Feasibility Study - Fuel based Upkeep

Nobody · September 13, 2012, 11:39:31 AM

Quote from: snip on September 13, 2012, 09:56:51 AM
Can you post the one that you have? I lost mine in a hard drive crash. Tan, if you could post yours as well so we have another copy.

I had to compress the files because they were too big.
1916H1 should be the original file I got from P3D, 1920H1 was adapted and modified by me over time.

snip · September 13, 2012, 11:41:31 AM

The Navy page of those is where I would like the modification done.

Nobody · September 13, 2012, 03:33:26 PM

Well, this should be it. I hope I didn't make any mistakes.

Making it easily adaptable was more challenging than I expected. The two files only differ in the chosen values for the constants. The second one has the smaller values, the other the previous higher ones.

One more thing. In N3 we had in one case partially increased the upkeep due to war. We could now do that selectively for the fuel costs, if we wanted that.

snip · September 13, 2012, 03:45:11 PM

OK, looking good to me at first glance. Still want to play around with it a bit more and continue to mull over weather I want to force spreadsheets onto evey player (just due to the way this works I feel it nessesitates a spreadsheet) before I commit one way or another. If others wish to play around with numbers and fleets and post results, that would be appreciated.

Jefgte · September 13, 2012, 03:55:30 PM

Congrats for your work Nob.
But, I don't know what spreadsheet to choose (?)
:-\

Jef ;)

Tanthalas · September 13, 2012, 04:23:58 PM

Ok enterd the entire Freking Rohinium Navy into it...

Cost per turn of Maintnence for Navy on Active status N3 is 24.05 or roughly 11% of the budget, Under the proposed system it would be 42.55 or roughly 20% of the budget. Think we are a bit high still here, while Rohan could have aforded it, it would have put a serious crimp in my 2 IC per turn economy growth.

Rohan with the existing fleet is $14.74876356 in the red. I think its still to high and I dont supose we could get it to round up (seriously thats obviously $14.75)?

Nobody · September 13, 2012, 04:55:11 PM

Quote from: Tanthalas on September 13, 2012, 04:23:58 PM
Cost per turn of Maintnence for Navy on Active status N3 is 24.05 or roughly 11% of the budget, Under the proposed system it would be 42.55 or roughly 20% of the budget. Think we are a bit high still here, while Rohan could have aforded it, it would have put a serious crimp in my 2 IC per turn economy growth.

We are likely going to have rebalanced income, so that might not be problem.
Do you have a lot of small or very fast ships, like destroyers or battlecruiser in your fleet?
Growth is supposed to become cheaper.

I see my proposal mostly as a "framework provider". I made pretty much all variables the system depends on available in the upper right inside those blue colored boxes. So aside from the possibility to change the income side you could try to find a better balance between fixed and variable cost and their overall level.

QuoteRohan with the existing fleet is $14.74876356 in the red. I think its still to high and I dont supose we could get it to round up (seriously thats obviously $14.75)?

I only always see them rounded to 2 digits. Since I noticed your excessive number of digits before, may I ask which program and version are you using?

Tanthalas · September 13, 2012, 05:05:00 PM

I think Rohan had the largest Battlecruiser force in the sim at 12 of them (alhtough the last 3 were realy fast BBs), and I wasnt kiding about 100 Destroyers, all over 1K Tons all capable of 30+ knots and supercruising at 18 knots.

I use MS Office 10 so I assume its Excel 10

snip · September 26, 2012, 11:55:56 PM

So, where are we on finalizing the numbers for this?

Tanthalas · September 27, 2012, 01:19:36 AM

Quote from: snip on September 26, 2012, 11:55:56 PM
So, where are we on finalizing the numbers for this?

IDK im set at .01 per 1K tons light (I assume its light) and .10 per 10K tons fuel its still higher than the old system, but manageable...

Nobody · September 27, 2012, 02:39:41 AM

N3 upkeep was 1, 5 and 10% of the ships price, which is 1$ per 1000 tons, right?

Quote from: Tanthalas on September 27, 2012, 01:19:36 AM
Quote from: snip on September 26, 2012, 11:55:56 PM
So, where are we on finalizing the numbers for this?

IDK im set at .01 per 1K tons light (I assume its light) and .10 per 10K tons fuel its still higher than the old system, but manageable...

These numbers appear to be a bit low to me. Reason might be an error I just found... :-[
I'm thinking in the direction of .25 const and .15 for fuel (both per 10000 tons). With those upkeep should in peacetimes lower and in wartimes higher than in N3.

Will upload a corrected version once I have corrected the original.

snip · September 27, 2012, 09:05:33 AM

What is the error? Just curious as my schedule at work is completely empty and I have the UK numbers in front of me.

Tanthalas · September 27, 2012, 09:22:32 AM

Using original N3 upkep system on 149K light Displacement fleet (my test fleet based on ships I actualy intend to build although the numbers are now off), I get $3.74, with the new system using the numbers presented I get $7.25. this feals to high to me still (although more workable than the original numbers)

snip · September 27, 2012, 09:32:10 AM

with all my fleet sitting at active, I get $25.15 Seems ok to me.

Nobody · September 27, 2012, 09:43:39 AM

Quote from: snip on September 27, 2012, 09:05:33 AM
What is the error? Just curious as my schedule at work is completely empty and I have the UK numbers in front of me.

I used the wrong function in two places, resulting in always using the very high wartime upkeep. I've corrected that, but before I upload, anything else I should update, because we have changed it?