Europe Buildup

[Darman]

Yep. just trying to hedge against the possibility that I may not have an English-speaking colony to work with.  It would take a little more effort to manage that set of history in my opinion than an English-language break from OTL

[miketr]

Never mind Kaiser Dropped out all moot.

Michael  

[Guinness]

If Kirk is out, I'm going to take Britain. A quicky proposed alternate British history is forthcoming.

[Carthaginian]

What about France?
Is the Franco-Prussian war roughly where France finally collapses?

Most of the history of Acadia is going to depend upon when French influence and support ended- from the way they talk and how their ships look to their general governmental structure all hinge upon when Paris finally cracks.

[Guinness]

Here's my thinking for Britain, and how it might fit with France and their colonies:

I think the major PoD for Britain is Henry VIII and Anne Boleyn have a son, which results in a couple of hundred years of Tudor dynasty, lasting well into the the 18th century. It's likely the Armada never sails from Spain, which may be useful for our purposes, and also that the British never got too involved in Portugal, which might also be useful for explaining a unified Iberian peninsula.

This also means no Hanoverians on the British throne, and further back no glorious revolution. Also, probably, a monarch with more direct power longer. The schism with the Church in Rome would still happen, of course.

With no Stuart dynasty, there is likely better relations between England and the Dutch, so no William of Orange in England, and I think maybe no 1st Anglo-Dutch war. At some point they come to blows over trade routes, etc. and fight an analog to the Second Dutch War, which results in New Amsterdam coming under English management. That is unless Darman wants New Yorkers to speak Dutch. :)

English colonization of N. America still happens. The 7 Years War probably lasts longer, with a less amicable negotiated settlement, the end result of which is something useful for our North America, particularly that France holds onto its colonies there. Both Britain and France are even worse off than OTL, and put the screws to their colonies to raise money. This eventually leads to revolt in North America, or what have you, resulting in free standing states there. Details of that business can be up to those in Nverse N. America.

So the result is, by 1800 or so, the King rules just Britain and Ireland with no overseas colonies.

To answer Carthaginian's query, at least the way I see it: France has more potential enemies on it's borders, including a stronger Holland, various Germans, etc. and after 1763 is just about out of money. While the British can sit relatively safely across the English Channel, the French don't have the luxury. France starts to crumble on the edges. Maybe there is no Napoleon, or if there is, his time is more disastrous for France than historical. Eventually the power vacuum left by a weaker France and Britain leads to an earlier than historical unification of Germany, a little bit healthier Austria, and unity of Italy. France continues to crumble until we have a rump state (to be NPC) there, and maybe a few more independent Duchies or that sort of thing. I also maybe envision a larger than historical nation of some sort centered on the Dutch in the low countries, also an NPC.

So France was still largely as we remember until the French and Indian War, and Quebec can be more Creole, if that's what Carthaginian wants.

This is still all very sketchy and speculative, so I'm quite interested in opinions from others.

[Carthaginian]

Sounds good enough to me.
Spreads the blame for France's crumbling around enough that there is no one 'hated enemy', which I don't like, though. I'd prefer something like the Franco-Prussian war to finally kill France to make me have a 'hated adversary' with whom to compete- especially for oversees colonial possessions.
"Creole' culture as we in the US will not exist- when I said 'creole' I meant it in the linguistic sense rather than as a proper noun. The national language (which will come into play mostly for naming ships) will be a blend of French and a native tongue (for which I will use Muskogee due to plentiful resources) and the culture will be a mix of the two peoples- including associated religious and social cross-pollination.
I don't mean that I'll have characters named 'Cooz Thibodeaux' who'll love to eat gumbo and drink Dixie beer.

[Guinness]

Oh, I think we can arrange it so that those of French descent dislike the Germans and English speakers if you like.

[Darman]

I realize this is sort of in  the wrong thread... but my idea (as of right now) is of constant tension between my New England/Holland and the Quebec/French nation to the north.  That would keep us both somewhat occupied along our landward borders. 

[Nobody]

I would like to point out, or rather ask, what if France does not start the Franco-Prussian war should make the myriad of German states unite? (ok there stopped being such an enormous number of "countries" some time earlier, but it is still an important question)

[Darman]

the economic benefits of the "zollverein"?  Possibly combined with Prussian industrial power and political intrigues...

[Nobody]

Still, it might mean that Bavaria, Baden and Württemberg could still be partly independent. Not that I would mind if I could integrate them quickly to grow in industrial power ;D

[miketr]

Still, it might mean that Bavaria, Baden and Württemberg could still be partly independent. Not that I would mind if I could integrate them quickly to grow in industrial power ;D

They were, they had fully diplomatic relations between each other and a number of other states.  The three Minor German kingdoms had their own Ministries of War, military budgets, taxes, etc.  It was part of the problem with the Imperial Government in terms of revenue income tax, etc was limited to the German States and not the Reich.  Wilhelm II was president of the German Federal Union with the title of Kaiser; note there were fights over the meaning of the title.  As Wilhelm I wanted to be Known as Emperor of the Germans but had to in effect settle for German Kaiser otherwise the treaty doesn't get done.

Why did any ethnic group solidify into states?

Michael

[miketr]

What I believe to be the current version of Europe

http://img806.imageshack.us/img806/3585/europev6a.png

List of NPC's (SUGGESTION ONLY)

France
-Brittany Free State
-Republican France (centered on Paris Communion)
-Duchy of Gascony (Imperial France)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Louis_Napol%C3%A9on,_Prince_Imperial
-Kingdom of Occitania (Royalist France)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Philippe,_comte_de_Paris

Switzerland

Belgium-Netherlands

Bosnia
Serbia
Wallachia
Moldova
Poland-Ukraine
Russia
Barbary Coast
Sultanate of Egypt
Persian Empire

[ctwaterman]

Italy is still missing the OTL area controlled by the House of Savoy before those regions were seized by France.   The City of Nice and its surrounding territories should probably go to Italy.

But other then that Excellent work I like the map and the NPC's

Charles

[Carthaginian]

Barbary coast sounds like a nice touch... I like it.
I take it that the three Frances will be little more than squabbling states looking to regain their former glory while slowly killing each other off? Great work on the map, just about got the world set up with it, right?