Ships of the Imperial Russian Navy: 1900

[Delta Force]

It's easy to come up with new designs for the other ships, but I'm kind of stuck on how to improve or play around with the battleships while keeping with the pre-dreadnought and semi-dreadnought design. I've already done heavy casemates and stacked turrets and I'm not sure how else to experiment with battleships or even really improve the Borodino design. Is it common in Navalism to occasionally end up simply producing improved versions of old ships, similar to the British practice with early generation dreadnoughts?

[KWorld]

It's easy to come up with new designs for the other ships, but I'm kind of stuck on how to improve or play around with the battleships while keeping with the pre-dreadnought and semi-dreadnought design. I've already done heavy casemates and stacked turrets and I'm not sure how else to experiment with battleships or even really improve the Borodino design. Is it common in Navalism to occasionally end up simply producing improved versions of old ships, similar to the British practice with early generation dreadnoughts?

That's certainly along the lines that I'm planning for the USN, barring a war that shows that something they've done won't work.  The initial design of stacked turrets will be discovered to have flaws, those flaws will be fixed, but by the time any third generation would be on the boards they'll likely be replaced by early dreadnoughts.

[Tanthalas]

thats esentialy what im doing, I didnt make any real changes other than switching from 8"-9.2" for the secondaries and upgrading the main guns to L45s on my REs

It's easy to come up with new designs for the other ships, but I'm kind of stuck on how to improve or play around with the battleships while keeping with the pre-dreadnought and semi-dreadnought design. I've already done heavy casemates and stacked turrets and I'm not sure how else to experiment with battleships or even really improve the Borodino design. Is it common in Navalism to occasionally end up simply producing improved versions of old ships, similar to the British practice with early generation dreadnoughts?

That's certainly along the lines that I'm planning for the USN, barring a war that shows that something they've done won't work.  The initial design of stacked turrets will be discovered to have flaws, those flaws will be fixed, but by the time any third generation would be on the boards they'll likely be replaced by early dreadnoughts.

[KWorld]

The one "innnovation" the USN is looking at is a small armored cruiser, armed with the in-development 7"/45, probably in twin turrets.  This design would be larger than the current protected cruisers, but smaller than even the older USS New York class ACs (let alone the new Pittsburghs or Salt Lake Citiys).  It would probably be an armored cruiser design, rather than a protected cruiser, with the advent of mixed-firing boilers in the near future.

[It's not really an innovation, the MN has been building some turret-equipped smallish protected cruisers.]

[Delta Force]

I'm not sure how large of an issue the high recoil is with this design, seeing as the ship doesn't use superfiring turrets anyways.

First Generation Dreadnought, Russia Battleship laid down 1907 (Engine 1905)

Displacement:
   13,320 t light; 13,981 t standard; 15,140 t normal; 16,068 t full load

Dimensions: Length (overall / waterline) x beam x draught (normal/deep)
   (440.00 ft / 440.00 ft) x 74.00 ft x (26.25 / 27.59 ft)
   (134.11 m / 134.11 m) x 22.56 m  x (8.00 / 8.41 m)

Armament:
      12 - 12.00" / 305 mm 45.0 cal guns - 749.99lbs / 340.19kg shells, 60 per gun
     Breech loading guns in turret on barbette mounts, 1907 Model
     4 x Triple mounts on centreline ends, evenly spread
      16 - 3.00" / 76.2 mm 50.0 cal guns - 11.99lbs / 5.44kg shells, 360 per gun
     Breech loading guns in casemate mounts, 1907 Model
     16 x Single mounts on sides, evenly spread
      12 hull mounts in casemates- Limited use in heavy seas
      8 - 3.00" / 76.2 mm 50.0 cal guns - 11.99lbs / 5.44kg shells, 360 per gun
     Quick firing guns in deck mounts, 1907 Model
     8 x Single mounts on centreline ends, evenly spread
      8 raised mounts
      Weight of broadside 9,288 lbs / 4,213 kg

Armour:
   - Belts:      Width (max)   Length (avg)      Height (avg)
   Main:   12.0" / 305 mm   286.00 ft / 87.17 m   12.00 ft / 3.66 m
   Ends:   5.00" / 127 mm   154.00 ft / 46.94 m   12.00 ft / 3.66 m
   Upper:   5.00" / 127 mm   286.00 ft / 87.17 m   8.00 ft / 2.44 m
     Main Belt covers 100 % of normal length

   - Gun armour:   Face (max)   Other gunhouse (avg)   Barbette/hoist (max)
   Main:   12.0" / 305 mm   5.00" / 127 mm      10.0" / 254 mm
   4th:   3.00" / 76 mm         -               -
   5th:   1.00" / 25 mm         -               -

   - Armoured deck - single deck:
   For and Aft decks: 2.00" / 51 mm
   Forecastle: 2.00" / 51 mm  Quarter deck: 2.00" / 51 mm

   - Conning towers: Forward 10.00" / 254 mm, Aft 10.00" / 254 mm

Machinery:
   Oil fired boilers, steam turbines,
   Direct drive, 3 shafts, 14,000 shp / 10,444 Kw = 18.01 kts
   Range 8,000nm at 10.00 kts
   Bunker at max displacement = 2,088 tons

Complement:
   682 - 887

Cost:
   £1.610 million / $6.439 million

Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
   Armament: 1,925 tons, 12.7 %
      - Guns: 1,925 tons, 12.7 %
   Armour: 5,339 tons, 35.3 %
      - Belts: 2,675 tons, 17.7 %
      - Armament: 1,495 tons, 9.9 %
      - Armour Deck: 905 tons, 6.0 %
      - Conning Towers: 264 tons, 1.7 %
   Machinery: 1,061 tons, 7.0 %
   Hull, fittings & equipment: 4,676 tons, 30.9 %
   Fuel, ammunition & stores: 1,820 tons, 12.0 %
   Miscellaneous weights: 320 tons, 2.1 %
      - Hull below water: 20 tons
      - Above deck: 300 tons

Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
   Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
     16,971 lbs / 7,698 Kg = 19.6 x 12.0 " / 305 mm shells or 2.3 torpedoes
   Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1.08
   Metacentric height 3.7 ft / 1.1 m
   Roll period: 16.1 seconds
   Steadiness   - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 74 %
         - Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 1.00
   Seaboat quality  (Average = 1.00): 1.50

Hull form characteristics:
   Hull has a flush deck,
     a ram bow and a cruiser stern
   Block coefficient (normal/deep): 0.620 / 0.626
   Length to Beam Ratio: 5.95 : 1
   'Natural speed' for length: 20.98 kts
   Power going to wave formation at top speed: 45 %
   Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 49
   Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): -10.00 degrees
   Stern overhang: 0.00 ft / 0.00 m
   Freeboard (% = length of deck as a percentage of waterline length):
            Fore end,    Aft end
      - Forecastle:   20.00 %,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m
      - Forward deck:   30.00 %,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m
      - Aft deck:   35.00 %,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m
      - Quarter deck:   15.00 %,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m
      - Average freeboard:      16.00 ft / 4.88 m
   Ship tends to be wet forward

Ship space, strength and comments:
   Space   - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 80.4 %
      - Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 108.4 %
   Waterplane Area: 24,262 Square feet or 2,254 Square metres
   Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 88 %
   Structure weight / hull surface area: 155 lbs/sq ft or 758 Kg/sq metre
   Hull strength (Relative):
      - Cross-sectional: 0.93
      - Longitudinal: 2.08
      - Overall: 1.01
   Excellent machinery, storage, compartmentation space
   Adequate accommodation and workspace room
   Ship has slow, easy roll, a good, steady gun platform
   Excellent seaboat, comfortable, can fire her guns in the heaviest weather

Miscellaneous weight:
20 tons hull below water is for 6 x 18 inch torpedo tubes (2 fore, 2 aft, 1 each broadside) with 3 x 1,250 pound torpedoes each.
300 tons above deck reserve weight.

[Tanthalas]

it isnt bad, the Recoil is a bit of an issue (at a 1.00 you would be restricted to end on fire only and take any damage you couldnt even do that), and the earliest you could realisticly lay it down would be like 1909 (a tripple turret takes 18 months or 3 turns to develop)

[KWorld]

I'd be a bit worried about whether 3" guns would be enough to stop the increasingly large TBDs that you'd be facing by the time it's in service.  I'd go with at least 4" guns for secondaries if not larger (3" as tertiaries are fine, but too small IMO as secondaries).

[Delta Force]

Russia may construct a few dreadnought armored cruisers, ships with a more balanced approach to firepower, armor, and speed than the dreadnoughts and battlecruisers. Russia's geography doesn't really favor battlecruisers anyways, except in the Pacific, as the Baltic and Black Seas are rather constrained locations for 25 knot battlelines to be fighting.

Dreadnought Armored Cruiser, Russia Armored Cruiser laid down 1907 (Engine 1905)

Displacement:
   13,750 t light; 14,273 t standard; 15,488 t normal; 16,460 t full load

Dimensions: Length (overall / waterline) x beam x draught (normal/deep)
   (540.00 ft / 540.00 ft) x 76.00 ft x (24.00 / 25.19 ft)
   (164.59 m / 164.59 m) x 23.16 m  x (7.32 / 7.68 m)

Armament:
      8 - 10.00" / 254 mm 50.0 cal guns - 500.01lbs / 226.80kg shells, 60 per gun
     Breech loading guns in turret on barbette mounts, 1907 Model
     4 x Twin mounts on centreline ends, evenly spread
      2 raised mounts - superfiring
      16 - 4.72" / 120 mm 50.0 cal guns - 50.00lbs / 22.68kg shells, 180 per gun
     Breech loading guns in casemate mounts, 1907 Model
     16 x Single mounts on sides, evenly spread
      16 hull mounts in casemates- Limited use in heavy seas
      Weight of broadside 4,800 lbs / 2,177 kg

Armour:
   - Belts:      Width (max)   Length (avg)      Height (avg)
   Main:   10.0" / 254 mm   352.00 ft / 107.29 m   12.00 ft / 3.66 m
   Ends:   4.00" / 102 mm   188.00 ft / 57.30 m   12.00 ft / 3.66 m
   Upper:   4.00" / 102 mm   352.00 ft / 107.29 m   8.00 ft / 2.44 m
     Main Belt covers 100 % of normal length

   - Gun armour:   Face (max)   Other gunhouse (avg)   Barbette/hoist (max)
   Main:   10.0" / 254 mm   4.00" / 102 mm      8.00" / 203 mm
   4th:   3.00" / 76 mm         -               -

   - Armoured deck - single deck:
   For and Aft decks: 2.00" / 51 mm
   Forecastle: 1.50" / 38 mm  Quarter deck: 1.50" / 38 mm

   - Conning towers: Forward 10.00" / 254 mm, Aft 10.00" / 254 mm

Machinery:
   Oil fired boilers, steam turbines,
   Direct drive, 3 shafts, 34,650 shp / 25,849 Kw = 23.30 kts
   Range 8,000nm at 10.00 kts
   Bunker at max displacement = 2,187 tons

Complement:
   693 - 902

Cost:
   £1.336 million / $5.344 million

Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
   Armament: 1,196 tons, 7.7 %
      - Guns: 1,196 tons, 7.7 %
   Armour: 4,852 tons, 31.3 %
      - Belts: 2,624 tons, 16.9 %
      - Armament: 941 tons, 6.1 %
      - Armour Deck: 1,019 tons, 6.6 %
      - Conning Towers: 268 tons, 1.7 %
   Machinery: 2,625 tons, 16.9 %
   Hull, fittings & equipment: 4,756 tons, 30.7 %
   Fuel, ammunition & stores: 1,738 tons, 11.2 %
   Miscellaneous weights: 320 tons, 2.1 %
      - Hull below water: 20 tons
      - Above deck: 300 tons

Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
   Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
     17,703 lbs / 8,030 Kg = 35.4 x 10.0 " / 254 mm shells or 2.4 torpedoes
   Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1.07
   Metacentric height 3.8 ft / 1.2 m
   Roll period: 16.4 seconds
   Steadiness   - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 75 %
         - Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0.56
   Seaboat quality  (Average = 1.00): 1.23

Hull form characteristics:
   Hull has a flush deck,
     a ram bow and a cruiser stern
   Block coefficient (normal/deep): 0.550 / 0.557
   Length to Beam Ratio: 7.11 : 1
   'Natural speed' for length: 23.24 kts
   Power going to wave formation at top speed: 48 %
   Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 61
   Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): -10.00 degrees
   Stern overhang: 0.00 ft / 0.00 m
   Freeboard (% = length of deck as a percentage of waterline length):
            Fore end,    Aft end
      - Forecastle:   20.00 %,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m
      - Forward deck:   30.00 %,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m
      - Aft deck:   35.00 %,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m
      - Quarter deck:   15.00 %,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m
      - Average freeboard:      16.00 ft / 4.88 m
   Ship tends to be wet forward

Ship space, strength and comments:
   Space   - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 83.3 %
      - Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 126.0 %
   Waterplane Area: 28,651 Square feet or 2,662 Square metres
   Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 103 %
   Structure weight / hull surface area: 133 lbs/sq ft or 649 Kg/sq metre
   Hull strength (Relative):
      - Cross-sectional: 0.97
      - Longitudinal: 1.29
      - Overall: 1.00
   Excellent machinery, storage, compartmentation space
   Excellent accommodation and workspace room
   Ship has slow, easy roll, a good, steady gun platform
   Good seaboat, rides out heavy weather easily

Miscellaneous weight:
20 tons hull below water is for 6 x 18 inch torpedo tubes (2 fore, 2 aft, 1 each broadside) with 3 x 1,250 pound torpedoes each.
300 tons above deck reserve weight.

[Delta Force]

I'm considering a pair of battlecruisers for Pacific service. Given the rigors of Pacific service the ships are essentially the Bismarcks of the era, capable of fighting other capital ships just as well as prowling the oceans for weeks as a powerful commerce raider. They can thus tie down a vast portion of an enemy fleet in a hunt across the world's oceans, outfighting any cruisers, outrunning any battleships, and outlasting any pursuing battlecruisers. These would be perfect ships for a combination of triple expansion and turbine engines, but I'm not sure how to properly simulate that in game (it would most likely be year 1905 turbines with year 1909 triple expansion engines).

Gigant Class Battlecruiser, Russia Battlecruiser laid down 1907 (Engine 1909)

Displacement:
   16,550 t light; 17,246 t standard; 18,802 t normal; 20,046 t full load

Dimensions: Length (overall / waterline) x beam x draught (normal/deep)
   (540.00 ft / 540.00 ft) x 80.00 ft x (24.00 / 25.33 ft)
   (164.59 m / 164.59 m) x 24.38 m  x (7.32 / 7.72 m)

Armament:
      8 - 10.00" / 254 mm 50.0 cal guns - 500.01lbs / 226.80kg shells, 90 per gun
     Breech loading guns in turret on barbette mounts, 1907 Model
     4 x Twin mounts on centreline ends, evenly spread
      16 - 4.72" / 120 mm 45.0 cal guns - 50.00lbs / 22.68kg shells, 270 per gun
     Breech loading guns in casemate mounts, 1907 Model
     16 x Single mounts on sides, evenly spread
      16 hull mounts in casemates- Limited use in heavy seas
      Weight of broadside 4,800 lbs / 2,177 kg

Armour:
   - Belts:      Width (max)   Length (avg)      Height (avg)
   Main:   12.0" / 305 mm   352.00 ft / 107.29 m   12.00 ft / 3.66 m
   Ends:   4.00" / 102 mm   188.00 ft / 57.30 m   12.00 ft / 3.66 m
   Upper:   4.00" / 102 mm   352.00 ft / 107.29 m   8.00 ft / 2.44 m
     Main Belt covers 100 % of normal length

   - Gun armour:   Face (max)   Other gunhouse (avg)   Barbette/hoist (max)
   Main:   12.0" / 305 mm   5.00" / 127 mm      10.0" / 254 mm
   4th:   3.00" / 76 mm         -               -

   - Armoured deck - single deck:
   For and Aft decks: 2.00" / 51 mm
   Forecastle: 2.00" / 51 mm  Quarter deck: 2.00" / 51 mm

   - Conning towers: Forward 10.00" / 254 mm, Aft 10.00" / 254 mm

Machinery:
   Oil fired boilers, complex reciprocating steam engines,
   Direct drive, 3 shafts, 58,140 ihp / 43,373 Kw = 25.49 kts
   Range 12,000nm at 10.00 kts
   Bunker at max displacement = 2,800 tons

Complement:
   802 - 1,043

Cost:
   £1.629 million / $6.516 million

Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
   Armament: 1,175 tons, 6.2 %
      - Guns: 1,175 tons, 6.2 %
   Armour: 5,704 tons, 30.3 %
      - Belts: 3,029 tons, 16.1 %
      - Armament: 1,154 tons, 6.1 %
      - Armour Deck: 1,217 tons, 6.5 %
      - Conning Towers: 305 tons, 1.6 %
   Machinery: 4,066 tons, 21.6 %
   Hull, fittings & equipment: 5,285 tons, 28.1 %
   Fuel, ammunition & stores: 2,251 tons, 12.0 %
   Miscellaneous weights: 320 tons, 1.7 %
      - Hull below water: 20 tons
      - Above deck: 300 tons

Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
   Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
     20,772 lbs / 9,422 Kg = 41.5 x 10.0 " / 254 mm shells or 2.2 torpedoes
   Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1.15
   Metacentric height 4.7 ft / 1.4 m
   Roll period: 15.6 seconds
   Steadiness   - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 75 %
         - Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0.41
   Seaboat quality  (Average = 1.00): 1.14

Hull form characteristics:
   Hull has a flush deck,
     a ram bow and a cruiser stern
   Block coefficient (normal/deep): 0.635 / 0.641
   Length to Beam Ratio: 6.75 : 1
   'Natural speed' for length: 23.24 kts
   Power going to wave formation at top speed: 56 %
   Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 66
   Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): -10.00 degrees
   Stern overhang: 0.00 ft / 0.00 m
   Freeboard (% = length of deck as a percentage of waterline length):
            Fore end,    Aft end
      - Forecastle:   20.00 %,  26.00 ft / 7.92 m,  22.00 ft / 6.71 m
      - Forward deck:   30.00 %,  22.00 ft / 6.71 m,  18.00 ft / 5.49 m
      - Aft deck:   35.00 %,  18.00 ft / 5.49 m,  18.00 ft / 5.49 m
      - Quarter deck:   15.00 %,  18.00 ft / 5.49 m,  18.00 ft / 5.49 m
      - Average freeboard:      19.72 ft / 6.01 m

Ship space, strength and comments:
   Space   - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 93.8 %
      - Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 146.7 %
   Waterplane Area: 32,631 Square feet or 3,032 Square metres
   Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 100 %
   Structure weight / hull surface area: 128 lbs/sq ft or 623 Kg/sq metre
   Hull strength (Relative):
      - Cross-sectional: 0.96
      - Longitudinal: 1.44
      - Overall: 1.00
   Adequate machinery, storage, compartmentation space
   Excellent accommodation and workspace room
   Ship has slow, easy roll, a good, steady gun platform

Miscellaneous weight:
20 tons hull below water is for 6 x 18 inch torpedo tubes (2 fore, 2 aft, 1 each broadside) with 3 x 1,250 pound torpedoes each.
300 tons above deck reserve weight.

[Delta Force]

My revised first generation dreadnought, which is actually lighter than my existing semi-dreadnoughts.

First Generation Dreadnoughtv2, Russia Battleship laid down 1907 (Engine 1909)

Displacement:
   12,650 t light; 13,293 t standard; 14,163 t normal; 14,859 t full load

Dimensions: Length (overall / waterline) x beam x draught (normal/deep)
   (440.00 ft / 440.00 ft) x 74.00 ft x (24.00 / 24.99 ft)
   (134.11 m / 134.11 m) x 22.56 m  x (7.32 / 7.62 m)

Armament:
      8 - 12.00" / 305 mm 45.0 cal guns - 749.99lbs / 340.19kg shells, 60 per gun
     Breech loading guns in turret on barbette mounts, 1907 Model
     4 x Twin mounts on centreline ends, evenly spread
      16 - 4.72" / 120 mm 45.0 cal guns - 50.00lbs / 22.68kg shells, 360 per gun
     Breech loading guns in casemate mounts, 1907 Model
     16 x Single mounts on sides, evenly spread
      12 hull mounts in casemates- Limited use in heavy seas
      Weight of broadside 6,800 lbs / 3,084 kg

Armour:
   - Belts:      Width (max)   Length (avg)      Height (avg)
   Main:   12.0" / 305 mm   286.00 ft / 87.17 m   12.00 ft / 3.66 m
   Ends:   5.00" / 127 mm   154.00 ft / 46.94 m   12.00 ft / 3.66 m
   Upper:   5.00" / 127 mm   286.00 ft / 87.17 m   8.00 ft / 2.44 m
     Main Belt covers 100 % of normal length

   - Gun armour:   Face (max)   Other gunhouse (avg)   Barbette/hoist (max)
   Main:   12.0" / 305 mm   5.00" / 127 mm      10.0" / 254 mm
   4th:   3.00" / 76 mm         -               -

   - Armoured deck - single deck:
   For and Aft decks: 2.00" / 51 mm
   Forecastle: 2.00" / 51 mm  Quarter deck: 2.00" / 51 mm

   - Conning towers: Forward 10.00" / 254 mm, Aft 10.00" / 254 mm

Machinery:
   Oil fired boilers, complex reciprocating steam engines,
   Direct drive, 3 shafts, 24,660 ihp / 18,396 Kw = 21.00 kts
   Range 8,000nm at 10.00 kts
   Bunker at max displacement = 1,566 tons

Complement:
   648 - 843

Cost:
   £1.375 million / $5.502 million

Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
   Armament: 1,369 tons, 9.7 %
      - Guns: 1,369 tons, 9.7 %
   Armour: 5,070 tons, 35.8 %
      - Belts: 2,680 tons, 18.9 %
      - Armament: 1,221 tons, 8.6 %
      - Armour Deck: 917 tons, 6.5 %
      - Conning Towers: 252 tons, 1.8 %
   Machinery: 1,724 tons, 12.2 %
   Hull, fittings & equipment: 4,166 tons, 29.4 %
   Fuel, ammunition & stores: 1,513 tons, 10.7 %
   Miscellaneous weights: 320 tons, 2.3 %
      - Hull below water: 20 tons
      - Above deck: 300 tons

Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
   Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
     16,475 lbs / 7,473 Kg = 19.1 x 12.0 " / 305 mm shells or 2.2 torpedoes
   Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1.18
   Metacentric height 4.3 ft / 1.3 m
   Roll period: 14.9 seconds
   Steadiness   - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 57 %
         - Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0.59
   Seaboat quality  (Average = 1.00): 1.15

Hull form characteristics:
   Hull has a flush deck,
     a ram bow and a cruiser stern
   Block coefficient (normal/deep): 0.634 / 0.639
   Length to Beam Ratio: 5.95 : 1
   'Natural speed' for length: 20.98 kts
   Power going to wave formation at top speed: 53 %
   Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 50
   Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): -10.00 degrees
   Stern overhang: 0.00 ft / 0.00 m
   Freeboard (% = length of deck as a percentage of waterline length):
            Fore end,    Aft end
      - Forecastle:   20.00 %,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m
      - Forward deck:   30.00 %,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m
      - Aft deck:   35.00 %,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m
      - Quarter deck:   15.00 %,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m,  16.00 ft / 4.88 m
      - Average freeboard:      16.00 ft / 4.88 m
   Ship tends to be wet forward

Ship space, strength and comments:
   Space   - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 83.4 %
      - Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 115.6 %
   Waterplane Area: 24,586 Square feet or 2,284 Square metres
   Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 92 %
   Structure weight / hull surface area: 137 lbs/sq ft or 667 Kg/sq metre
   Hull strength (Relative):
      - Cross-sectional: 0.93
      - Longitudinal: 1.80
      - Overall: 1.00
   Adequate machinery, storage, compartmentation space
   Adequate accommodation and workspace room

Miscellaneous weight:
20 tons hull below water is for 6 x 18 inch torpedo tubes (2 fore, 2 aft, 1 each broadside) with 3 x 1,250 pound torpedoes each.
300 tons above deck reserve weight.

[snip]

Well, it would help if we get to 1907 first. Things may be different then you expect tech wise.

[Delta Force]

Well, it would help if we get to 1907 first. Things may be different then you expect tech wise.

Now that I've read the rules in depth it seems more likely that the ships will be a 1908 or even (for the superfiring ships) 1909 project. What do you think about the general concepts though?

[KWorld]

On the 1st generation DN, if they're intended for the Black Sea or the Baltic, their low seakeeping is OK.  If they're intended for the Pacific or a Northern fleet, you may need to raise the freeboard a bit.  Also, I'm not sure about the "ends but no superfiring" layout of the main battery.  It will certainly work, but you might be able to make better use of space by moving one turret behind the bridge (barrels over the forward boiler room).

The BC reminds me of my Montana designs, though it carries better armor than they do.

Not sure about the AC design, the speed benefit is awfully low for the price you're paying vs the 1st gen DN.

[Delta Force]

So what about the issue of engine type? Are reciprocating engines more demanding of maintenance than turbines or are the maintenance issues and loss of speed associated with reciprocating engines simply due to the burning of coal instead of oil? Would an oil burning reciprocating engine be more reliable?

[Tanthalas]

the issue for most countries is going to be that if you keep developing VTEs your going to short yourself somewhere else (not somthing I object to honestly).  the VTE tech and the Turbine tech are obviously seperate (for various reasons).

as to the reliability of the types, Turbines allow for greater speed at lower weight with similar maintnence requirements because they are so much more eficient (not in terms of fuel but in terms of design) there is just alot less to go wrong with them (other than worries about a blade coming off and making life exciting)

So what about the issue of engine type? Are reciprocating engines more demanding of maintenance than turbines or are the maintenance issues and loss of speed associated with reciprocating engines simply due to the burning of coal instead of oil? Would an oil burning reciprocating engine be more reliable?