
   Stern overhang: 0,00 ft / 0,00 m
   Freeboard (% = measuring location as a percentage of overall length):
      - Stem:      28,00 ft / 8,53 m
      - Forecastle (20%):   23,00 ft / 7,01 m
      - Mid (25%):      23,00 ft / 7,01 m (15,00 ft / 4,57 m aft of break)
      - Quarterdeck (15%):   15,00 ft / 4,57 m
      - Stern:      15,00 ft / 4,57 m
      - Average freeboard:   17,40 ft / 5,30 m
   Ship tends to be wet forward

Ship space, strength and comments:
   Space   - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 101,4%
      - Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 118,8%
   Waterplane Area: 53 102 Square feet or 4 933 Square metres
   Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 90%
   Structure weight / hull surface area: 214 lbs/sq ft or 1 043 Kg/sq metre
   Hull strength (Relative):
      - Cross-sectional: 0,97
      - Longitudinal: 1,29
      - Overall: 1,00
   Hull space for machinery, storage, compartmentation is adequate
   Room for accommodation and workspaces is adequate