France ships

Tanthalas · October 03, 2012, 10:49:17 AM

as snip pointed out the 305mm guns need to be L35 instead of L45, I would also proly drop the 194mm guns to L40 instead of L45. Other than that looks damn good, and I realise france proly had the listed Guns OTL but the rules restrict us untill 1900.

KWorld · October 03, 2012, 11:00:01 AM

The 194mms are legal as 45 caliber guns, the rules have 8-10" guns being available as L45s in 1895.

Tanthalas · October 03, 2012, 11:52:45 AM

Yes they are, however Logi and I were both directed to change the 8/45s on our 1896 BBs to 8/40 Why I dont know but it is what we were told to do.

and thats without geting into the whole mess of other issues I have bumped into with startup ships...

Quote from: KWorld on October 03, 2012, 11:00:01 AM
The 194mms are legal as 45 caliber guns, the rules have 8-10" guns being available as L45s in 1895.

Jefgte · October 03, 2012, 03:53:40 PM

I use the 305/45cal mlle 1893

I could choose
194/45mlle1887 or 194/40 mlle 1893

...from NavWeapons

Jef

Jefgte · October 03, 2012, 04:56:48 PM

Chatelmont, France PC3 laid down 1897

Displacement:
   5 000 t light; 5 213 t standard; 5 954 t normal; 6 547 t full load

Dimensions: Length (overall / waterline) x beam x draught (normal/deep)
   (393.50 ft / 390.50 ft) x 45.92 ft (Bulges 55.77 ft) x (17.36 / 19.02 ft)
   (119.94 m / 119.02 m) x 14.00 m (Bulges 17.00 m) x (5.29 / 5.80 m)

Armament:
2 - 6.45" / 164 mm 45.0 cal guns - 135.32lbs / 61.38kg shells, 140 per gun
     Breech loading guns in turret on barbette mounts, 1897 Model
     2 x Single mounts on centreline ends, evenly spread
4 - 6.45" / 164 mm 45.0 cal guns - 135.31lbs / 61.38kg shells, 140 per gun
     Breech loading guns in casemate mounts, 1897 Model
     4 x Single mounts on side ends, evenly spread
8 - 3.95" / 100 mm 45.0 cal guns - 31.08lbs / 14.10kg shells, 220 per gun
     Quick firing guns in deck mounts, 1897 Model
     8 x Single mounts on sides, evenly spread
4 - 0.30" / 7.6 mm 55.0 cal guns - 0.01lbs / 0.01kg shells, 500 per gun
     Machine guns in deck mounts, 1897 Model
     4 x Single mounts on side ends, evenly spread
      4 raised mounts
Weight of broadside 1 061 lbs / 481 kg
Main Torpedoes
2 - 15.8" / 400 mm, 13.13 ft / 4.00 m torpedoes - 0.340 t each, 0.680 t total
   submerged bow & stern tubes
2nd Torpedoes
2 - 15.8" / 400 mm, 13.13 ft / 4.00 m torpedoes - 0.340 t each, 0.680 t total
   submerged side tubes

Armour:
- Belts:      Width (max)   Length (avg)      Height (avg)
   Main:   1.20" / 30 mm   390.40 ft / 118.99 m   7.22 ft / 2.20 m
     Main Belt covers 154 % of normal length

- Gun armour:   Face (max)   Other gunhouse (avg)   Barbette/hoist (max)
   Main:   2.95" / 75 mm   0.77" / 20 mm      1.77" / 45 mm
   2nd:   1.77" / 45 mm     -         1.77" / 45 mm
   3rd:   0.40" / 10 mm     -           -

- Armoured deck - multiple decks:
   For and Aft decks: 1.77" / 45 mm
   Forecastle: 0.77" / 20 mm Quarter deck: 0.77" / 20 mm

- Conning towers: Forward 3.95" / 100 mm, Aft 1.20" / 30 mm

Machinery:
   Coal fired boilers, simple reciprocating steam engines,
   Direct drive, 3 shafts, 14 380 ihp / 10 728 Kw = 21.01 kts
   Range 7 000nm at 10.00 kts
   Bunker at max displacement = 1 334 tons (100% coal)

Complement:
   338 - 440

Cost:
   £0.604 million / $2.417 million

Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
   Armament: 204 tons, 3.4 %
     - Guns: 202 tons, 3.4 %
     - Weapons: 3 tons, 0.0 %
   Armour: 597 tons, 10.0 %
     - Belts: 126 tons, 2.1 %
     - Armament: 56 tons, 0.9 %
     - Armour Deck: 378 tons, 6.3 %
     - Conning Towers: 36 tons, 0.6 %
   Machinery: 2 615 tons, 43.9 %
   Hull, fittings & equipment: 1 543 tons, 25.9 %
   Fuel, ammunition & stores: 954 tons, 16.0 %
   Miscellaneous weights: 42 tons, 0.7 %
     - On freeboard deck: 42 tons

Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
   Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
     3 092 lbs / 1 402 Kg = 23.0 x 6.5 " / 164 mm shells or 2.7 torpedoes
   Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1.83
   Metacentric height 4.1 ft / 1.3 m
   Roll period: 11.5 seconds
   Steadiness   - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 78 %
         - Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0.14
   Seaboat quality (Average = 1.00): 1.55

Hull form characteristics:
   Hull has a flush deck,
     a ram bow and a cruiser stern
   Block coefficient (normal/deep): 0.551 / 0.553
   Length to Beam Ratio: 7.00 : 1
   'Natural speed' for length: 19.76 kts
   Power going to wave formation at top speed: 51 %
   Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 50
   Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): -5.00 degrees
   Stern overhang: 1.00 ft / 0.30 m
   Freeboard (% = length of deck as a percentage of waterline length):
            Fore end,    Aft end
     - Forecastle:   15.00 %, 15.42 ft / 4.70 m, 14.45 ft / 4.40 m
     - Forward deck:   30.00 %, 14.45 ft / 4.40 m, 13.45 ft / 4.10 m
     - Aft deck:   40.00 %, 13.45 ft / 4.10 m, 13.45 ft / 4.10 m
     - Quarter deck:   15.00 %, 13.45 ft / 4.10 m, 13.45 ft / 4.10 m
     - Average freeboard:      13.81 ft / 4.21 m
   Ship tends to be wet forward

Ship space, strength and comments:
   Space   - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 153.8 %
      - Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 96.5 %
   Waterplane Area: 12 527 Square feet or 1 164 Square metres
   Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 92 %
   Structure weight / hull surface area: 80 lbs/sq ft or 390 Kg/sq metre
   Hull strength (Relative):
      - Cross-sectional: 0.96
      - Longitudinal: 1.43
      - Overall: 1.00
   Cramped machinery, storage, compartmentation space
   Adequate accommodation and workspace room
   Ship has slow, easy roll, a good, steady gun platform
   Excellent seaboat, comfortable, can fire her guns in the heaviest weather

Delta Force · October 03, 2012, 05:11:21 PM

I know the 164 mm is historical but why not either increase or decrease caliber? It is much slower than 6 inch guns while not offering much greater destructive capability.

Jefgte · October 03, 2012, 05:19:46 PM

QuoteI know the 164 mm is historical but why not either increase or decrease caliber? It is much slower than 6 inch guns while not offering much greater destructive capability.

All these old French calibers are new for me.
Since many years, I SS with the classic 3-4-5-6-8-12-14-15-16".

I want to test with these curious historical calibers...

;D & see what did they made on your ships ;D

Jef ;)

Delta Force · October 03, 2012, 05:27:53 PM

Quote from: Jefgte on October 03, 2012, 05:19:46 PM
QuoteI know the 164 mm is historical but why not either increase or decrease caliber? It is much slower than 6 inch guns while not offering much greater destructive capability.

All these old French calibers are new for me.
Since many years, I SS with the classic 3-4-5-6-8-12-14-15-16".

I want to test with these curious historical calibers...

;D & see what did they made on your ships ;D

Jef ;)

France certainly has a wide variety. Although Russia was heavily influenced by France in terms of warship design it had a rather unique armament system and skipped the intermediate calibers many nations went for (they had only 6 inch, 8 inch, 10 inch, and 12 inch for the larger guns). By contrast of course many nations had calibers between the 6 and the 8, the 8 and the 10, and sometimes between the 10 and the 12 inch guns. Russia certainly had a large amount of standardization of calibers and types for such a large navy.

Jefgte · October 03, 2012, 05:42:56 PM

4-6 or 8 AC2 cruisers are in the plan;

AC2, France AC2 laid down 1898

Displacement:
   7 500 t light; 7 864 t standard; 8 802 t normal; 9 553 t full load

Dimensions: Length (overall / waterline) x beam x draught (normal/deep)
   (463.50 ft / 460.50 ft) x 59.05 ft x (19.70 / 21.06 ft)
   (141.27 m / 140.36 m) x 18.00 m x (6.01 / 6.42 m)

Armament:
2 - 7.65" / 194 mm 45.0 cal guns - 225.76lbs / 102.40kg shells, 120 per gun
     Breech loading guns in turret on barbette mounts, 1898 Model
     2 x Single mounts on centreline ends, evenly spread
8 - 7.65" / 194 mm 45.0 cal guns - 225.76lbs / 102.40kg shells, 120 per gun
     Breech loading guns in casemate mounts, 1898 Model
     8 x Single mounts on side ends, evenly spread
8 - 3.95" / 100 mm 45.0 cal guns - 31.08lbs / 14.10kg shells, 220 per gun
     Quick firing guns in casemate mounts, 1898 Model
     8 x Single mounts on sides, evenly spread
4 - 2.56" / 65.0 mm 55.0 cal guns - 9.05lbs / 4.11kg shells, 350 per gun
     Quick firing guns in deck mounts, 1898 Model
     4 x Single mounts on side ends, evenly spread
      4 raised mounts
4 - 0.30" / 7.6 mm 55.0 cal guns - 0.01lbs / 0.01kg shells, 500 per gun
     Machine guns in deck mounts, 1898 Model
     4 x Single mounts on side ends, evenly spread
      4 raised mounts
Weight of broadside 2 542 lbs / 1 153 kg
Main Torpedoes
2 - 15.8" / 400 mm, 13.13 ft / 4.00 m torpedoes - 0.340 t each, 0.680 t total
   submerged bow & stern tubes
2nd Torpedoes
2 - 15.8" / 400 mm, 13.13 ft / 4.00 m torpedoes - 0.340 t each, 0.680 t total
   submerged side tubes

Armour:
- Belts:      Width (max)   Length (avg)      Height (avg)
   Main:   3.95" / 100 mm   400.25 ft / 122.00 m   7.87 ft / 2.40 m
   Ends:   1.77" / 45 mm     60.00 ft / 18.29 m   7.87 ft / 2.40 m
   Upper:   1.77" / 45 mm   400.25 ft / 122.00 m   9.85 ft / 3.00 m
     Main Belt covers 134 % of normal length

- Gun armour:   Face (max)   Other gunhouse (avg)   Barbette/hoist (max)
   Main:   3.95" / 100 mm   0.77" / 20 mm      1.77" / 45 mm
   2nd:   2.95" / 75 mm     -         1.77" / 45 mm
   3rd:   0.77" / 20 mm     -         0.77" / 20 mm

- Armoured deck - multiple decks:
   For and Aft decks: 1.77" / 45 mm
   Forecastle: 0.77" / 20 mm Quarter deck: 0.77" / 20 mm

- Conning towers: Forward 3.95" / 100 mm, Aft 1.20" / 30 mm

Machinery:
   Coal fired boilers, simple reciprocating steam engines,
   Direct drive, 3 shafts, 17 580 ihp / 13 115 Kw = 21.11 kts
   Range 7 000nm at 10.00 kts
   Bunker at max displacement = 1 689 tons (100% coal)

Complement:
   453 - 590

Cost:
   £0.848 million / $3.390 million

Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
   Armament: 446 tons, 5.1 %
     - Guns: 444 tons, 5.0 %
     - Weapons: 3 tons, 0.0 %
   Armour: 1 539 tons, 17.5 %
     - Belts: 809 tons, 9.2 %
     - Armament: 108 tons, 1.2 %
     - Armour Deck: 576 tons, 6.5 %
     - Conning Towers: 47 tons, 0.5 %
   Machinery: 3 168 tons, 36.0 %
   Hull, fittings & equipment: 2 277 tons, 25.9 %
   Fuel, ammunition & stores: 1 302 tons, 14.8 %
   Miscellaneous weights: 70 tons, 0.8 %
     - On freeboard deck: 70 tons

Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
   Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
     5 880 lbs / 2 667 Kg = 26.3 x 7.7 " / 194 mm shells or 3.7 torpedoes
   Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1.59
   Metacentric height 5.0 ft / 1.5 m
   Roll period: 11.1 seconds
   Steadiness   - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 80 %
         - Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0.27
   Seaboat quality (Average = 1.00): 1.59

Hull form characteristics:
   Hull has a flush deck,
     a ram bow and a cruiser stern
   Block coefficient (normal/deep): 0.575 / 0.584
   Length to Beam Ratio: 7.80 : 1
   'Natural speed' for length: 21.46 kts
   Power going to wave formation at top speed: 46 %
   Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 50
   Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): -5.00 degrees
   Stern overhang: 1.00 ft / 0.30 m
   Freeboard (% = length of deck as a percentage of waterline length):
            Fore end,    Aft end
     - Forecastle:   18.00 %, 15.75 ft / 4.80 m, 14.77 ft / 4.50 m
     - Forward deck:   28.00 %, 14.77 ft / 4.50 m, 13.77 ft / 4.20 m
     - Aft deck:   38.00 %, 13.77 ft / 4.20 m, 13.77 ft / 4.20 m
     - Quarter deck:   16.00 %, 13.77 ft / 4.20 m, 13.77 ft / 4.20 m
     - Average freeboard:      14.16 ft / 4.32 m
   Ship tends to be wet forward

Ship space, strength and comments:
   Space   - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 133.0 %
      - Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 114.2 %
   Waterplane Area: 19 428 Square feet or 1 805 Square metres
   Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 95 %
   Structure weight / hull surface area: 90 lbs/sq ft or 439 Kg/sq metre
   Hull strength (Relative):
      - Cross-sectional: 0.97
      - Longitudinal: 1.26
      - Overall: 1.00
   Cramped machinery, storage, compartmentation space
   Adequate accommodation and workspace room
   Ship has slow, easy roll, a good, steady gun platform
   Excellent seaboat, comfortable, can fire her guns in the heaviest weather

Jefgte · October 03, 2012, 05:49:03 PM

QuoteFrance certainly has a wide variety. Although Russia was heavily influenced by France in terms of warship design it had a rather unique armament system and skipped the intermediate calibers many nations went for (they had only 6 inch, 8 inch, 10 inch, and 12 inch for the larger guns). By contrast of course many nations had calibers between the 6 and the 8, the 8 and the 10, and sometimes between the 10 and the 12 inch guns. Russia certainly had a large amount of standardization of calibers and types for such a large navy.

An other interest in our game is to have original guns.
If we All choose -3-4-5-6-8-10-12"...
SS are too standardised by rules & France, USN or Russia could built quietly RN ships.

Jef ;)

Jefgte · October 04, 2012, 04:41:21 AM

All France TBs- 3 class of 18 ships - 54 TBs in all.

300t-TB1, France 300t-TB1 laid down 1896

Displacement:
   300 t light; 309 t standard; 345 t normal; 374 t full load

Dimensions: Length (overall / waterline) x beam x draught (normal/deep)
   (210.00 ft / 210.00 ft) x 21.00 ft x (7.20 / 7.58 ft)
   (64.01 m / 64.01 m) x 6.40 m x (2.19 / 2.31 m)

Armament:
2 - 2.56" / 65.0 mm 76.0 cal guns - 9.50lbs / 4.31kg shells, 150 per gun
     Quick firing guns in deck mounts, 1896 Model
     2 x Single mounts on centreline ends, evenly spread
2 - 0.30" / 7.6 mm 55.0 cal guns - 0.01lbs / 0.00kg shells, 500 per gun
     Machine guns in deck mounts, 1896 Model
     2 x Single mounts on sides, forward deck aft
Weight of broadside 19 lbs / 9 kg
Main Torpedoes
1 - 17.7" / 450 mm, 13.13 ft / 4.00 m torpedo - 0.407 t total
   submerged bow tube
2nd Torpedoes
2 - 17.7" / 450 mm, 13.13 ft / 4.00 m torpedoes - 0.407 t each, 0.814 t total
   In 2 sets of deck mounted side rotating tubes

Armour:
- Gun armour:   Face (max)   Other gunhouse (avg)   Barbette/hoist (max)
   Main:   0.20" / 5 mm     -           -

Machinery:
   Coal fired boilers, complex reciprocating steam engines,
   Direct drive, 2 shafts, 5 120 ihp / 3 820 Kw = 24.40 kts
   Range 1 800nm at 10.00 kts
   Bunker at max displacement = 65 tons (100% coal)
     Caution: Delicate, lightweight machinery

Complement:
   39 - 52

Cost:
   £0.041 million / $0.165 million

Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
   Armament: 9 tons, 2.6 %
     - Guns: 6 tons, 1.9 %
     - Weapons: 2 tons, 0.7 %
   Armour: 1 tons, 0.3 %
     - Armament: 1 tons, 0.3 %
   Machinery: 207 tons, 60.0 %
   Hull, fittings & equipment: 81 tons, 23.4 %
   Fuel, ammunition & stores: 45 tons, 12.9 %
   Miscellaneous weights: 3 tons, 0.9 %
     - On freeboard deck: 3 tons

Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
   Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
     71 lbs / 32 Kg = 8.5 x 2.6 " / 65 mm shells or 0.4 torpedoes
   Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1.48
   Metacentric height 0.9 ft / 0.3 m
   Roll period: 9.1 seconds
   Steadiness   - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 73 %
         - Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0.06
   Seaboat quality (Average = 1.00): 1.01

Hull form characteristics:
   Hull has raised forecastle,
     a ram bow and a cruiser stern
   Block coefficient (normal/deep): 0.380 / 0.391
   Length to Beam Ratio: 10.00 : 1
   'Natural speed' for length: 14.49 kts
   Power going to wave formation at top speed: 62 %
   Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 72
   Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): 0.00 degrees
   Stern overhang: 0.00 ft / 0.00 m
   Freeboard (% = length of deck as a percentage of waterline length):
            Fore end,    Aft end
     - Forecastle:   20.00 %, 9.50 ft / 2.90 m, 10.50 ft / 3.20 m
     - Forward deck:   30.00 %, 8.00 ft / 2.44 m, 7.50 ft / 2.29 m
     - Aft deck:   25.00 %, 7.50 ft / 2.29 m, 7.00 ft / 2.13 m
     - Quarter deck:   25.00 %, 7.00 ft / 2.13 m, 6.50 ft / 1.98 m
     - Average freeboard:      7.85 ft / 2.39 m
   Ship tends to be wet forward

Ship space, strength and comments:
   Space   - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 207.2 %
      - Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 93.0 %
   Waterplane Area: 2 679 Square feet or 249 Square metres
   Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 20 %
   Structure weight / hull surface area: 18 lbs/sq ft or 88 Kg/sq metre
   Hull strength (Relative):
      - Cross-sectional: 0.50
      - Longitudinal: 1.17
      - Overall: 0.54
   Extremely poor machinery, storage, compartmentation space
   Adequate accommodation and workspace room
   Ship has slow, easy roll, a good, steady gun platform
---

TB2-450t, France TB2-450t laid down 1898

Displacement:
   450 t light; 466 t standard; 520 t normal; 564 t full load

Dimensions: Length (overall / waterline) x beam x draught (normal/deep)
   (255.00 ft / 255.00 ft) x 25.50 ft x (7.37 / 7.76 ft)
   (77.72 m / 77.72 m) x 7.77 m x (2.25 / 2.36 m)

Armament:
2 - 3.95" / 100 mm 45.0 cal guns - 31.09lbs / 14.10kg shells, 100 per gun
     Quick firing guns in deck mounts, 1898 Model
     2 x Single mounts on centreline ends, evenly spread
2 - 2.56" / 65.0 mm 55.0 cal guns - 9.06lbs / 4.11kg shells, 150 per gun
     Quick firing guns in deck mounts, 1898 Model
     2 x Single mounts on sides, forward deck aft
2 - 0.30" / 7.6 mm 55.0 cal guns - 0.01lbs / 0.00kg shells, 500 per gun
     Machine guns in deck mounts, 1898 Model
     2 x Single mounts on sides, forward deck centre
Weight of broadside 80 lbs / 36 kg
Main Torpedoes
2 - 15.8" / 400 mm, 13.13 ft / 4.00 m torpedoes - 0.353 t each, 0.706 t total
   In 2 sets of deck mounted carriage/fixed tubes
2nd Torpedoes
2 - 15.8" / 400 mm, 13.13 ft / 4.00 m torpedoes - 0.353 t each, 0.706 t total
   In 2 sets of deck mounted centre rotating tubes

Armour:
- Gun armour:   Face (max)   Other gunhouse (avg)   Barbette/hoist (max)
   Main:   0.20" / 5 mm     -           -

Machinery:
   Coal fired boilers, complex reciprocating steam engines,
   Direct drive, 2 shafts, 6 800 ihp / 5 073 Kw = 25.13 kts
   Range 2 200nm at 10.00 kts
   Bunker at max displacement = 99 tons (100% coal)
     Caution: Delicate, lightweight machinery

Complement:
   53 - 70

Cost:
   £0.062 million / $0.249 million

Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
   Armament: 18 tons, 3.4 %
     - Guns: 16 tons, 3.0 %
     - Weapons: 2 tons, 0.4 %
   Armour: 1 tons, 0.2 %
     - Armament: 1 tons, 0.2 %
   Machinery: 303 tons, 58.2 %
   Hull, fittings & equipment: 118 tons, 22.7 %
   Fuel, ammunition & stores: 70 tons, 13.5 %
   Miscellaneous weights: 10 tons, 1.9 %
     - On freeboard deck: 10 tons

Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
   Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
     123 lbs / 56 Kg = 4.0 x 4.0 " / 100 mm shells or 0.6 torpedoes
   Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1.50
   Metacentric height 1.3 ft / 0.4 m
   Roll period: 9.5 seconds
   Steadiness   - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 74 %
         - Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0.12
   Seaboat quality (Average = 1.00): 1.02

Hull form characteristics:
   Hull has raised forecastle,
     a ram bow and a cruiser stern
   Block coefficient (normal/deep): 0.380 / 0.391
   Length to Beam Ratio: 10.00 : 1
   'Natural speed' for length: 15.97 kts
   Power going to wave formation at top speed: 59 %
   Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 72
   Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): 0.00 degrees
   Stern overhang: 0.00 ft / 0.00 m
   Freeboard (% = length of deck as a percentage of waterline length):
            Fore end,    Aft end
     - Forecastle:   20.00 %, 10.25 ft / 3.12 m, 11.25 ft / 3.43 m
     - Forward deck:   30.00 %, 8.75 ft / 2.67 m, 8.25 ft / 2.51 m
     - Aft deck:   25.00 %, 8.25 ft / 2.51 m, 7.75 ft / 2.36 m
     - Quarter deck:   25.00 %, 7.75 ft / 2.36 m, 7.25 ft / 2.21 m
     - Average freeboard:      8.60 ft / 2.62 m
   Ship tends to be wet forward

Ship space, strength and comments:
   Space   - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 195.5 %
      - Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 96.4 %
   Waterplane Area: 3 950 Square feet or 367 Square metres
   Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 23 %
   Structure weight / hull surface area: 21 lbs/sq ft or 100 Kg/sq metre
   Hull strength (Relative):
      - Cross-sectional: 0.50
      - Longitudinal: 0.82
      - Overall: 0.53
   Cramped machinery, storage, compartmentation space
   Adequate accommodation and workspace room
   Ship has slow, easy roll, a good, steady gun platform

---

TB3-500t, France TB3-500t laid down 1899

Displacement:
   500 t light; 516 t standard; 595 t normal; 659 t full load

Dimensions: Length (overall / waterline) x beam x draught (normal/deep)
   (266.00 ft / 266.00 ft) x 26.60 ft x (7.75 / 8.26 ft)
   (81.08 m / 81.08 m) x 8.11 m x (2.36 / 2.52 m)

Armament:
2 - 3.95" / 100 mm 45.0 cal guns - 31.09lbs / 14.10kg shells, 100 per gun
     Quick firing guns in deck mounts, 1899 Model
     2 x Single mounts on centreline ends, evenly spread
2 - 2.56" / 65.0 mm 55.0 cal guns - 9.06lbs / 4.11kg shells, 120 per gun
     Quick firing guns in deck mounts, 1899 Model
     2 x Single mounts on sides, forward deck aft
2 - 0.30" / 7.6 mm 55.0 cal guns - 0.01lbs / 0.00kg shells, 500 per gun
     Machine guns in deck mounts, 1899 Model
     2 x Single mounts on sides, forward deck centre
Weight of broadside 80 lbs / 36 kg
Main Torpedoes
2 - 15.8" / 400 mm, 13.13 ft / 4.00 m torpedoes - 0.367 t each, 0.734 t total
   In 2 sets of deck mounted carriage/fixed tubes
2nd Torpedoes
2 - 15.8" / 400 mm, 13.13 ft / 4.00 m torpedoes - 0.367 t each, 0.734 t total
   In 2 sets of deck mounted centre rotating tubes

Armour:
- Gun armour:   Face (max)   Other gunhouse (avg)   Barbette/hoist (max)
   Main:   0.20" / 5 mm     -           -

Machinery:
   Coal fired boilers, complex reciprocating steam engines,
   Direct drive, 2 shafts, 7 584 ihp / 5 658 Kw = 25.40 kts
   Range 3 000nm at 10.00 kts
   Bunker at max displacement = 142 tons (100% coal)
     Caution: Delicate, lightweight machinery

Complement:
   59 - 78

Cost:
   £0.070 million / $0.280 million

Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
   Armament: 18 tons, 3.0 %
     - Guns: 16 tons, 2.6 %
     - Weapons: 2 tons, 0.4 %
   Armour: 1 tons, 0.2 %
     - Armament: 1 tons, 0.2 %
   Machinery: 346 tons, 58.1 %
   Hull, fittings & equipment: 125 tons, 21.0 %
   Fuel, ammunition & stores: 96 tons, 16.0 %
   Miscellaneous weights: 10 tons, 1.7 %
     - On freeboard deck: 10 tons

Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
   Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
     137 lbs / 62 Kg = 4.4 x 4.0 " / 100 mm shells or 0.6 torpedoes
   Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1.61
   Metacentric height 1.5 ft / 0.5 m
   Roll period: 9.1 seconds
   Steadiness   - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 72 %
         - Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0.09
   Seaboat quality (Average = 1.00): 1.00

Hull form characteristics:
   Hull has raised forecastle,
     a ram bow and a cruiser stern
   Block coefficient (normal/deep): 0.380 / 0.394
   Length to Beam Ratio: 10.00 : 1
   'Natural speed' for length: 16.31 kts
   Power going to wave formation at top speed: 58 %
   Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 72
   Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): 0.00 degrees
   Stern overhang: 0.00 ft / 0.00 m
   Freeboard (% = length of deck as a percentage of waterline length):
            Fore end,    Aft end
     - Forecastle:   20.00 %, 10.00 ft / 3.05 m, 11.00 ft / 3.35 m
     - Forward deck:   30.00 %, 8.50 ft / 2.59 m, 8.00 ft / 2.44 m
     - Aft deck:   25.00 %, 8.00 ft / 2.44 m, 7.50 ft / 2.29 m
     - Quarter deck:   25.00 %, 7.50 ft / 2.29 m, 7.20 ft / 2.19 m
     - Average freeboard:      8.37 ft / 2.55 m
   Ship tends to be wet forward

Ship space, strength and comments:
   Space   - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 193.9 %
      - Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 92.2 %
   Waterplane Area: 4 298 Square feet or 399 Square metres
   Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 24 %
   Structure weight / hull surface area: 20 lbs/sq ft or 99 Kg/sq metre
   Hull strength (Relative):
      - Cross-sectional: 0.50
      - Longitudinal: 0.71
      - Overall: 0.51
   Cramped machinery, storage, compartmentation space
   Adequate accommodation and workspace room
   Ship has slow, easy roll, a good, steady gun platform

Trial Speed: 28kts
Bonus:2.6

Jefgte · October 04, 2012, 06:10:09 AM

The second class of Aviso Torpilleurs
Specialy built to work in the Colonies
AT2-8 ships in the plan.

AT2, France Aviso Torpilleur - Station TB laid down 1899

Displacement:
   1 500 t light; 1 553 t standard; 1 752 t normal; 1 911 t full load

Dimensions: Length (overall / waterline) x beam x draught (normal/deep)
   (301.55 ft / 298.55 ft) x 32.82 ft x (11.38 / 12.19 ft)
   (91.91 m / 91.00 m) x 10.00 m x (3.47 / 3.72 m)

Armament:
4 - 3.95" / 100 mm 45.0 cal guns - 31.12lbs / 14.12kg shells, 200 per gun
     Breech loading guns in deck mounts, 1899 Model
     4 x Single mounts on centreline, evenly spread
2 - 2.56" / 65.0 mm 40.0 cal guns - 8.04lbs / 3.65kg shells, 500 per gun
     Quick firing guns in deck mounts, 1899 Model
     2 x Single mounts on sides amidships
4 - 0.30" / 7.6 mm 55.0 cal guns - 0.01lbs / 0.01kg shells, 600 per gun
     Machine guns in deck mounts, 1899 Model
     4 x Single mounts on side ends, evenly spread
      2 raised mounts - superfiring
Weight of broadside 141 lbs / 64 kg
Main Torpedoes
2 - 15.8" / 400 mm, 13.13 ft / 4.00 m torpedoes - 0.340 t each, 0.680 t total
   submerged bow & stern tubes
2nd Torpedoes
2 - 15.8" / 400 mm, 13.13 ft / 4.00 m torpedoes - 0.340 t each, 0.680 t total
   In 2 sets of deck mounted side rotating tubes

Armour:
- Gun armour:   Face (max)   Other gunhouse (avg)   Barbette/hoist (max)
   Main:   0.40" / 10 mm     -           -
   2nd:   0.40" / 10 mm     -           -

Machinery:
   Coal fired boilers, complex reciprocating steam engines,
   Direct drive, 2 shafts, 7 484 ihp / 5 583 Kw = 21.20 kts
   Range 4 000nm at 10.00 kts
   Bunker at max displacement = 358 tons (100% coal)

Complement:
   135 - 176

Cost:
   £0.192 million / $0.769 million

Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
   Armament: 25 tons, 1.4 %
     - Guns: 23 tons, 1.3 %
     - Weapons: 3 tons, 0.2 %
   Armour: 5 tons, 0.3 %
     - Armament: 5 tons, 0.3 %
   Machinery: 949 tons, 54.2 %
   Hull, fittings & equipment: 492 tons, 28.1 %
   Fuel, ammunition & stores: 252 tons, 14.4 %
   Miscellaneous weights: 28 tons, 1.6 %
     - On freeboard deck: 28 tons

Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
   Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
     724 lbs / 329 Kg = 23.5 x 4.0 " / 100 mm shells or 1.1 torpedoes
   Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1.66
   Metacentric height 2.2 ft / 0.7 m
   Roll period: 9.3 seconds
   Steadiness   - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 74 %
         - Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0.08
   Seaboat quality (Average = 1.00): 1.23

Hull form characteristics:
   Hull has rise forward of midbreak,
     a ram bow and a cruiser stern
   Block coefficient (normal/deep): 0.550 / 0.560
   Length to Beam Ratio: 9.10 : 1
   'Natural speed' for length: 17.28 kts
   Power going to wave formation at top speed: 54 %
   Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 60
   Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): -5.00 degrees
   Stern overhang: 0.00 ft / 0.00 m
   Freeboard (% = length of deck as a percentage of waterline length):
            Fore end,    Aft end
     - Forecastle:   15.00 %, 9.85 ft / 3.00 m, 11.82 ft / 3.60 m
     - Forward deck:   10.00 %, 11.82 ft / 3.60 m, 11.82 ft / 3.60 m
     - Aft deck:   55.00 %, 9.85 ft / 3.00 m, 9.85 ft / 3.00 m
     - Quarter deck:   20.00 %, 9.85 ft / 3.00 m, 9.85 ft / 3.00 m
     - Average freeboard:      10.22 ft / 3.12 m
   Ship tends to be wet forward

Ship space, strength and comments:
   Space   - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 181.8 %
      - Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 95.9 %
   Waterplane Area: 6 838 Square feet or 635 Square metres
   Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 71 %
   Structure weight / hull surface area: 47 lbs/sq ft or 230 Kg/sq metre
   Hull strength (Relative):
      - Cross-sectional: 0.97
      - Longitudinal: 1.26
      - Overall: 1.00
   Cramped machinery, storage, compartmentation space
   Adequate accommodation and workspace room
   Ship has slow, easy roll, a good, steady gun platform
   Good seaboat, rides out heavy weather easily

KWorld · October 04, 2012, 06:40:11 AM

Not really sure what the point of a colonial torpedo cruiser IS, I guess. It's unlikely that the colonists will acquire a ship that needs to be torpedoed, and they're not good at flinging shells into the bush to break up rebellious tribes. If they're to dissuade unfriendly major powers from attacking, then maybe, but I'd think some 12" coast guns might do better.

Jefgte · October 04, 2012, 08:37:58 AM

6 ships in the Plan

CP5, France CP5 laid down 1899

Displacement:
   4 500 t light; 4 674 t standard; 5 298 t normal; 5 797 t full load

Dimensions: Length (overall / waterline) x beam x draught (normal/deep)
   (391.85 ft / 388.85 ft) x 49.20 ft x (16.86 / 18.13 ft)
   (119.44 m / 118.52 m) x 15.00 m x (5.14 / 5.53 m)

Armament:
4 - 6.45" / 164 mm 45.0 cal guns - 135.31lbs / 61.38kg shells, 150 per gun
     Breech loading guns in turret on barbette mounts, 1899 Model
     2 x Twin mounts on centreline ends, evenly spread
6 - 3.95" / 100 mm 45.0 cal guns - 31.08lbs / 14.10kg shells, 200 per gun
     Quick firing guns in deck mounts, 1899 Model
     6 x Single mounts on sides, evenly spread
2 - 2.56" / 65.0 mm 45.0 cal guns - 8.46lbs / 3.84kg shells, 250 per gun
     Quick firing guns in deck mounts, 1899 Model
     2 x Single mounts on sides, forward deck aft
      2 raised mounts
2 - 0.30" / 7.6 mm 55.0 cal guns - 0.01lbs / 0.01kg shells, 400 per gun
     Machine guns in deck mounts, 1899 Model
     2 x Single mounts on sides amidships
      2 raised mounts
Weight of broadside 745 lbs / 338 kg
Main Torpedoes
2 - 15.8" / 400 mm, 13.13 ft / 4.00 m torpedoes - 0.367 t each, 0.734 t total
   submerged bow & stern tubes
2nd Torpedoes
2 - 15.8" / 400 mm, 13.13 ft / 4.00 m torpedoes - 0.367 t each, 0.734 t total
   submerged side tubes

Armour:
- Belts:      Width (max)   Length (avg)      Height (avg)
   Main:   2.95" / 75 mm   365.00 ft / 111.25 m   7.22 ft / 2.20 m
   Ends:   0.97" / 25 mm     22.00 ft / 6.71 m   7.22 ft / 2.20 m
     1.85 ft / 0.56 m Unarmoured ends
     Main Belt covers 144 % of normal length

- Gun armour:   Face (max)   Other gunhouse (avg)   Barbette/hoist (max)
   Main:   2.95" / 75 mm   0.77" / 20 mm      1.97" / 50 mm
   2nd:   0.60" / 15 mm     -           -
   3rd:   0.40" / 10 mm     -           -

- Armoured deck - single deck:
   For and Aft decks: 1.57" / 40 mm
   Forecastle: 0.77" / 20 mm Quarter deck: 0.77" / 20 mm

- Conning towers: Forward 1.97" / 50 mm, Aft 1.77" / 45 mm

Machinery:
   Coal fired boilers, complex reciprocating steam engines,
   Direct drive, 2 shafts, 13 600 ihp / 10 145 Kw = 21.13 kts
   Range 6 500nm at 10.00 kts
   Bunker at max displacement = 1 123 tons (100% coal)

Complement:
   309 - 403

Cost:
   £0.521 million / $2.083 million

Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
   Armament: 163 tons, 3.1 %
     - Guns: 160 tons, 3.0 %
     - Weapons: 3 tons, 0.1 %
   Armour: 744 tons, 14.0 %
     - Belts: 311 tons, 5.9 %
     - Armament: 56 tons, 1.1 %
     - Armour Deck: 353 tons, 6.7 %
     - Conning Towers: 24 tons, 0.5 %
   Machinery: 2 159 tons, 40.7 %
   Hull, fittings & equipment: 1 405 tons, 26.5 %
   Fuel, ammunition & stores: 798 tons, 15.1 %
   Miscellaneous weights: 30 tons, 0.6 %
     - On freeboard deck: 30 tons

Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
   Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
     2 990 lbs / 1 356 Kg = 22.3 x 6.5 " / 164 mm shells or 2.4 torpedoes
   Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1.56
   Metacentric height 3.6 ft / 1.1 m
   Roll period: 10.8 seconds
   Steadiness   - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 78 %
         - Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0.19
   Seaboat quality (Average = 1.00): 1.35

Hull form characteristics:
   Hull has a flush deck,
     a ram bow and a cruiser stern
   Block coefficient (normal/deep): 0.575 / 0.585
   Length to Beam Ratio: 7.90 : 1
   'Natural speed' for length: 19.72 kts
   Power going to wave formation at top speed: 50 %
   Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 58
   Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): -5.00 degrees
   Stern overhang: 1.00 ft / 0.30 m
   Freeboard (% = length of deck as a percentage of waterline length):
            Fore end,    Aft end
     - Forecastle:   20.00 %, 14.45 ft / 4.40 m, 12.80 ft / 3.90 m
     - Forward deck:   25.00 %, 12.80 ft / 3.90 m, 11.82 ft / 3.60 m
     - Aft deck:   35.00 %, 11.82 ft / 3.60 m, 11.82 ft / 3.60 m
     - Quarter deck:   20.00 %, 11.82 ft / 3.60 m, 11.82 ft / 3.60 m
     - Average freeboard:      12.27 ft / 3.74 m
   Ship tends to be wet forward

Ship space, strength and comments:
   Space   - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 144.2 %
      - Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 101.3 %
   Waterplane Area: 13 669 Square feet or 1 270 Square metres
   Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 93 %
   Structure weight / hull surface area: 74 lbs/sq ft or 360 Kg/sq metre
   Hull strength (Relative):
      - Cross-sectional: 0.97
      - Longitudinal: 1.26
      - Overall: 1.00
   Cramped machinery, storage, compartmentation space
   Adequate accommodation and workspace room
   Ship has slow, easy roll, a good, steady gun platform
   Good seaboat, rides out heavy weather easily

AC Dupleix turrets

Jefgte · October 04, 2012, 10:17:10 AM

The actual Plan;116 ships & 299.800t

TYPE	technos	Name	NORMAL DISP.	Qty	Tot Dis	DIM	ARMAMENT	SPEED & RANGE	ARMOR
CP1	1895	Danjoult-Dufort	3000	2	6000	101x13.4x4.61	4x140+4x100	19.1kts-6500nm/10kts	B25-D40
AC1	1895	Ariana-Aurestia	5150	2	10300	118.4x13.5/16x5.87	4x194+8x140	19.2kts-6500nm/10kts	B100-D40
BB1	1895	Belmont-Beronac-Boiscelar-Bruneval	11300t	4	45200	118x22x8.29	4x305+10x164+8x100+8x47	18kts-8500nm/10kts	B350-T330-D70


TB1	1896	TT1 to TT16	300	16	4800	64x6.4x2.19	2x65+3TTx400	24.16kts-1800nm/10kts
CP2	1896	Duvalles-Dassonville-Dentraigue -Duvillars-Darras-Denevers	3200	6	19200	105x14	6x140+4x100	19.5kts-6500nm/10kts	B25-D45
SBB1	1896	Maximilien-Monderval-Montfort-Montcoligny-Montgenet-Monsabert	6700	6	40200	110x18/20x5.27	4x274+8x140+8x100+4x47	17.9kts-6500nm/10kts	B200-D45


AT1	1897	AT1 to AT12	1500	12	18000	90x10x3.48	3x100+2x65+4TT	22kts-3700nm/10kts
CP3	1897	Chatelmont-Castillon-Chantenay-Chevalier	5000	4	20000	119x14/17x5.3	4x164+4x140+4x65	21kts-7000nm/10kts	B30-D45
BB2	1897	Leopolda-Loménie	11750	2	23500	132x18/22x7.92	4x305+8x194+16x100	18kts-8500nm/10kts	B300-D65-T350


BB2	1898	Saskia-Siegfriedkarl	11750	2	23500	132x18/22x7.92	4x305+8x194+16x100	18kts-8500nm/10kts	B300-D65-T350
TB2	1898	TT17 to TT35	450	18	8100	77x7.7x2.25	2x100+2x65+4TTx400	25.1kts-2200nm/10kts
AC2	1898	Marcillia-Manzano-Marcia-Mary	7500	4	30000	140x18x6	10x194+8x100	21.1kts-7000nm/10kts	B100-D45


TB3	1899	TT36 to TT60	500	24	12000	81x8.1x2.36	2x100+2x65+4TTx400	25.1kts-3000nm/10kts
AT2	1899	AT13 to AT20	1500	8	12000	91x9x3.47	4x100+2x65+4TTx450	22kts-4000nm/10kts
CP5	1899	Carmelia-Cerres-Cantalès-Courseau-Caliste-Cassandra	4500	6	27000	119x15	4x164+6x100	21kts-7000nm/10kts	B75-D40
				116	299800