Home Rule

[Darman]

Thoughts on Irish Home Rule being granted in 1894, just prior to the 1895 election where a Unionist govt was elected OTL? 

[Kaiser Kirk]

I guess it depends on the history you want.

If the 1893 Home rule act gets passed in 1894 over the rabid opposition of the unionists,
To change the outcome, you'd have to change the conservative control of the house of lords. That could be fine depending on how you want to run the UK.

Then 1895 may see a Catholic* parliament in Dublin and Ulster seriously upset. Considering the later Ulster reaction to the prospect of home rule, you'd probably see the Ulster Volunteers form and the Ulster convenant, with the north trying to refuse Dublin's authority and break free of the South.

Now if the conservative recapture parliament in 1895- which would be more likely if home rule is granted- yee olde pendulum swing - you could see them trying to reverse home rule, or less likely go ahead and carve out Ulster. Either of which would defeat the purpose in passing it.

*I think it's important to stress the depth of the Catholic and Protestant divide.
As the tale has come down to me, my Great Grandfather was born in Clare in 1880. He was illiterate. His father was not, and had been going to Veterinary school in Edinburgh. Unfortunately, he went off and got disowned.
For what?
Well, he married a lady who was catholic, and was born to parents who were catholic *BUT* had been born protestant.
That tainted her and made her unsuitable for a chieftans son. So he was disowned...at least that's the family history I know. 
There were very old, strong and very deep divides there.

You are of course free to just make it work- that's the joy of running your own country, but you asked for input, and that's my 2 cents :)


My 2 cents.

[snip]

I think Kirk's religion comments make a lot of sense. That fundamental divide is always going to be an issue whether or not Home Rule is a thing. While it might smooth things over on the surface, there will continue to be issues underneath that could cause lots of friction.

[Darman]

I'm very well aware of the complexities of the Irish Home Rule issues, I'm simply exploring what other opinions on the matter are because I've never really given Home Rule prior to WW1 a great deal of thought before.  The Conservatives do win in the election of 1895 (by winning I mean they became the larger part of the subsequently formed Government), in large part because of the Liberals attempt to pass a Home Rule act in Parliament (and the subsequent desertion of the Liberal Unionists from the Liberal Party).  So not much has changed there.  You are correct that I'd have to alter the status quo in the House of Lords somehow.  What I was considering was drafting a new Home Rule Bill that I could fluff away as being a good enough compromise that it pissed everyone off equally enough that they decided to pass the bill simply to piss off their own political opponents. 

As to the divide between Protestants and Catholics, I know it exists, and that it is a very very strong force to reckon with, but I also believe that while the Ulstermen would complain and probably riot and rebel, there would be sufficient continued control by England over Ireland (I don't wish to grant her complete independence after all! where would the English army recruit from?) that the Royal Army and Royal Irish Constabulary would be able to put down any outright insurrections by the Orangemen. 

[Kaiser Kirk]

So you've got a fun scenario.
The liberals pass Home Rule. Then they loose in the 1895 Elections.

In Ireland, Catholics get elected in Dublin. The Ulster volunteers, demanding to be treated as simply English citizens, offer armed resistance to the Home Rule implementation by the British Government.

Meanwhile in England the Conservatives opposed to home rule are faced with revolt by people demanding to be part of England, an argument the Conservatives agree with.

I doubt you'd see much political will for the implementation of Home Rule in Ulster, leading to splitting the island. There would also probably be conservative attempts to rescind the Home Rule legislation. These two factors would lead to a feeling of betrayal in Ireland and the conviction that their liberty will never be secure within the United Kingdom. Cue the Easter revolt and ...hey it's early enough my Grandma's brothers probably aren't old enough to get arrested for being IRA, though the old cottage could still get burned :)

Meanwhile over in Scotland, I had a greatgrandpa that had to leave because he entered into a "mixed" marriage...Catholic and Protestant. Scandalous !