CSA Battlecruisers

[Jefgte]

CSA naval artillery

http://www.navalism.org/index.php?topic=3136.0

Nice drawings made by Guinness  ;)

Your SS  must use these guns, turrets & shells weights.


Jef  ;)

[Sachmle]

CSA naval artillery

http://www.navalism.org/index.php?topic=3136.0

Nice drawings made by Guinness  ;)

Your SS  must use these guns, turrets & shells weights.


Jef  ;)

Until you've designed your own, that is. Gun research is here

[Delta Force]

Can we calculate the muzzle energy by using metric units? I'm from the US, but I do prefer to do math using metric units since they are more intuitive.

I think that there is some kind of decimal error with the formulas given though. Can someone run me through what the muzzle energy would be for a 16/45 using the formula?

[Sachmle]

Can we calculate the muzzle energy by using metric units? I'm from the US, but I do prefer to do math using metric units since they are more intuitive.

I think that there is some kind of decimal error with the formulas given though. Can someone run me through what the muzzle energy would be for a 16/45 using the formula?

7372.8

[Jefgte]

...but I do prefer to do math using metric units since they are more intuitive.

...

I agree too, I can count on my fingers  :D  :D  :D

[Delta Force]

Can we calculate the muzzle energy by using metric units? I'm from the US, but I do prefer to do math using metric units since they are more intuitive.

I think that there is some kind of decimal error with the formulas given though. Can someone run me through what the muzzle energy would be for a 16/45 using the formula?

7372.8

What units are for that? I did the math earlier but I think the formula is off by a decimal place, since I ended up being able to lob something like a 20 metric ton shell at a km a second.

[P3D]

Can we calculate the muzzle energy by using metric units? I'm from the US, but I do prefer to do math using metric units since they are more intuitive.

I think that there is some kind of decimal error with the formulas given though. Can someone run me through what the muzzle energy would be for a 16/45 using the formula?

100MJ/m3 is the average energy per gun bore volume, if you prefer SI.

[mentat]

  - call me boring - but to have a Big Brother to Enterprise - 40 k tons, 8 x 15"(or 9 if you have Triple Mount yet) , 28/29 knots and good BB level protection seems the best route to go ...

[Delta Force]

I sacrificed main guns for a very high speed, and made it 35,000 tons so it doesn't count as a treaty battlecruiser. The lower displacement worked more to my advantage than against it, since the design is now much more optimized and can get a higher speed while still having near battleship levels of armor.

CSA Battlecruiser, CSA Battlecruiser laid down 1920

Displacement:
   35,000 t light; 36,743 t standard; 40,119 t normal; 42,820 t full load

Dimensions: Length overall / water x beam x draught
   885.83 ft / 885.83 ft x 98.43 ft x 29.36 ft (normal load)
   270.00 m / 270.00 m x 30.00 m  x 8.95 m

Armament:
      6 - 15.00" / 381 mm guns (2x3 guns), 2,000.00lbs / 907.18kg shells, 1920 Model
     Breech loading guns in turrets (on barbettes)
     on centreline ends, evenly spread
      20 - 4.75" / 121 mm guns (10x2 guns), 50.00lbs / 22.68kg shells, 1920 Model
     Quick firing guns in deck mounts with hoists
     on side ends, evenly spread
      4 - 1.58" / 40.0 mm guns in single mounts, 2.00lbs / 0.91kg shells, 1920 Model
     Anti-aircraft guns in deck mounts
     on centreline ends, evenly spread, all raised mounts - superfiring
   Weight of broadside 13,008 lbs / 5,900 kg
   Shells per gun, main battery: 128

Armour:
   - Belts:      Width (max)   Length (avg)      Height (avg)
   Main:   12.0" / 305 mm   535.00 ft / 163.07 m   16.50 ft / 5.03 m
   Ends:   Unarmoured
     Main Belt covers 93 % of normal length

   - Torpedo Bulkhead:
      2.00" / 51 mm   535.00 ft / 163.07 m   24.75 ft / 7.54 m

   - Gun armour:   Face (max)   Other gunhouse (avg)   Barbette/hoist (max)
   Main:   14.0" / 356 mm   8.00" / 203 mm      14.0" / 356 mm
   2nd:   3.00" / 76 mm   2.00" / 51 mm      3.00" / 76 mm

   - Armour deck: 3.00" / 76 mm, Conning tower: 14.00" / 356 mm

Machinery:
   Oil fired boilers, steam turbines,
   Geared drive, 4 shafts, 160,000 shp / 119,360 Kw = 31.16 kts
   Range 16,000nm at 12.00 kts
   Bunker at max displacement = 6,077 tons

Complement:
   1,416 - 1,842

Cost:
   £7.527 million / $30.110 million

Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
   Armament: 1,401 tons, 3.5 %
   Armour: 11,207 tons, 27.9 %
      - Belts: 4,517 tons, 11.3 %
      - Torpedo bulkhead: 980 tons, 2.4 %
      - Armament: 1,985 tons, 4.9 %
      - Armour Deck: 3,372 tons, 8.4 %
      - Conning Tower: 353 tons, 0.9 %
   Machinery: 5,594 tons, 13.9 %
   Hull, fittings & equipment: 16,398 tons, 40.9 %
   Fuel, ammunition & stores: 5,119 tons, 12.8 %
   Miscellaneous weights: 400 tons, 1.0 %

Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
   Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
     56,827 lbs / 25,776 Kg = 33.7 x 15.0 " / 381 mm shells or 7.9 torpedoes
   Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1.20
   Metacentric height 6.8 ft / 2.1 m
   Roll period: 15.9 seconds
   Steadiness   - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 70 %
         - Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0.51
   Seaboat quality  (Average = 1.00): 1.21

Hull form characteristics:
   Hull has a flush deck
   Block coefficient: 0.548
   Length to Beam Ratio: 9.00 : 1
   'Natural speed' for length: 29.76 kts
   Power going to wave formation at top speed: 47 %
   Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 58
   Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): 0.00 degrees
   Stern overhang: 0.00 ft / 0.00 m
   Freeboard (% = measuring location as a percentage of overall length):
      - Stem:      21.16 ft / 6.45 m
      - Forecastle (20 %):   21.16 ft / 6.45 m
      - Mid (50 %):      21.16 ft / 6.45 m
      - Quarterdeck (15 %):   21.16 ft / 6.45 m
      - Stern:      21.16 ft / 6.45 m
      - Average freeboard:   21.16 ft / 6.45 m
   Ship tends to be wet forward

Ship space, strength and comments:
   Space   - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 92.8 %
      - Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 173.0 %
   Waterplane Area: 60,760 Square feet or 5,645 Square metres
   Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 118 %
   Structure weight / hull surface area: 193 lbs/sq ft or 942 Kg/sq metre
   Hull strength (Relative):
      - Cross-sectional: 1.08
      - Longitudinal: 0.98
      - Overall: 1.00
   Hull space for machinery, storage, compartmentation is adequate
   Room for accommodation and workspaces is excellent
   Ship has slow, easy roll, a good, steady gun platform
   Good seaboat, rides out heavy weather easily

[Sachmle]

May take on what I think you're trying to do


Up-gunned Enterprise/Fast Tennessee, CSA 1st Class Cruiser/Battleship laid down 1920

Displacement:
   35,000 t light; 36,793 t standard; 40,112 t normal; 42,767 t full load

Dimensions: Length overall / water x beam x draught
   836.62 ft / 828.02 ft x 105.61 ft x 29.86 ft (normal load)
   255.00 m / 252.38 m x 32.19 m  x 9.10 m

Armament:
     8 - 15.00" / 381 mm guns (4x2 guns), 2,000.00lbs / 907.18kg shells, 1920 Model
     Breech loading guns in turrets (on barbettes)
     on centreline ends, evenly spread, 2 raised mounts - superfiring
     12 - 4.75" / 121 mm guns (6x2 guns), 50.00lbs / 22.68kg shells, 1920 Model
     Quick firing guns in deck mounts with hoists
     on side, all amidships
     4 - 4.75" / 121 mm guns in single mounts, 50.00lbs / 22.68kg shells, 1920 Model
     Quick firing guns in deck mounts
     on side, all amidships, all raised mounts - superfiring
     4 - 1.58" / 40.0 mm guns in single mounts, 2.00lbs / 0.91kg shells, 1920 Model
     Anti-aircraft guns in deck mounts
     on side ends, evenly spread, all raised mounts - superfiring
     12 - 1.00" / 25.4 mm guns (6x2 guns), 0.50lbs / 0.23kg shells, 1920 Model
     Machine guns in deck mounts
     on side, evenly spread, all raised mounts
   Weight of broadside 16,814 lbs / 7,627 kg
   Shells per gun, main battery: 105

Armour:
  - Belts:      Width (max)   Length (avg)      Height (avg)
   Main:   12.0" / 305 mm   538.00 ft / 163.98 m   16.00 ft / 4.88 m
   Ends:   Unarmoured
     Main Belt covers 100 % of normal length

  - Torpedo Bulkhead:
      1.50" / 38 mm   538.00 ft / 163.98 m   27.00 ft / 8.23 m

  - Gun armour:   Face (max)   Other gunhouse (avg)   Barbette/hoist (max)
   Main:   13.0" / 330 mm   4.00" / 102 mm      12.0" / 305 mm
   2nd:   2.00" / 51 mm   1.00" / 25 mm      1.50" / 38 mm

  - Armour deck: 3.00" / 76 mm, Conning tower: 12.00" / 305 mm

Machinery:
   Oil fired boilers, steam turbines,
   Geared drive, 4 shafts, 143,000 shp / 106,678 Kw = 30.02 kts
   Range 9,925nm at 15.00 kts
   Bunker at max displacement = 5,974 tons

Complement:
   1,416 - 1,842

Cost:
   £8.117 million / $32.467 million

Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
   Armament: 1,796 tons, 4.5 %
   Armour: 11,481 tons, 28.6 %
      - Belts: 4,407 tons, 11.0 %
      - Torpedo bulkhead: 806 tons, 2.0 %
      - Armament: 2,617 tons, 6.5 %
      - Armour Deck: 3,348 tons, 8.3 %
      - Conning Tower: 303 tons, 0.8 %
   Machinery: 5,000 tons, 12.5 %
   Hull, fittings & equipment: 16,362 tons, 40.8 %
   Fuel, ammunition & stores: 5,112 tons, 12.7 %
   Miscellaneous weights: 360 tons, 0.9 %

Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
   Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
     51,825 lbs / 23,508 Kg = 30.7 x 15.0 " / 381 mm shells or 7.5 torpedoes
   Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1.10
   Metacentric height 6.5 ft / 2.0 m
   Roll period: 17.4 seconds
   Steadiness   - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 70 %
         - Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0.65
   Seaboat quality  (Average = 1.00): 1.14

Hull form characteristics:
   Hull has rise forward of midbreak
   Block coefficient: 0.538
   Length to Beam Ratio: 7.84 : 1
   'Natural speed' for length: 28.78 kts
   Power going to wave formation at top speed: 49 %
   Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 61
   Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): 10.00 degrees
   Stern overhang: 3.31 ft / 1.01 m
   Freeboard (% = measuring location as a percentage of overall length):
      - Stem:      29.99 ft / 9.14 m
      - Forecastle (20 %):   26.74 ft / 8.15 m
      - Mid (53 %):      22.74 ft / 6.93 m (15.26 ft / 4.65 m aft of break)
      - Quarterdeck (17 %):   16.73 ft / 5.10 m
      - Stern:      18.73 ft / 5.71 m
      - Average freeboard:   21.58 ft / 6.58 m
   Ship tends to be wet forward

Ship space, strength and comments:
   Space   - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 93.7 %
      - Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 167.0 %
   Waterplane Area: 60,332 Square feet or 5,605 Square metres
   Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 111 %
   Structure weight / hull surface area: 198 lbs/sq ft or 967 Kg/sq metre
   Hull strength (Relative):
      - Cross-sectional: 0.99
      - Longitudinal: 1.06
      - Overall: 1.00
   Hull space for machinery, storage, compartmentation is adequate
   Room for accommodation and workspaces is excellent
   Ship has slow, easy roll, a good, steady gun platform

[Delta Force]

Well, the concept is somewhat Fisherite in that it is intended to have a very high speed to allow it to pick its engagements. It's about a knot slower than the fastest light cruisers and 3 knots or so faster than the fastest battleship. I might actually reduce its beam to 27 meters or so (the narrowest possible under the guidelines, and also the average beam of Royal Navy 15 inch battlecruisers) to try to further up the speed by reducing resistance.

[mentat]

2 x 15" for 1 knot is a tough sacrifice - not sure is worth it - esp. as in Open Seaway Big Fast ship can retain High Speed much better than CL or CA  - their speed advantage on paper soon disappears ...

  is the Flush deck deliberate choice - I think at 30+ knots more freeboard useful at the bow ..

  personally - although I like the extra speed - I'd still go for a 29 knot design with more armour  :)

[Delta Force]

That is true, in the North Atlantic and Pacific it is rather stormy so the speed advantage of the smaller ships should be lessened.