Territory Count

[Kaiser Kirk]

So "extensive hinterlands" would suggest to me that a place like Puerto Rico won't work.  One province, even if it is adjacent to some other holdings. 

Which would be fine, it's a base and not a building locale.

Difference between the Proposed rule : An Enclave must be a Port Symbol.

...and the Conceptual basis for it.
Without revising the map or adding lots of detailed clauses, I don't think fine tuning the matter further is wise.
Folks can disagree however, and we could revisit the wording.

In the event, Puerto Rico lacks even a Port Symbol, I presume you mean a tad West at Hispaniola. Which at least is 4 provinces. 

[Jefgte]

...*IF we were doing this from scratch, I would be in favor of only 2 Enclaves.
  - BUT...3 means Jefgte only 'looses' 2 IC, and 4 means he can build +1.
  Asking for Player Vote : 2, 3, or 4 ?...

Byzantium's latest IC to add count gives:
4 Bases (3 IC) => + 12 IC
7 harbors (1 IC) => + 7 IC
Total => + 19 IC

-------------------------

I'm fine with that redistribution and look forward to the Byzantine invasion of West Australia.

Rocky is right.
I think Byzantium will conquer West Australia.

[Kaiser Kirk]

Byzantium's latest IC to add count gives:
4 Bases (3 IC) => + 12 IC
7 harbors (1 IC) => + 7 IC
Total => + 19 IC

-------------------------

I think there has been a misunderstanding.

The +1 IC/Harbor symbol is not the current proposal.

It was one option, the enclave idea was the second option.

From my understanding of this thread, the enclave option is the one more desired.

If others have a different view, please say so.

Parthia was prioritizing good harbors....and has a ton of Port Symbols.

Voting
At this time we have votes for 3, 3 or 4, and 4 Enclaves allowed.

That would be +9 or +12 IC, and space for 6 or 8 BP.

For places like Rome's Texas holdings, or Norse Canada that would be a lot of 'overseas' BP in one place.
So I am inclined to vote for 3 Enclaves.

timeline
I will give it a little time, I've communicated with Snip recently, and he sounds like he is pretty busy with other things.
But I want the Mod Emeritus to have time to comment.

I will probably write up the final rule proposal language the 21st-22nd

That way it will be ready for 1929.

[Jefgte]

I prefer to stay with 49 colonies and 98 IC.
The 11 surplus IC investing beyond the rules represent $130.
I will invest them in 1 additional BP ($90)
The remaining $40 will be invested in IC Homeland.

($90 and $40 can be adjusted to make a round account in BP or IC homeland).
--------------

I am seriously considering conquering Western Australia.
It would be desirable to create these small Navy.

[Kaiser Kirk]

I prefer to stay with 49 colonies and 98 IC.
The 11 surplus IC investing beyond the rules represent $130.
I will invest them in 1 additional BP ($90)
The remaining $40 will be invested in IC Homeland.

($90 and $40 can be adjusted to make a round account in BP or IC homeland).
--------------

That is fine as well.

I think we're still proceeding with the Enclave concept, and you could have built those up instead.

I am seriously considering conquering Western Australia.
It would be desirable to create these small Navy.

Western Australia is owned by a pair of large NPCs - Rajasthan and Laksmanavati.
They are not very weak.  I expect when I do Snip's math, they will prove to have mid-sized navies.

They normally do not cooperate with each other.
War against both at once may be difficult, but Byzantine is a large power.

I have other things right now that demand my energy.
If you wish to attack them, I will likely ask for a volunteer to moderate the war.

[Jefgte]

I prefer to stay with 49 colonies and 98 IC.
The 11 surplus IC investing beyond the rules represent $130.
I will invest them in 1 additional BP ($90)
The remaining $40 will be invested in IC Homeland.

($90 and $40 can be adjusted to make a round account in BP or IC homeland).
--------------
That is fine as well.

I rework 1928H2 report like that.

...Western Australia is owned by a pair of large NPCs - Rajasthan and Laksmanavati.
They are not very weak.  I expect when I do Snip's math, they will prove to have mid-sized navies...

I thought they only had small coastal navies.
Some big monitors, gunboats, DDs and MTBs.

[The Rock Doctor]

I think I designed ACs and CLs for one...or maybe both...of those NPCs.

So "extensive hinterlands" would suggest to me that a place like Puerto Rico won't work.  One province, even if it is adjacent to some other holdings. 

Which would be fine, it's a base and not a building locale.

Difference between the Proposed rule : An Enclave must be a Port Symbol.

...and the Conceptual basis for it.
Without revising the map or adding lots of detailed clauses, I don't think fine tuning the matter further is wise.
Folks can disagree however, and we could revisit the wording.

In the event, Puerto Rico lacks even a Port Symbol, I presume you mean a tad West at Hispaniola. Which at least is 4 provinces.

Whoops.  Well then Puerto Rico is definitely out.

[The Rock Doctor]

I suspect I would use Newport News and Lagos for sure.

The third choice is more likely Montevideo than a Caribbean location because the latter's economy seems more transport/export driven than heavy industry.

[TacCovert4]

Looks at entirety of territory....."Am I a joke to you?"

;D

[Jefgte]

I carried out a redistribution of IC, certain groups of colonies had too many, others not enough.

So with 98 IC for 49 colonies, the 1928H2 report becomes:
- Colonial IC: 109 => 98
- $ colonials recovered => + 90
- Investment in Byzantium => $90 which provides + 2 new BP
- investment in homeland IC => $5
- Budget with 109 IC was $282.55
- Budget with 98 IC becomes $262.55

[The Rock Doctor]

I might be able to sim a war in December or thereabouts, but there's just a bit too much going on in October for me.

[TacCovert4]

I might be able to sim a war in December or thereabouts, but there's just a bit too much going on in October for me.

By December I can help, and maybe even get the opfor navy caught up.  Do Jef the same favor he did me.

[Kaiser Kirk]

...Western Australia is owned by a pair of large NPCs - Rajasthan and Laksmanavati.
They are not very weak.  I expect when I do Snip's math, they will prove to have mid-sized navies...

I thought they only had small coastal navies.
Some big monitors, gunboats, DDs and MTBs.

I had a longer reply, but hit a wrong key and it went away.

Snip's Design of NPCs
- Exact power levels secret, he did not even want their relative power disclosed, but I have issues with that.
- Each assigned a general power level, that is based on the current average of the 6 starting PC nations.
- Each assigned ratios of Army/ Navy etc.
- Snips idea was the NPC exact power could then be determined when war was near.

- Everyone should know the Horde has a larger army than PCs, but a small coastal navy.
- Japan, China, and Azteca All started as NPCs... powerful ones.
- Maya is just a rank below those three.

The various NPC descriptions have a very short 'naval summary'..which was correct when written.

So, Byzantine is a top power, and should win vs. either
But expect a land war in Australia, and the need to secure your SLOC.
Since Rajasthan and Laksmanivati are somewhat hostile to each other, expect a fair number of troops and some fortifications.

As I recall your Amphibious tech is dated, so you'll need to attack overland,
which may require more Army and Deployment points than the IC there will support.
So keeping the SLOC open may matter.

War Timing : 
Once the decision is made to go to war,  then we work on specifics of armies/fleets. I think the Deccan is partially made. Khyrses made some non-canon Rajasthani.

If no one has time to Mod, then a war can still happen if the player wants, but we turn more to random dice rolls than actual battle- not nearly as satisfying.

[Jefgte]

...Snip's Design of NPCs
- Exact power levels secret, he did not even want their relative power disclosed, but I have issues with that.
- Each assigned a general power level, that is based on the current average of the 6 starting PC nations.
- Each assigned ratios of Army/ Navy etc.
- Snips idea was the NPC exact power could then be determined when war was near...

I envisage the conquest in the early 1930s.
These 2 nations only have one harbor (base). They can't just have a small Navy.

[Kaiser Kirk]

I carried out a redistribution of IC, certain groups of colonies had too many, others not enough.

So with 98 IC for 49 colonies, the 1928H2 report becomes:
- Colonial IC: 109 => 98
- $ colonials recovered => + 90
- Investment in Byzantium => $90 which provides + 1 new BP
- investment in homeland IC => $25
- Budget with 109 IC was $282.55
- Budget with 98 IC becomes $262.55

I suggest not re-working 1928.5
I hope to have the enclave rule finalized in time for 1929.0

At that point, you can allocate part of the investment to the extra IC into the Byzantine Enclaves,
and then decide where you want the rest of the investment.