French Navy

[Jefgte]

1865-1879 Plan


LD 1865
2x6300t-4x240mm+8x140-belt 6"& 2" - 15kts
6GBx1800t - 6x140 -15kts
...

LD 1872
2nd class Battleship -
9000t -8x274(deck mount)+6x140-15kts-belt 220
6600t - 8x240+8x140
...

LD 1876
9800t - 4x340+4x274+8x140 - Devastation class


...

[Korpen]

1861-1869 Plan

LD 1861
2x6600t Ironclade with 8x240 & 8x140-13.2kts

LD 1862
Next are the 2nd class battleships, Ironclade Rochambeau (ex USS Dunderberg) & LaFayette
With the normal calculation they are now nearly 9000t...

LD 1863
4x2500t Armored Gunboats with 6x140 - 13.5kts - belt 2"

LD 1864
4x2500t Armored Gunboats with 6x140 - 13.5kts - belt 2"

LD 1865
3rd class Battleship
With 240mm guns - 15kts

LD 1866
3rd class Battleship
With 240mm guns - 15kts

Why such a focus on ships already obsolete when the game start?

[Tanthalas]

its possible he is trying to do like me and show a history in his fleet.  I supose your planing to laydown all your ships in 1879, thus giving yourself the largest most modern fleet possible?

[Korpen]

its possible he is trying to do like me and show a history in his fleet. 

The question was not addressed to you.

I supose your planing to laydown all your ships in 1879, thus giving yourself the largest most modern fleet possible?

And that silly statement is not worth to write even this much in reply.

[Jefgte]

Why such a focus on ships already obsolete when the game start?

That's not a focus but the 1861-1879 SS.

If there is a war or colonial conquests in 1880 -81-82 ..., these old ships -1861-1869 could be useful in secondary actions -with perhaps modern guns (?)

They could be useful too to close Dover Strait & protect British & French coasts vs Viking incursions  :)  :)  :)


Jef  ;)

[Jefgte]

I have rework the 1860-70-75 fleet with 120 000t

Here is the actual board - some adjustements to come...

Name	LD	Normal	Dimensions	Armament	Kts		Protection	Classement
Terrible	1865	4500	80x18	4x240+6x140+8x47	14.5kts		B150	3rdBB
Tempète	1865	4500	80x18	4x240+6x140+8x47	14.5kts		B150	3rdBB
Tonnerre	1865	4500	80x18	4x240+6x140+8x47	14.5kts		B150	3rdBB
Triomphant	1865	4500	80x18	4x240+6x140+8x47	14.5kts		B150	3rdBB
Témeraire	1865	4500	80x18	4x240+6x140+8x47	14.5kts		B150	3rdBB
Tonnant	1865	4500	80x18	4x240+6x140+8x47	14.5kts		B150	3rdBB
Audacieux	1865	1800		4x140	14.5kts		B50	AGB
Ardent	1865	1800		4x140	14.5kts		B50	AGB
Aventurier	1865	1800		4x140	14.5kts		B50	AGB
Adroit	1865	1800		4x140	14.5kts		B50	AGB
P1	1865	750		2x100+2x47	12kts		0	CGB
P2	1865	750		2x100+2x47	12kts		0	CGB
P3	1865	750		2x100+2x47	12kts		0	CGB
P4	1865	750		2x100+2x47	12kts		0	CGB
P5	1865	750		2x100+2x47	12kts		0	CGB
P6	1865	750		2x100+2x47	12kts		0	CGB
P7	1865	750		2x100+2x47	12kts		0	CGB
P8	1865	750		2x100+2x47	12kts		0	CGB
P9	1865	750		2x100+2x47	12kts		0	CGB
P10	1865	750		2x100+2x47	12kts		0	CGB
P11	1865	750		2x100+2x47	12kts		0	CGB
P12	1865	750		2x100+2x47	12kts		0	CGB
TOTAL 1865	1865	43200t
Victorieuse	1870	5600	78.6x14.8x7.37	6x240+6x140	14.5kts		B150-BBte&Bks120	3rdBB
Vengeur	1870	5600	78.6x14.8x7.37	6x240+6x140	14.5kts		B150-BBte&Bks120	3rdBB
Infatigable	1870	8000	100.7x19.8x7.8	8x274+6x140	14.5kts		B350-BBte300-240-D45-60	2ndBB
Indomptable	1870	8000	100.7x19.8x7.8	8x274+6x140	14.5kts		B350-BBte300-240-D45-60	2ndBB
Furieux	1870	1800		6x140	14.5kts		B50	AGB
Féroce	1870	1800		6x140	14.5kts		B50	AGB
Fulminant	1870	1800		6x140	14.5kts		B50	AGB
Farouche	1870	1800		6x140	14.5kts		B50	AGB
Fonceur	1870	1800		6x140	14.5kts		B50	AGB
Foudre	1870	1800		6x140	14.5kts		B50	AGB
Foudroyant	1870	1800		6x140	14.5kts		B50	AGB
Fougueux	1870	1800		6x140	14.5kts		B50	AGB
TOTAL 1870	1870	41600t
Wagram	1875	10700	96x20x8.23	4x340+4x274+4x140+8x47	15kts		B380-D60-BBte300	1stBB
Austerlitz	1875	10700	96x20x8.23	4x340+4x274+4x140+8x47	15kts		B380-D60-BBte300	1stBB
Valmy	1875	6600		8x240+8x140 (2x420+6x140)	15kts		B150	3rdBB
Fontenoy	1875	6600		8x240+8x140 (2x420+6x140)	15kts		B150	3rdBB
T1	1875	80		1x47+1tt	18kts		0	TB
T2	1875	80		1x47+1tt	18kts		0	TB
T3	1875	80		1x47+1tt	18kts		0	TB
T4	1875	80		1x47+1tt	18kts		0	TB
TOTAL 1875	1875	34920t
		119720t	42 Warships

[Jefgte]

Much part of the normal displacements are coming from SS made for N4.
I must rework all SS of the board to finalise the list.

So, the first, the Terrible class of 6 x 3rd class BB is actualy 4700t with a Belt of 120mm , not 4500t...  ???  ???  ???

Reduce the speed by 0.3kts ... Jef  ???  ???  ???

[Korpen]

SO when do we get to see the setup budget? ;)

[Jefgte]

Update

Name	LD	Normal	Dimensions	Armament	Kts		Protection	Classement
Terrible	1865	4500	80x18x5.6	4x240+6x140+8x47	14kts		B120	3rdBB
Tempète	1865	4500	80x18x5.6	4x240+6x140+8x47	14kts		B120	3rdBB
Tonnerre	1865	4500	80x18x5.6	4x240+6x140+8x47	14kts		B120	3rdBB
Triomphant	1865	4500	80x18x5.6	4x240+6x140+8x47	14kts		B120	3rdBB
Témeraire	1865	4500	80x18x5.6	4x240+6x140+8x47	14kts		B120	3rdBB
Tonnant	1865	4500	80x18x5.6	4x240+6x140+8x47	14kts		B120	3rdBB
Audacieux	1865	1800	62x13x3.81	4x140	14kts		B50	AGB
Ardent	1865	1800	62x13x3.81	4x140	14kts		B50	AGB
Aventurier	1865	1800	62x13x3.81	4x140	14kts		B50	AGB
Adroit	1865	1800	62x13x3.81	4x140	14kts		B50	AGB
P1	1865	650	48x10x2.46	4x100+2x47	12kts		0	CGB
P2	1865	650	48x10x2.46	4x100+2x47	12kts		0	CGB
P3	1865	650	48x10x2.46	4x100+2x47	12kts		0	CGB
P4	1865	650	48x10x2.46	4x100+2x47	12kts		0	CGB
P5	1865	650	48x10x2.46	4x100+2x47	12kts		0	CGB
P6	1865	650	48x10x2.46	4x100+2x47	12kts		0	CGB
P7	1865	650	48x10x2.46	4x100+2x47	12kts		0	CGB
P8	1865	650	48x10x2.46	4x100+2x47	12kts		0	CGB
P9	1865	650	48x10x2.46	4x100+2x47	12kts		0	CGB
P10	1865	650	48x10x2.46	4x100+2x47	12kts		0	CGB
P11	1865	650	48x10x2.46	4x100+2x47	12kts		0	CGB
P12	1865	650	48x10x2.46	4x100+2x47	12kts		0	CGB
TOTAL 1865	Tonnage	42000
Infatigable	1870	8000	95x20x7.18	8x274+6x140	14.5kts		B280-BBte250	2ndBB
Indomptable	1870	8000	95x20x7.18	8x274+6x140	14.5kts		B280-BBte250	2ndBB
Vengeur	1870	5200	77x18x6.2	6x240+6x140+4x47	14.5kts		B150-BBte&Bks100	3rdBB
Victorieuse	1870	5200	77x18x6.2	6x240+6x140+4x47	14.5kts		B150-BBte&Bks100	3rdBB
Furieux	1870	1800	69x13x3.65	6x140	14.5kts		B50	AGB
Féroce	1870	1800	69x13x3.65	6x140	14.5kts		B50	AGB
Fulminant	1870	1800	69x13x3.65	6x140	14.5kts		B50	AGB
Farouche	1870	1800	69x13x3.65	6x140	14.5kts		B50	AGB
Fonceur	1870	1800	69x13x3.65	6x140	14.5kts		B50	AGB
Foudre	1870	1800	69x13x3.65	6x140	14.5kts		B50	AGB
Foudroyant	1870	1800	69x13x3.65	6x140	14.5kts		B50	AGB
Fougueux	1870	1800	69x13x3.65	6x140	14.5kts		B50	AGB
Frondeur	1870	1800	69x13x3.65	6x140	14.5kts		B50	AGB
Flamboyant	1870	1800	69x13x3.65	6x140	14.5kts		B50	AGB
TOTAL 1870	Tonnage	44400
Austerlitz	1875	9700	99x21x7.95	4x340+4x274+8x140+8x47	15kts		B380-D60	1stBB
Wagram	1875	9700	99x21x7.95	4x340+4x274+8x140+8x47	15kts		B380-D60	1stBB
Valmy	1875	6400	89x19x6.47	8x240+8x140	15kts		B150	3rdBB
Fontenoy	1875	6400	89x19x6.47	8x240+8x140	15kts		B150	3rdBB
T1	1875	80	38x4.3x1.25	1x47+1ttx350	17.2kts		0	TB
T2	1875	80	38x4.3x1.25	1x47+1ttx350	17.2kts		0	TB
T3	1875	80	38x4.3x1.25	1x47+1ttx350	17.2kts		0	TB
T4	1875	80	38x4.3x1.25	1x47+1ttx350	17.2kts		0	TB
TOTAL 1875	Tonnage	32520
	Tonnage	118520	44 Warships	2x9700
				2x8000
				2x6400
				2x5200
				6x4500
				14x1800
				12x750
				4x80

With the warships dimensions, Slipways could be dimensionned.

Budget 'll come after 120 000t & slipways list

Jef

[Jefgte]

OK, now the total is 120 000t
I have changed the 1875-6400t-Valmy class by 1875-3570t-Alma class.

I could start to work seriously on the budget.

Name	LD	Normal	Dimensions	Armament	Kts		Protection	Classement
Terrible	1865	4500	80x18x5.6	4x240+6x140+8x47	14kts		B120	3rdBB
Tempète	1865	4500	80x18x5.6	4x240+6x140+8x47	14kts		B120	3rdBB
Tonnerre	1865	4500	80x18x5.6	4x240+6x140+8x47	14kts		B120	3rdBB
Triomphant	1865	4500	80x18x5.6	4x240+6x140+8x47	14kts		B120	3rdBB
Témeraire	1865	4500	80x18x5.6	4x240+6x140+8x47	14kts		B120	3rdBB
Tonnant	1865	4500	80x18x5.6	4x240+6x140+8x47	14kts		B120	3rdBB
Audacieux	1865	1800	62x13x3.81	4x140	14kts		B50	AGB
Ardent	1865	1800	62x13x3.81	4x140	14kts		B50	AGB
Aventurier	1865	1800	62x13x3.81	4x140	14kts		B50	AGB
Adroit	1865	1800	62x13x3.81	4x140	14kts		B50	AGB
P1	1865	650	48x10x2.46	4x100+2x47	12kts		0	CGB
P2	1865	650	48x10x2.46	4x100+2x47	12kts		0	CGB
P3	1865	650	48x10x2.46	4x100+2x47	12kts		0	CGB
P4	1865	650	48x10x2.46	4x100+2x47	12kts		0	CGB
P5	1865	650	48x10x2.46	4x100+2x47	12kts		0	CGB
P6	1865	650	48x10x2.46	4x100+2x47	12kts		0	CGB
P7	1865	650	48x10x2.46	4x100+2x47	12kts		0	CGB
P8	1865	650	48x10x2.46	4x100+2x47	12kts		0	CGB
P9	1865	650	48x10x2.46	4x100+2x47	12kts		0	CGB
P10	1865	650	48x10x2.46	4x100+2x47	12kts		0	CGB
P11	1865	650	48x10x2.46	4x100+2x47	12kts		0	CGB
P12	1865	650	48x10x2.46	4x100+2x47	12kts		0	CGB
TOTAL 1865	Tonnage	42000
Infatigable	1870	8000	95x20x7.18	8x274+6x140	14.5kts		B280-BBte250	2ndBB
Indomptable	1870	8000	95x20x7.18	8x274+6x140	14.5kts		B280-BBte250	2ndBB
Vengeur	1870	5200	77x18x6.2	6x240+6x140+4x47	14.5kts		B150-BBte&Bks100	3rdBB
Victorieuse	1870	5200	77x18x6.2	6x240+6x140+4x47	14.5kts		B150-BBte&Bks100	3rdBB
Furieux	1870	1800	69x13x3.65	6x140	14.5kts		B50	AGB
Féroce	1870	1800	69x13x3.65	6x140	14.5kts		B50	AGB
Fulminant	1870	1800	69x13x3.65	6x140	14.5kts		B50	AGB
Farouche	1870	1800	69x13x3.65	6x140	14.5kts		B50	AGB
Fonceur	1870	1800	69x13x3.65	6x140	14.5kts		B50	AGB
Foudre	1870	1800	69x13x3.65	6x140	14.5kts		B50	AGB
Foudroyant	1870	1800	69x13x3.65	6x140	14.5kts		B50	AGB
Fougueux	1870	1800	69x13x3.65	6x140	14.5kts		B50	AGB
Frondeur	1870	1800	69x13x3.65	6x140	14.5kts		B50	AGB
Flamboyant	1870	1800	69x13x3.65	6x140	14.5kts		B50	AGB
TOTAL 1870	Tonnage	44400
Austerlitz	1875	9700	99x21x7.95	4x340+4x274+8x140+8x47	15kts		B380-D60	1stBB
Wagram	1875	9700	99x21x7.95	4x340+4x274+8x140+8x47	15kts		B380-D60	1stBB
Alma	1875	3570	80x16.4x4.69	4x194+4x140+4x47	16kts		B100	Frégate
Solférino	1875	3570	80x16.4x4.69	4x194+4x140+4x47	16kts		B100	Frégate
Malakoff	1875	3570	80x16.4x4.69	4x194+4x140+4x47	16kts		B100	Frégate
Sébastopol	1875	3570	80x16.4x4.69	4x194+4x140+4x47	16kts		B100	Frégate
T1	1875	80	38x4.3x1.25	1x47+1ttx350	17.2kts		0	TB
T2	1875	80	38x4.3x1.25	1x47+1ttx350	17.2kts		0	TB
T3	1875	80	38x4.3x1.25	1x47+1ttx350	17.2kts		0	TB
T4	1875	80	38x4.3x1.25	1x47+1ttx350	17.2kts		0	TB
TOTAL 1875	Tonnage	34000
	Tonnage	120000	46 Warships	2x9700
				2x8000
				2x5200
				6x4500
				4x3570
				14x1800
				12x750
				4x80

[Jefgte]

CF1, France Cannonière Fluviale laid down 1878

Displacement:
   79 t light; 96 t standard; 100 t normal; 103 t full load

Dimensions: Length (overall / waterline) x beam x draught (normal/deep)
   (91.86 ft / 91.86 ft) x 16.40 ft x (3.87 / 3.97 ft)
   (28.00 m / 28.00 m) x 5.00 m  x (1.18 / 1.21 m)

Armament:
      2 - 3.94" / 100.0 mm 22.3 cal guns - 24.91lbs / 11.30kg shells, 500 per gun
     Breech loading guns in deck mounts, 1878 Model
     2 x Single mounts on centreline, evenly spread
      2 - 1.85" / 47.0 mm 22.3 cal guns - 2.59lbs / 1.17kg shells, 400 per gun
     Breech loading guns in deck mounts, 1878 Model
     2 x Single mounts on sides amidships
      4 - 0.30" / 7.7 mm 22.3 cal guns - 0.01lbs / 0.01kg shells, 3 000 per gun
     Breech loading guns in deck mounts, 1878 Model
     4 x Single mounts on sides, evenly spread
      Weight of broadside 55 lbs / 25 kg

Armour:
   - Gun armour:   Face (max)   Other gunhouse (avg)   Barbette/hoist (max)
   Main:   0.79" / 20 mm         -               -
   2nd:   0.39" / 10 mm         -               -
   3rd:   0.39" / 10 mm         -               -

Machinery:
   Coal fired boilers, simple reciprocating steam engines,
   Direct drive, 1 shaft, 54 ihp / 40 Kw = 8.00 kts
   Range 1 000nm at 5.00 kts
   Bunker at max displacement = 7 tons (100% coal)

Complement:
   15 - 20

Cost:
   £0.006 million / $0.023 million

Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
   Armament: 4 tons, 4.4 %
      - Guns: 4 tons, 4.4 %
   Armour: 19 tons, 18.9 %
      - Armament: 19 tons, 18.9 %
   Machinery: 11 tons, 11.4 %
   Hull, fittings & equipment: 41 tons, 40.6 %
   Fuel, ammunition & stores: 21 tons, 20.7 %
   Miscellaneous weights: 4 tons, 4.0 %
      - On freeboard deck: 4 tons

Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
   Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
     153 lbs / 69 Kg = 6.1 x 3.9 " / 100 mm shells or 0.4 torpedoes
   Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1.83
   Metacentric height 0.9 ft / 0.3 m
   Roll period: 7.3 seconds
   Steadiness   - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 69 %
         - Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0.14
   Seaboat quality  (Average = 1.00): 1.10

Hull form characteristics:
   Hull has raised forecastle,
     a normal bow and a round stern
   Block coefficient (normal/deep): 0.600 / 0.603
   Length to Beam Ratio: 5.60 : 1
   'Natural speed' for length: 9.58 kts
   Power going to wave formation at top speed: 38 %
   Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 63
   Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): 0.00 degrees
   Stern overhang: 0.00 ft / 0.00 m
   Freeboard (% = length of deck as a percentage of waterline length):
            Fore end,    Aft end
      - Forecastle:   10.00 %,  3.94 ft / 1.20 m,  3.94 ft / 1.20 m
      - Forward deck:   20.00 %,  2.62 ft / 0.80 m,  2.62 ft / 0.80 m
      - Aft deck:   40.00 %,  2.62 ft / 0.80 m,  2.62 ft / 0.80 m
      - Quarter deck:   30.00 %,  2.62 ft / 0.80 m,  2.62 ft / 0.80 m
      - Average freeboard:      2.76 ft / 0.84 m
   Ship tends to be wet forward

Ship space, strength and comments:
   Space   - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 65.5 %
      - Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 35.9 %
   Waterplane Area: 1 078 Square feet or 100 Square metres
   Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 171 %
   Structure weight / hull surface area: 31 lbs/sq ft or 154 Kg/sq metre
   Hull strength (Relative):
      - Cross-sectional: 1.06
      - Longitudinal: 1.50
      - Overall: 1.10
   Excellent machinery, storage, compartmentation space
   Extremely poor accommodation and workspace room

CF1 to CF20

[Jefgte]

Here is the early drawing of the Rochambeau class
This class, Rochambeau & Lafayette are the older warships of the Marine Nationale.
In 1880, with a medium battleship armement & the relatively light armor, they are classed as Second Class Battleships.
Note the early searchilght on the bridge & the multiple pipes added for the crew confort.



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Jef

[Jefgte]

The final drawing of The Rochambeau class.



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Jef