Colonial Navy

[Carthaginian]

Delta,

To prevent confusion- post only what you plan to build NOW.
Leave the future to the future.

[Delta Force]

I have a quick question about SpringSharp. I made a few torpedo boat designs that were all at 0.50 hull strength, but after I saved them, completed some more designs, and went back and loaded them again they were below 0.50 hull strength. Any ideas what might be causing this? They are only 100 tons at normal load so I think that perhaps some kind of number rounding might be doing this when loaded.

[snip]

IIRC from earlyer conversations, it was discovered that while the weight for torpedoes was not added into the original sims but the weights do get added in when opening a save file. This could be the reason for the problem, tho rounding could do the same on such a small ship.

[Delta Force]

Here are some torpedo boat designs. The 1895, 1898, and 1902 models use the same hull. The 1898 model gains a small speed increase of half a knot from using newer triple expansion engines, while the 1902 model introduces oil firing.

The 1905 model introduces a new hull design and is powered by oil fired turbines. It also has a much heavier armament, replacing the old 50 mm gun with a 75 mm gun and adding four 35 mm secondary guns. The torpedoes are also increased in size to 450 mm and are given torpedo reloads. There is also some light armor for the 75 mm gun and the cockpit/bridge to defend against small arms fire.

I have never done any small combatant designs with SpringSharp before and it does not appear that there are any other torpedo boat designs up for this round yet, so any comments on these designs would be most appreciated.

Light Torpedo Boat Model 1895v2, Colonial Navy TB laid down 1895

Displacement:
   96 t light; 99 t standard; 120 t normal; 137 t full load

Dimensions: Length (overall / waterline) x beam x draught (normal/deep)
   (164.04 ft / 164.04 ft) x 13.70 ft x (4.92 / 5.35 ft)
   (50.00 m / 50.00 m) x 4.18 m  x (1.50 / 1.63 m)

Armament:
      1 - 1.97" / 50.0 mm 45.0 cal gun - 3.85lbs / 1.75kg shells, 100 per gun
     Breech loading gun in deck mount, 1895 Model
     1 x Single mount on centreline, forward deck forward
      Weight of broadside 4 lbs / 2 kg
      Main Torpedoes
      2 - 15.7" / 400 mm, 18.37 ft / 5.60 m torpedoes - 0.433 t each, 0.866 t total
   In 2 sets of deck mounted carriage/fixed tubes

Machinery:
   Coal fired boilers, complex reciprocating steam engines,
   Direct drive, 2 shafts, 1,374 ihp / 1,025 Kw = 20.35 kts
   Range 300nm at 20.35 kts
   Bunker at max displacement = 38 tons (100% coal)
     Caution: Delicate, lightweight machinery

Complement:
   17 - 23

Cost:
   £0.013 million / $0.054 million

Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
   Armament: 2 tons, 1.5 %
      - Guns: 1 tons, 0.6 %
      - Weapons: 1 tons, 0.9 %
   Machinery: 70 tons, 58.6 %
   Hull, fittings & equipment: 24 tons, 20.2 %
   Fuel, ammunition & stores: 24 tons, 19.7 %
   Miscellaneous weights: 0 tons, 0.0 %

Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
   Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
     25 lbs / 11 Kg = 6.6 x 2.0 " / 50 mm shells or 0.2 torpedoes
   Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1.69
   Metacentric height 0.6 ft / 0.2 m
   Roll period: 7.4 seconds
   Steadiness   - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 50 %
         - Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0.02
   Seaboat quality  (Average = 1.00): 0.80

Hull form characteristics:
   Hull has a flush deck,
     a normal bow and a cruiser stern
   Block coefficient (normal/deep): 0.380 / 0.398
   Length to Beam Ratio: 11.98 : 1
   'Natural speed' for length: 12.81 kts
   Power going to wave formation at top speed: 56 %
   Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 62
   Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): -15.00 degrees
   Stern overhang: 0.00 ft / 0.00 m
   Freeboard (% = length of deck as a percentage of waterline length):
            Fore end,    Aft end
      - Forecastle:   20.00 %,  4.10 ft / 1.25 m,  4.10 ft / 1.25 m
      - Forward deck:   30.00 %,  4.10 ft / 1.25 m,  4.10 ft / 1.25 m
      - Aft deck:   35.00 %,  4.10 ft / 1.25 m,  4.10 ft / 1.25 m
      - Quarter deck:   15.00 %,  4.10 ft / 1.25 m,  4.10 ft / 1.25 m
      - Average freeboard:      4.10 ft / 1.25 m
   Ship tends to be wet forward

Ship space, strength and comments:
   Space   - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 190.8 %
      - Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 60.5 %
   Waterplane Area: 1,365 Square feet or 127 Square metres
   Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 26 %
   Structure weight / hull surface area: 11 lbs/sq ft or 55 Kg/sq metre
   Hull strength (Relative):
      - Cross-sectional: 0.51
      - Longitudinal: 0.50
      - Overall: 0.50
   Caution: Hull subject to strain in open-sea
   Cramped machinery, storage, compartmentation space
   Cramped accommodation and workspace room
   Poor seaboat, wet and uncomfortable, reduced performance in heavy weather

Adjusted trial speed of 26 knots.

--------------------------------------------------

Light Torpedo Boat Model 1898v2, Colonial Navy TB laid down 1898

Displacement:
   96 t light; 99 t standard; 120 t normal; 137 t full load

Dimensions: Length (overall / waterline) x beam x draught (normal/deep)
   (164.04 ft / 164.04 ft) x 13.70 ft x (4.92 / 5.36 ft)
   (50.00 m / 50.00 m) x 4.18 m  x (1.50 / 1.63 m)

Armament:
      1 - 1.97" / 50.0 mm 45.0 cal gun - 3.85lbs / 1.75kg shells, 100 per gun
     Breech loading gun in deck mount, 1898 Model
     1 x Single mount on centreline, forward deck forward
      Weight of broadside 4 lbs / 2 kg
      Main Torpedoes
      2 - 15.7" / 400 mm, 18.37 ft / 5.60 m torpedoes - 0.481 t each, 0.963 t total
   In 2 sets of deck mounted carriage/fixed tubes

Machinery:
   Coal fired boilers, complex reciprocating steam engines,
   Direct drive, 2 shafts, 1,501 ihp / 1,120 Kw = 20.80 kts
   Range 300nm at 20.80 kts
   Bunker at max displacement = 38 tons (100% coal)
     Caution: Delicate, lightweight machinery

Complement:
   17 - 23

Cost:
   £0.013 million / $0.054 million

Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
   Armament: 2 tons, 1.6 %
      - Guns: 1 tons, 0.6 %
      - Weapons: 1 tons, 1.0 %
   Machinery: 71 tons, 58.9 %
   Hull, fittings & equipment: 23 tons, 19.5 %
   Fuel, ammunition & stores: 24 tons, 20.0 %
   Miscellaneous weights: 0 tons, 0.0 %

Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
   Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
     25 lbs / 11 Kg = 6.5 x 2.0 " / 50 mm shells or 0.2 torpedoes
   Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1.67
   Metacentric height 0.6 ft / 0.2 m
   Roll period: 7.5 seconds
   Steadiness   - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 50 %
         - Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0.02
   Seaboat quality  (Average = 1.00): 0.76

Hull form characteristics:
   Hull has a flush deck,
     a normal bow and a cruiser stern
   Block coefficient (normal/deep): 0.380 / 0.399
   Length to Beam Ratio: 11.98 : 1
   'Natural speed' for length: 12.81 kts
   Power going to wave formation at top speed: 57 %
   Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 65
   Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): -15.00 degrees
   Stern overhang: 0.00 ft / 0.00 m
   Freeboard (% = length of deck as a percentage of waterline length):
            Fore end,    Aft end
      - Forecastle:   20.00 %,  4.10 ft / 1.25 m,  4.10 ft / 1.25 m
      - Forward deck:   30.00 %,  4.10 ft / 1.25 m,  4.10 ft / 1.25 m
      - Aft deck:   35.00 %,  4.10 ft / 1.25 m,  4.10 ft / 1.25 m
      - Quarter deck:   15.00 %,  4.10 ft / 1.25 m,  4.10 ft / 1.25 m
      - Average freeboard:      4.10 ft / 1.25 m
   Ship tends to be wet forward

Ship space, strength and comments:
   Space   - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 191.7 %
      - Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 60.5 %
   Waterplane Area: 1,365 Square feet or 127 Square metres
   Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 25 %
   Structure weight / hull surface area: 11 lbs/sq ft or 53 Kg/sq metre
   Hull strength (Relative):
      - Cross-sectional: 0.50
      - Longitudinal: 0.50
      - Overall: 0.50
   Caution: Hull subject to strain in open-sea
   Cramped machinery, storage, compartmentation space
   Cramped accommodation and workspace room
   Poor seaboat, wet and uncomfortable, reduced performance in heavy weather

Adjusted trial speed of 26.5 knots.

--------------------------------------------------

Light Torpedo Boat Model 1902v2, Colonial Navy TB laid down 1902

Displacement:
   96 t light; 99 t standard; 120 t normal; 137 t full load

Dimensions: Length (overall / waterline) x beam x draught (normal/deep)
   (164.04 ft / 164.04 ft) x 13.70 ft x (4.92 / 5.35 ft)
   (50.00 m / 50.00 m) x 4.18 m  x (1.50 / 1.63 m)

Armament:
      1 - 1.97" / 50.0 mm 45.0 cal gun - 3.85lbs / 1.75kg shells, 100 per gun
     Breech loading gun in deck mount, 1902 Model
     1 x Single mount on centreline, forward deck forward
      Weight of broadside 4 lbs / 2 kg
      Main Torpedoes
      2 - 15.7" / 400 mm, 18.37 ft / 5.60 m torpedoes - 0.557 t each, 1.114 t total
   In 2 sets of deck mounted carriage/fixed tubes

Machinery:
   Coal and oil fired boilers, complex reciprocating steam engines,
   Direct drive, 2 shafts, 1,694 ihp / 1,264 Kw = 21.43 kts
   Range 300nm at 21.43 kts
   Bunker at max displacement = 38 tons (90% coal)
     Caution: Delicate, lightweight machinery

Complement:
   17 - 23

Cost:
   £0.014 million / $0.054 million

Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
   Armament: 2 tons, 1.8 %
      - Guns: 1 tons, 0.6 %
      - Weapons: 1 tons, 1.2 %
   Machinery: 71 tons, 59.2 %
   Hull, fittings & equipment: 23 tons, 19.3 %
   Fuel, ammunition & stores: 24 tons, 19.7 %
   Miscellaneous weights: 0 tons, 0.0 %

Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
   Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
     24 lbs / 11 Kg = 6.3 x 2.0 " / 50 mm shells or 0.2 torpedoes
   Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1.60
   Metacentric height 0.6 ft / 0.2 m
   Roll period: 7.7 seconds
   Steadiness   - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 50 %
         - Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0.02
   Seaboat quality  (Average = 1.00): 0.71

Hull form characteristics:
   Hull has a flush deck,
     a normal bow and a cruiser stern
   Block coefficient (normal/deep): 0.380 / 0.398
   Length to Beam Ratio: 11.98 : 1
   'Natural speed' for length: 12.81 kts
   Power going to wave formation at top speed: 58 %
   Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 71
   Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): -15.00 degrees
   Stern overhang: 0.00 ft / 0.00 m
   Freeboard (% = length of deck as a percentage of waterline length):
            Fore end,    Aft end
      - Forecastle:   20.00 %,  4.10 ft / 1.25 m,  4.10 ft / 1.25 m
      - Forward deck:   30.00 %,  4.10 ft / 1.25 m,  4.10 ft / 1.25 m
      - Aft deck:   35.00 %,  4.10 ft / 1.25 m,  4.10 ft / 1.25 m
      - Quarter deck:   15.00 %,  4.10 ft / 1.25 m,  4.10 ft / 1.25 m
      - Average freeboard:      4.10 ft / 1.25 m
   Ship tends to be wet forward

Ship space, strength and comments:
   Space   - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 192.8 %
      - Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 60.5 %
   Waterplane Area: 1,365 Square feet or 127 Square metres
   Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 24 %
   Structure weight / hull surface area: 11 lbs/sq ft or 52 Kg/sq metre
   Hull strength (Relative):
      - Cross-sectional: 0.50
      - Longitudinal: 0.50
      - Overall: 0.50
   Caution: Hull subject to strain in open-sea
   Cramped machinery, storage, compartmentation space
   Cramped accommodation and workspace room
   Poor seaboat, wet and uncomfortable, reduced performance in heavy weather

Adjusted trial speed of 27.5 knots.

--------------------------------------------------

Light Torpedo Boat Model 1905v2, Colonial Navy TB laid down 1905

Displacement:
   131 t light; 136 t standard; 160 t normal; 180 t full load

Dimensions: Length (overall / waterline) x beam x draught (normal/deep)
   (184.96 ft / 183.73 ft) x 15.31 ft x (5.25 / 5.65 ft)
   (56.38 m / 56.00 m) x 4.67 m  x (1.60 / 1.72 m)

Armament:
      1 - 2.95" / 75.0 mm 45.0 cal gun - 11.02lbs / 5.00kg shells, 100 per gun
     Breech loading gun in deck mount, 1905 Model
     1 x Single mount on centreline, forward deck forward
      4 - 1.38" / 35.0 mm 45.0 cal guns - 1.10lbs / 0.50kg shells, 300 per gun
     Breech loading guns in deck mounts, 1905 Model
     4 x Single mounts on sides, evenly spread
      Weight of broadside 15 lbs / 7 kg
      Main Torpedoes
      6 - 19.7" / 500 mm, 22.97 ft / 7.00 m torpedoes - 1.165 t each, 6.991 t total
   In 2 sets of deck mounted reloads

Armour:
   - Gun armour:   Face (max)   Other gunhouse (avg)   Barbette/hoist (max)
   Main:   0.39" / 10 mm         -               -

   - Conning towers: Forward 0.79" / 20 mm, Aft 0.00" / 0 mm

Machinery:
   Oil fired boilers, steam turbines,
   Direct drive, 2 shafts, 2,351 shp / 1,754 Kw = 22.50 kts
   Range 300nm at 22.50 kts
   Bunker at max displacement = 44 tons

Complement:
   22 - 29

Cost:
   £0.018 million / $0.071 million

Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
   Armament: 12 tons, 7.6 %
      - Guns: 3 tons, 2.2 %
      - Weapons: 9 tons, 5.5 %
   Armour: 1 tons, 0.8 %
      - Armament: 1 tons, 0.5 %
      - Conning Tower: 1 tons, 0.3 %
   Machinery: 86 tons, 53.6 %
   Hull, fittings & equipment: 32 tons, 19.8 %
   Fuel, ammunition & stores: 29 tons, 18.1 %
   Miscellaneous weights: 0 tons, 0.0 %

Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
   Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
     37 lbs / 17 Kg = 2.9 x 3.0 " / 75 mm shells or 0.1 torpedoes
   Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1.45
   Metacentric height 0.6 ft / 0.2 m
   Roll period: 8.5 seconds
   Steadiness   - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 50 %
         - Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0.08
   Seaboat quality  (Average = 1.00): 0.71

Hull form characteristics:
   Hull has a flush deck,
     a normal bow and a cruiser stern
   Block coefficient (normal/deep): 0.380 / 0.396
   Length to Beam Ratio: 12.00 : 1
   'Natural speed' for length: 13.55 kts
   Power going to wave formation at top speed: 58 %
   Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 70
   Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): 15.00 degrees
   Stern overhang: 0.00 ft / 0.00 m
   Freeboard (% = length of deck as a percentage of waterline length):
            Fore end,    Aft end
      - Forecastle:   20.00 %,  4.59 ft / 1.40 m,  4.59 ft / 1.40 m
      - Forward deck:   30.00 %,  4.59 ft / 1.40 m,  4.59 ft / 1.40 m
      - Aft deck:   35.00 %,  4.59 ft / 1.40 m,  4.59 ft / 1.40 m
      - Quarter deck:   15.00 %,  4.59 ft / 1.40 m,  4.59 ft / 1.40 m
      - Average freeboard:      4.59 ft / 1.40 m
   Ship tends to be wet forward

Ship space, strength and comments:
   Space   - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 179.1 %
      - Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 50.3 %
   Waterplane Area: 1,708 Square feet or 159 Square metres
   Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 44 %
   Structure weight / hull surface area: 12 lbs/sq ft or 61 Kg/sq metre
   Hull strength (Relative):
      - Cross-sectional: 0.51
      - Longitudinal: 0.51
      - Overall: 0.51
   Caution: Hull subject to strain in open-sea
   Cramped machinery, storage, compartmentation space
   Cramped accommodation and workspace room
   Poor seaboat, wet and uncomfortable, reduced performance in heavy weather

Adjusted trial speed of 28 knots.

[snip]

Before I really look at the designs, I note this.

2.) No Oil-fired ships; coal must make up 90% or more of the ship's bunkerage

[KWorld]

Here are some torpedo boat designs. The 1895, 1898, and 1902 models use the same hull. The 1898 model gains a small speed increase of half a knot from using newer triple expansion engines, while the 1902 model introduces oil firing.

The 1905 model introduces a new hull design and is powered by oil fired turbines. It also has a much heavier armament, replacing the old 50 mm gun with a 75 mm gun and adding four 35 mm secondary guns. The torpedoes are also increased in size to 450 mm and are given torpedo reloads. There is also some light armor for the 75 mm gun and the cockpit/bridge to defend against small arms fire.

I have never done any small combatant designs with SpringSharp before and it does not appear that there are any other torpedo boat designs up for this round yet, so any comments on these designs would be most appreciated.

Hmmmph.  http://www.navalism.org/index.php/topic,5796.msg76023.html#msg76023, last design posted for the Columbiad Republic.

[Delta Force]

The 1905 model modified to run 90% on coal. Major difference is a loss of 1.5 knots in speed, taking it down to 26.5 knots.

Light Torpedo Boat Model 1905v3, Colonial Navy TB laid down 1905

Displacement:
   129 t light; 133 t standard; 160 t normal; 182 t full load

Dimensions: Length (overall / waterline) x beam x draught (normal/deep)
   (184.96 ft / 183.73 ft) x 15.31 ft x (5.25 / 5.70 ft)
   (56.38 m / 56.00 m) x 4.67 m  x (1.60 / 1.74 m)

Armament:
      1 - 2.95" / 75.0 mm 45.0 cal gun - 11.02lbs / 5.00kg shells, 100 per gun
     Breech loading gun in deck mount, 1905 Model
     1 x Single mount on centreline, forward deck forward
      4 - 1.38" / 35.0 mm 45.0 cal guns - 1.10lbs / 0.50kg shells, 300 per gun
     Breech loading guns in deck mounts, 1905 Model
     4 x Single mounts on sides, evenly spread
      Weight of broadside 15 lbs / 7 kg
      Main Torpedoes
      6 - 19.7" / 500 mm, 22.97 ft / 7.00 m torpedoes - 1.165 t each, 6.991 t total
   In 2 sets of deck mounted reloads

Armour:
   - Gun armour:   Face (max)   Other gunhouse (avg)   Barbette/hoist (max)
   Main:   0.39" / 10 mm         -               -

   - Conning towers: Forward 0.79" / 20 mm, Aft 0.00" / 0 mm

Machinery:
   Coal and oil fired boilers, steam turbines,
   Direct drive, 2 shafts, 1,830 shp / 1,365 Kw = 21.15 kts
   Range 300nm at 21.15 kts
   Bunker at max displacement = 49 tons (90% coal)

Complement:
   22 - 29

Cost:
   £0.017 million / $0.069 million

Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
   Armament: 12 tons, 7.6 %
      - Guns: 3 tons, 2.2 %
      - Weapons: 9 tons, 5.5 %
   Armour: 1 tons, 0.8 %
      - Armament: 1 tons, 0.5 %
      - Conning Tower: 1 tons, 0.3 %
   Machinery: 84 tons, 52.3 %
   Hull, fittings & equipment: 31 tons, 19.5 %
   Fuel, ammunition & stores: 32 tons, 19.8 %
   Miscellaneous weights: 0 tons, 0.0 %

Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
   Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
     38 lbs / 17 Kg = 3.0 x 3.0 " / 75 mm shells or 0.1 torpedoes
   Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1.46
   Metacentric height 0.6 ft / 0.2 m
   Roll period: 8.5 seconds
   Steadiness   - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 58 %
         - Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0.08
   Seaboat quality  (Average = 1.00): 0.83

Hull form characteristics:
   Hull has a flush deck,
     a normal bow and a cruiser stern
   Block coefficient (normal/deep): 0.380 / 0.398
   Length to Beam Ratio: 12.00 : 1
   'Natural speed' for length: 13.55 kts
   Power going to wave formation at top speed: 55 %
   Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 70
   Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): 15.00 degrees
   Stern overhang: 0.00 ft / 0.00 m
   Freeboard (% = length of deck as a percentage of waterline length):
            Fore end,    Aft end
      - Forecastle:   20.00 %,  4.59 ft / 1.40 m,  4.59 ft / 1.40 m
      - Forward deck:   30.00 %,  4.59 ft / 1.40 m,  4.59 ft / 1.40 m
      - Aft deck:   35.00 %,  4.59 ft / 1.40 m,  4.59 ft / 1.40 m
      - Quarter deck:   15.00 %,  4.59 ft / 1.40 m,  4.59 ft / 1.40 m
      - Average freeboard:      4.59 ft / 1.40 m
   Ship tends to be wet forward

Ship space, strength and comments:
   Space   - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 175.0 %
      - Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 50.3 %
   Waterplane Area: 1,708 Square feet or 159 Square metres
   Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 51 %
   Structure weight / hull surface area: 12 lbs/sq ft or 60 Kg/sq metre
   Hull strength (Relative):
      - Cross-sectional: 0.51
      - Longitudinal: 0.50
      - Overall: 0.50
   Caution: Hull subject to strain in open-sea
   Cramped machinery, storage, compartmentation space
   Cramped accommodation and workspace room
   Poor seaboat, wet and uncomfortable, reduced performance in heavy weather

Adjusted trial speed of 26.5 knots.

[Jefgte]

21.15kts in 1905.

Too slow

[Delta Force]

21.15kts in 1905.

Too slow

The adjusted speed is 26.5 knots, although I think that that may be too slow as well. I'm not too sure how long ranged torpedo boats were, do you think I could cut some of the range and trade it for speed?

[Jefgte]

That depend the job assigned for the ship.
Harbor protection, patrols...

IMO, I think that that TB is realy too small to be efficient.
Too slow speed, too short range

Jef

[KWorld]

Small TBs like this or my design are short-legged defensive weapons, really.  Useful for defending a port city or a base, but of dubious utility in other roles.

[Jefgte]

Increase to 200t to have higher speed & range.

Jef

[Carthaginian]

What rule are these, and my second class TBs, breaking?  They seem to be legal by the current rules as written.

I'm NOT in favor of a requirement for +60% machinery, because it will fail miserably in later years as boilers and turbines become more efficient.

These specifically don't meet the >24 knotrequirement for 'Light, Fast Combatant' base speed in Springsharp; your light TB does not meet this requirement, either.
Thus, the designs cannot be built.

Having a 60% machinery requirement is there to ensure that a proper amount of ship displacement is devoted to engine weight... to prevent people from building slow mini-ships to destroyer rules and overloading them with weaponry. There has to be some kind of limiting agent to ensure that the designs stay reasonable, and since the engine is the heaviest part of a small torpedo boat, that is why I chose it. I simmed multiple Japanese torpedo boats (among the earliest) and a couple of British and French ones (possibly the earliest) as well. The results consistently gave me a >60% engine weight.

Pull out a copy of Conway's and give it a go for yourself. It's pretty reliable.
I could see possibly see lowering the weights required to 55% if a good case could be made... but nothing will really get me to go lower than that. Springsharp occasionally requires artificial 'corrections' because of it's flaws- we know this. Ensuring that engines take up an appropriate weight is just one of those.

technically, these carft can't be built at all under any conditions as things stand ATM.

I don't know about that. As I see it, the "Design Rules for Gentlemen... and Scoundrels" says we can... and so does "the Agreement upon Limitations for Naval Vessels"... so I am kind of confused by your words. :-\

it will fail miserably in later years as boilers and turbines become more efficient.

That is easily solved. Warp Speed, Mr. Sulu. ;D

Springsharp says you can't.
The rules say you can build the ships... if you can get them to work in Springsharp. As I realize this is well nigh impossible, I wanted to add some looser requirements specifically for these ships. Remember, Rule #1 says that we use Springsharp 3.0b3 to build ships; if you can't build it in Springsharp, then you can't build it. ;)

And yes, this will HOPEFULLY also allow us to build the extremely fast light TBs of later time periods... and can be adjusted later if need be.

[Delta Force]

Can this post be deleted to keep torpedo boat rules discussion to the thread for that (seeing as this post is already in the thread for that)? Don't want to clutter things up too much.

We'll leave it here, too... and a link to redirect. That way we will all know where to look in case we missed the split (like I just did). I will remove everything related that comes in here afterwards, though. Just let me know.
http://www.navalism.org/index.php/topic,5835.0.html

[snip]

My bad on that, work happend as I was fixing things up. ::)