Nova Francia Fleet

[Jefgte]

Made to work near the 21kts BB line...

SGB-6x240, Nova Francia SGB-8000t laid down 1915

Displacement:
   7 077 t light; 7 531 t standard; 8 000 t normal; 8 375 t full load

Dimensions: Length (overall / waterline) x beam x draught (normal/deep)
   (416.66 ft / 410.66 ft) x 63.00 ft x (18.50 / 19.20 ft)
   (127.00 m / 125.17 m) x 19.20 m  x (5.64 / 5.85 m)

Armament:
      2 - 9.45" / 240 mm 50.0 cal guns - 446.70lbs / 202.62kg shells, 150 per gun
     Breech loading guns in turret on barbette mounts, 1915 Model
     2 x Single mounts on centreline, evenly spread
      4 - 9.45" / 240 mm 50.0 cal guns - 446.70lbs / 202.62kg shells, 150 per gun
     Breech loading guns in turret on barbette mounts, 1915 Model
     4 x Single mounts on side ends, evenly spread
      6 - 5.50" / 140 mm 45.0 cal guns - 83.90lbs / 38.05kg shells, 250 per gun
     Quick firing guns in casemate mounts, 1915 Model
     6 x Single mounts on sides, evenly spread
      8 - 0.52" / 13.2 mm 76.0 cal guns - 0.09lbs / 0.04kg shells, 3 000 per gun
     Machine guns in deck mounts, 1915 Model
     4 x 2 row twin mounts on sides, evenly spread
      4 raised mounts
      Weight of broadside 3 184 lbs / 1 444 kg
      Main Torpedoes
      4 - 17.7" / 450 mm, 20.00 ft / 6.10 m torpedoes - 0.940 t each, 3.761 t total
   In 2 sets of deck mounted side rotating tubes

Armour:
   - Belts:      Width (max)   Length (avg)      Height (avg)
   Main:   7.87" / 200 mm   265.76 ft / 81.00 m   11.17 ft / 3.40 m
   Ends:   1.95" / 50 mm   124.67 ft / 38.00 m   7.87 ft / 2.40 m
     20.23 ft / 6.17 m Unarmoured ends
     Main Belt covers 100 % of normal length

   - Gun armour:   Face (max)   Other gunhouse (avg)   Barbette/hoist (max)
   Main:   7.87" / 200 mm   2.95" / 75 mm      3.95" / 100 mm
   2nd:   7.87" / 200 mm   2.95" / 75 mm      3.95" / 100 mm
   3rd:   1.95" / 50 mm   0.98" / 25 mm      0.98" / 25 mm
   4th:   0.40" / 10 mm         -               -

   - Armoured deck - multiple decks:
   For and Aft decks: 1.95" / 50 mm
   Forecastle: 0.98" / 25 mm  Quarter deck: 0.98" / 25 mm

   - Conning towers: Forward 5.52" / 140 mm, Aft 3.95" / 100 mm

Machinery:
   Oil fired boilers, steam turbines,
   Geared drive, 3 shafts, 29 647 shp / 22 117 Kw = 24.00 kts
   Range 5 000nm at 12.00 kts
   Bunker at max displacement = 843 tons

Complement:
   422 - 549

Cost:
   £1.029 million / $4.117 million

Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
   Armament: 923 tons, 11.5 %
      - Guns: 916 tons, 11.4 %
      - Weapons: 8 tons, 0.1 %
   Armour: 2 255 tons, 28.2 %
      - Belts: 1 088 tons, 13.6 %
      - Armament: 523 tons, 6.5 %
      - Armour Deck: 562 tons, 7.0 %
      - Conning Towers: 82 tons, 1.0 %
   Machinery: 1 123 tons, 14.0 %
   Hull, fittings & equipment: 2 656 tons, 33.2 %
   Fuel, ammunition & stores: 923 tons, 11.5 %
   Miscellaneous weights: 120 tons, 1.5 %
      - Hull below water: 20 tons
      - Above deck: 100 tons

Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
   Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
     11 776 lbs / 5 341 Kg = 27.9 x 9.5 " / 240 mm shells or 2.6 torpedoes
   Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1.11
   Metacentric height 3.0 ft / 0.9 m
   Roll period: 15.2 seconds
   Steadiness   - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 70 %
         - Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0.77
   Seaboat quality  (Average = 1.00): 1.22

Hull form characteristics:
   Hull has a flush deck,
     a ram bow and a cruiser stern
   Block coefficient (normal/deep): 0.585 / 0.590
   Length to Beam Ratio: 6.52 : 1
   'Natural speed' for length: 20.26 kts
   Power going to wave formation at top speed: 59 %
   Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 57
   Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): 5.00 degrees
   Stern overhang: 3.00 ft / 0.91 m
   Freeboard (% = length of deck as a percentage of waterline length):
            Fore end,    Aft end
      - Forecastle:   28.00 %,  21.00 ft / 6.40 m,  19.67 ft / 6.00 m
      - Forward deck:   22.00 %,  19.67 ft / 6.00 m,  19.02 ft / 5.80 m
      - Aft deck:   24.00 %,  19.02 ft / 5.80 m,  19.70 ft / 6.00 m
      - Quarter deck:   26.00 %,  19.70 ft / 6.00 m,  20.68 ft / 6.30 m
      - Average freeboard:      19.81 ft / 6.04 m
   Ship tends to be wet forward

Ship space, strength and comments:
   Space   - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 81.8 %
      - Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 159.9 %
   Waterplane Area: 18 658 Square feet or 1 733 Square metres
   Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 107 %
   Structure weight / hull surface area: 114 lbs/sq ft or 558 Kg/sq metre
   Hull strength (Relative):
      - Cross-sectional: 0.90
      - Longitudinal: 2.49
      - Overall: 1.00
   Excellent machinery, storage, compartmentation space
   Excellent accommodation and workspace room
   Ship has slow, easy roll, a good, steady gun platform
   Good seaboat, rides out heavy weather easily

240/50-mlle1906 - HE & AP:220kg - MV:800m/sec - range:23800m - ROF:2/mn

[eltf177]

Very nice design, hope to see a drawing of it soon! :)

[Jefgte]

New drawing



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[Jefgte]

As I can see, with the new rules, the 8000t cruiser with 6T1x240 is not allowed...

[Carthaginian]

As I can see, with the new rules, the 8000t cruiser with 6T1x240 is not allowed...

No, it's allowed:

A Heavy Cruiser, shall for the purposes of this treaty, heretofore be classified by the following qualifications. Any ship meeting one of these qualifications shall be termed a Heavy Cruiser.
(b)   a vessel with no more than two guns of 9.2"/240mm, and which mounts an equal or greater number of secondary guns greater than 7.64"/194mm.

It just becomes a Heavy Cruiser rather than a Medium Cruiser because of the terms of the treaty.

[Jefgte]

"a vessel with no more than two guns of 9"2/240mm"

???

[Carthaginian]

"a vessel with no more than two guns of 9"2/240mm"

???

OK, that was written because the British had a habit of mounting two guns of 9.2" on their armored cruisers... then loading them down with 7.5" or 6" guns which had a faster firing rate. They were still 'armored cruisers' even though they only mounted two 'armored cruiser' guns.
I put that layout specifically into the treaty for that reason, just like I made sure to put the French trademark battleship layout specifically in the battleship section.
I should probably clarify the wording of that section a bit, and will.

Your ship is OK- it mounts a 'main battery' of "no more than two guns of 9.2" or greater" and it also mounts a secondary battery of "an equal or greater number of secondary guns equal to or greater than 7.5"/190mm."

[Jefgte]

OK,

I add that this 8000t cruiser will be rework because she is a 1918 SS.
I am working too on a kind of 1903 Danton with 2T2x305+4T2x240-21kts.
& a 6500t - 1904 Coastal Defender with 2T2x240+8x140-16kts-Belt 150

As you can see, I like very much the T2x240 of the Danton class.
That was a medium armament with exellent performances.

Jef

[Carthaginian]

Yeah- we're going to be starting with 1895, basically.
Engine Year = Laydown Year... we decided to be brutal simple there.

[Jefgte]

Re SS the Combat Cruiser from 1918 to 1906

CC, Nova Francia Armored Cruiser laid down 1906

Displacement:
   10 850 t light; 11 401 t standard; 12 500 t normal; 13 379 t full load

Dimensions: Length (overall / waterline) x beam x draught (normal/deep)
   (491.00 ft / 482.00 ft) x 74.15 ft x (21.29 / 22.49 ft)
   (149.66 m / 146.91 m) x 22.60 m  x (6.49 / 6.86 m)

Armament:
      2 - 9.45" / 240 mm 45.0 cal guns - 425.55lbs / 193.03kg shells, 100 per gun
     Breech loading guns in turret on barbette mounts, 1906 Model
     2 x Single mounts on centreline ends, evenly spread
      4 - 9.45" / 240 mm 45.0 cal guns - 425.55lbs / 193.03kg shells, 100 per gun
     Breech loading guns in turret on barbette mounts, 1906 Model
     4 x Single mounts on sides, evenly spread
      12 - 5.50" / 140 mm 45.0 cal guns - 83.90lbs / 38.05kg shells, 200 per gun
     Breech loading guns in casemate mounts, 1906 Model
     12 x Single mounts on sides, evenly spread
      12 hull mounts in casemates- Limited use in heavy seas
      8 - 3.95" / 100 mm 73.0 cal guns - 34.73lbs / 15.75kg shells, 300 per gun
     Breech loading guns in deck mounts, 1906 Model
     8 x Single mounts on sides, evenly spread
      8 raised mounts
      8 - 0.52" / 13.2 mm 45.0 cal guns - 0.07lbs / 0.03kg shells, 3 000 per gun
     Breech loading guns in deck mounts, 1906 Model
     4 x 2 row twin mounts on sides, evenly spread
      4 raised mounts
      Weight of broadside 3 838 lbs / 1 741 kg
      Main Torpedoes
      4 - 17.7" / 450 mm, 20.00 ft / 6.10 m torpedoes - 0.956 t each, 3.825 t total
   submerged side tubes

Armour:
   - Belts:      Width (max)   Length (avg)      Height (avg)
   Main:   5.90" / 150 mm   328.10 ft / 100.00 m   12.00 ft / 3.66 m
   Ends:   1.57" / 40 mm   104.00 ft / 31.70 m   12.00 ft / 3.66 m
     49.90 ft / 15.21 m Unarmoured ends
   Upper:   1.57" / 40 mm   328.10 ft / 100.00 m   12.00 ft / 3.66 m
     Main Belt covers 105 % of normal length

   - Gun armour:   Face (max)   Other gunhouse (avg)   Barbette/hoist (max)
   Main:   5.90" / 150 mm   3.95" / 100 mm      4.72" / 120 mm
   2nd:   5.90" / 150 mm   3.95" / 100 mm      4.72" / 120 mm
   3rd:   1.57" / 40 mm         -         1.57" / 40 mm
   4th:   0.50" / 13 mm         -               -
   5th:   0.40" / 10 mm         -               -

   - Armoured deck - multiple decks:
   For and Aft decks: 1.57" / 40 mm
   Forecastle: 0.99" / 25 mm  Quarter deck: 0.99" / 25 mm

   - Conning towers: Forward 4.72" / 120 mm, Aft 3.94" / 100 mm

Machinery:
   Coal fired boilers, complex reciprocating steam engines,
   Direct drive, 4 shafts, 21 535 ihp / 16 065 Kw = 21.00 kts
   Range 5 000nm at 12.00 kts
   Bunker at max displacement = 1 978 tons (100% coal)

Complement:
   590 - 768

Cost:
   £1.119 million / $4.476 million

Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
   Armament: 941 tons, 7.5 %
      - Guns: 933 tons, 7.5 %
      - Weapons: 8 tons, 0.1 %
   Armour: 2 782 tons, 22.3 %
      - Belts: 1 339 tons, 10.7 %
      - Armament: 648 tons, 5.2 %
      - Armour Deck: 694 tons, 5.6 %
      - Conning Towers: 101 tons, 0.8 %
   Machinery: 3 076 tons, 24.6 %
   Hull, fittings & equipment: 3 851 tons, 30.8 %
   Fuel, ammunition & stores: 1 650 tons, 13.2 %
   Miscellaneous weights: 200 tons, 1.6 %
      - Hull below water: 50 tons
      - Above deck: 150 tons

Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
   Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
     14 481 lbs / 6 569 Kg = 34.3 x 9.5 " / 240 mm shells or 2.4 torpedoes
   Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1.34
   Metacentric height 5.3 ft / 1.6 m
   Roll period: 13.5 seconds
   Steadiness   - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 99 %
         - Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0.52
   Seaboat quality  (Average = 1.00): 1.91

Hull form characteristics:
   Hull has a flush deck,
     a ram bow and a cruiser stern
   Block coefficient (normal/deep): 0.575 / 0.582
   Length to Beam Ratio: 6.50 : 1
   'Natural speed' for length: 21.95 kts
   Power going to wave formation at top speed: 47 %
   Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 52
   Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): 0.00 degrees
   Stern overhang: 3.00 ft / 0.91 m
   Freeboard (% = length of deck as a percentage of waterline length):
            Fore end,    Aft end
      - Forecastle:   15.00 %,  20.33 ft / 6.20 m,  20.33 ft / 6.20 m
      - Forward deck:   30.00 %,  20.33 ft / 6.20 m,  20.33 ft / 6.20 m
      - Aft deck:   35.00 %,  20.33 ft / 6.20 m,  20.33 ft / 6.20 m
      - Quarter deck:   20.00 %,  20.33 ft / 6.20 m,  20.33 ft / 6.20 m
      - Average freeboard:      20.33 ft / 6.20 m
   Ship tends to be wet forward

Ship space, strength and comments:
   Space   - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 104.4 %
      - Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 167.6 %
   Waterplane Area: 25 535 Square feet or 2 372 Square metres
   Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 104 %
   Structure weight / hull surface area: 119 lbs/sq ft or 581 Kg/sq metre
   Hull strength (Relative):
      - Cross-sectional: 0.93
      - Longitudinal: 1.94
      - Overall: 1.00
   Adequate machinery, storage, compartmentation space
   Excellent accommodation and workspace room
   Ship has slow, easy roll, a good, steady gun platform
   Excellent seaboat, comfortable, can fire her guns in the heaviest weather

[Jefgte]

Here is a rapid rework of the Plan for Nova Francia Fleet

technos	TYPE		ships Qty		total tonnage		NORMAL DISP.
1900	Patrol Gunboat		10		7000		700t
1901	Patrol Gunboat		10		7000		700t
1902	Gunboat		6		18000		3000t max
1903	Coastal Defender		4		26000		6500t max
1904	Armored Cruiser		4		50000		12500t
					108000
1905	Danton class BB		2		27000		20000t max
1906	Medium Cruiser		2		17200		10000t max
1907	Torpedo Boat (Chasseur)		12		12000		1000t
1908	light cruisers		6		36000		6000t max
1909	Armored Cruiser		2		30000		15000t max
					122200
1910	Courbet class BB-Study5		1		25000		25000t max
1911	Courbet class BB-Study5		1		25000		25000t max
1912	Torpedo Boat		12		12000		1000t
1913	Coastal Defender		4		26000		6500t max
1914	Cruiser NOVA		6		36000		6000t max
					124000
1915	Armored Cruiser Leon class		2		30000		15000t max
1916	Cruiser Dupleix class		2		12000		6000t max
1917	BB Normandie class		1		30000		30000t max
1918	BB Normandie class		1		30000		30000t max
1919	Torpedo boats		12		24000		2000t max
			100		126000

Total 480 000t

Adjustements to come

Jef  ;)

[snip]

Startup Vessels shall be under the following special restrictions:
1.) No Turbines in Capital Ships, Heavy or Medium cruisers, Coast Defense Ships or Monitors; turbines may be used on Light Cruisers, Destroyers and Torpedo Boats.
2.) No Oil-fired ships; coal must make up 90% or more of the ship's bunkerage
3.) Direct Drive only; drive options become available in 1910, and after that whenever SS allows.
4.) Protected Cruisers are allowed; use an upper belt of 5'/1.525m to sim the slope of the deck.
5.) All ships are to  be of pre-dread type- with twin main gun turrets and either 'secondary battery', 'intermediate battery' or 'AQY twins' layouts. Ships must have main and end belts- AoN armor is not allowed; upper belts are optional, but wise in some designs.

Dont think a few of those designs are going to work under these rules. Also, Im getting confirmation later, but AFAIK the game start date would be in 1910.

[Jefgte]

We are waiting for the tonnage allowed by categories or global or per year.
perso, I prefer global or per year limitation because SS rulles are very restrictives & a liberty space for neurones is neccessary.

Start in 1910 mean SS since 1895...


Jef  ;)

[snip]

We are waiting for the tonnage allowed by categories or global or per year.
perso, I prefer global or per year limitation because SS rulles are very restrictives & a liberty space for neurones is neccessary.

As Carth said, we are looking at at cap of ~500,000 tons for the starting fleets. I dont think that we were going to have caps on the individual classes at the start, but that could change.

Start in 1910 mean SS since 1895...

That was the plan

[Jefgte]

OK, I have reworked the Plan -
Note Displacement, armament, speed & range are starting values

technos	TYPE	NORMAL DISP.	ships Qty	total tonnage	Tonnage Fleet	DIM	ARMAMENT	SPEED & RANGE
1895	Patrol Gunboat	700t	20	14000			3x100	16kts-5000nm/12kts
1896	Gunboat	3000t max	6	18000			4x140	16kts-5000nm/12kts
1897	Coastal Defender	6500t max	4	26000			2T2x240+8x140	16kts-5000nm/12kts
1898	Armored Cruiser	10000t	4	40000			4T1x194+8x140	18kts-5000nm/12kts
1899	Liberté class BB	15000t	4	60000			2T2x305+12x140	18kts-5000nm/12kts
				158000	158000
1900	Cruiser Lome class	80000t max	3	24000			4T1x164+8x140	21kts-5000nm/12kts
1900	Cruiser Lome class	80000t max	3	24000
1901	light Cruisers	60000t max	4	24000			8x140	21kts-5000nm/12kts
1902	Armored Cruiser	15000t max	2	30000			6T1x240+8x140	21kts-5000nm/12kts
1903	Torpedo boat	1000t max	24	24000			3x75+4TTx450	27kts-5000nm/12kts
1904	Danton class BB	18000t max	2	36000			2T2x305+4T2x240	21kts-5000nm/12kts
				162000	162000
1905	Armored Cruiser	15000t max	2	30000			6T2x240+8x140	21kts-5000nm/12kts
1906	Cruiser Dupleix	8000t max	4	32000			4T2x164	25kts-5000nm/12kts
1907	Torpedo Boat (Chasseur)	1500t	12	18000			3x100+4TTx450	27kts-5000nm/12kts
1907	Patrol Gunboat	500t	20	10000			3x100	16kts-5000nm/12kts
1908	Courbet class BB	20000t max	2	40000			6T2x305-Study5	21kts-5000nm/12kts
1909	BC	20000t max	2	40000			4T2x305	27kts-5000nm/12kts
				170000	170000
					490000

Jef