Cruiser Ideas

Started by Sachmle, July 20, 2010, 11:08:41 PM

Previous topic - Next topic

Sachmle

If NAaB is in the right ballpark the armor should be proof against a 260lbs 8" shell from 7,200yds (belt) out to 18,000yrds (deck) and against it's own guns from 11,000yds (belt) out to 18,000yds (deck). Also, Swampy was kind enough to do a story about how the tripple 24cm/L50 was the same barbette as the twin 28cm/L45, so I could swap them out rather easy if I so desired.

Kruezer A, Deutsche Reich Große Kruezer laid down 1920

Displacement:
   17,000 t light; 17,742 t standard; 19,325 t normal; 20,592 t full load

Dimensions: Length overall / water x beam x draught
   721.77 ft / 715.22 ft x 79.49 ft x 23.13 ft (normal load)
   220.00 m / 218.00 m x 24.23 m  x 7.05 m

Armament:
     12 - 9.45" / 240 mm guns (4x3 guns), 418.88lbs / 190.00kg shells, 1920 Model
     Breech loading guns in turrets (on barbettes)
     on centreline ends, evenly spread, 2 raised mounts - superfiring
     4 - 4.72" / 120 mm guns in single mounts, 52.91lbs / 24.00kg shells, 1920 Model
     Quick firing guns in deck mounts
     on side, all amidships
     2 - 1.46" / 37.0 mm guns in single mounts, 1.55lbs / 0.70kg shells, 1920 Model
     Anti-aircraft guns in deck mounts
     on side, evenly spread, all raised mounts
   Weight of broadside 5,241 lbs / 2,377 kg
   Shells per gun, main battery: 121
   8 - 19.7" / 500 mm above water torpedoes

Armour:
  - Belts:      Width (max)   Length (avg)      Height (avg)
   Main:   5.91" / 150 mm   464.90 ft / 141.70 m   10.99 ft / 3.35 m
   Ends:   Unarmoured
     Main Belt covers 100 % of normal length

  - Gun armour:   Face (max)   Other gunhouse (avg)   Barbette/hoist (max)
   Main:   5.91" / 150 mm   1.97" / 50 mm      5.91" / 150 mm

  - Armour deck: 2.36" / 60 mm, Conning tower: 5.91" / 150 mm

Machinery:
   Oil fired boilers, steam turbines,
   Geared drive, 4 shafts, 114,000 shp / 85,044 Kw = 31.56 kts
   Range 8,500nm at 14.00 kts
   Bunker at max displacement = 2,850 tons

Complement:
   819 - 1,065

Cost:
   £4.035 million / $16.139 million

Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
   Armament: 659 tons, 3.4 %
   Armour: 3,941 tons, 20.4 %
      - Belts: 1,269 tons, 6.6 %
      - Torpedo bulkhead: 0 tons, 0.0 %
      - Armament: 903 tons, 4.7 %
      - Armour Deck: 1,677 tons, 8.7 %
      - Conning Tower: 92 tons, 0.5 %
   Machinery: 3,986 tons, 20.6 %
   Hull, fittings & equipment: 8,063 tons, 41.7 %
   Fuel, ammunition & stores: 2,325 tons, 12.0 %
   Miscellaneous weights: 350 tons, 1.8 %

Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
   Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
     23,578 lbs / 10,695 Kg = 55.9 x 9.4 " / 240 mm shells or 2.3 torpedoes
   Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1.11
   Metacentric height 4.3 ft / 1.3 m
   Roll period: 16.1 seconds
   Steadiness   - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 70 %
         - Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0.62
   Seaboat quality  (Average = 1.00): 1.18

Hull form characteristics:
   Hull has a flush deck
   Block coefficient: 0.514
   Length to Beam Ratio: 9.00 : 1
   'Natural speed' for length: 26.74 kts
   Power going to wave formation at top speed: 52 %
   Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 59
   Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): 12.50 degrees
   Stern overhang: -4.92 ft / -1.50 m
   Freeboard (% = measuring location as a percentage of overall length):
      - Stem:      29.53 ft / 9.00 m
      - Forecastle (20 %):   21.33 ft / 6.50 m
      - Mid (50 %):      21.33 ft / 6.50 m
      - Quarterdeck (15 %):   21.33 ft / 6.50 m
      - Stern:      21.33 ft / 6.50 m
      - Average freeboard:   21.98 ft / 6.70 m

Ship space, strength and comments:
   Space   - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 95.1 %
      - Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 174.1 %
   Waterplane Area: 38,383 Square feet or 3,566 Square metres
   Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 110 %
   Structure weight / hull surface area: 142 lbs/sq ft or 693 Kg/sq metre
   Hull strength (Relative):
      - Cross-sectional: 0.98
      - Longitudinal: 1.18
      - Overall: 1.00
   Hull space for machinery, storage, compartmentation is adequate
   Room for accommodation and workspaces is excellent
   Ship has slow, easy roll, a good, steady gun platform

250t 1912 FC
25t LR W/T
24t 8 3t 50cm Torpedoes
51t Reserve
"All treaties between great states cease to be binding when they come in conflict with the struggle for existence."
Otto von Bismarck

"Give me a woman who loves beer and I will conquer the world."
Kaiser Wilhelm

"If stupidity were painfull I would be deaf from all the screaming." Sam A. Grim

miketr

More of the super cruisers, if you can fit 4x2 11" I would got for that myself.  Otherwise a nice cruiser killer.

ctwaterman

Hmmmm it appears to be right in the the 17K ton range where the Nassau treaty group looked over a 12 x 9.2" gunned cruiser killer.  A nice ship I like them but Italy probably cant afford more then 1 or 2 of them.

Charles
Just Browsing nothing to See Move Along

Sachmle

#3
Quote from: miketr on July 21, 2010, 07:18:57 AM
More of the super cruisers, if you can fit 4x2 11" I would got for that myself.  Otherwise a nice cruiser killer.
Kruezer A11, Deutsche Reich Große Kruezer laid down 1920

Displacement:
   17,000 t light; 17,742 t standard; 19,325 t normal; 20,592 t full load

Dimensions: Length overall / water x beam x draught
   721.77 ft / 715.22 ft x 79.49 ft x 23.13 ft (normal load)
   220.00 m / 218.00 m x 24.23 m  x 7.05 m

Armament:
     8 - 11.02" / 280 mm guns (4x2 guns), 661.39lbs / 300.00kg shells, 1920 Model
     Breech loading guns in turrets (on barbettes)
     on centreline ends, evenly spread, 2 raised mounts - superfiring
     4 - 4.72" / 120 mm guns in single mounts, 52.91lbs / 24.00kg shells, 1920 Model
     Quick firing guns in deck mounts
     on side, all amidships
     2 - 1.46" / 37.0 mm guns in single mounts, 1.55lbs / 0.70kg shells, 1920 Model
     Anti-aircraft guns in deck mounts
     on side, evenly spread, all raised mounts
   Weight of broadside 5,506 lbs / 2,497 kg
   Shells per gun, main battery: 115
   8 - 19.7" / 500 mm above water torpedoes

Armour:
  - Belts:      Width (max)   Length (avg)      Height (avg)
   Main:   5.91" / 150 mm   464.90 ft / 141.70 m   10.99 ft / 3.35 m
   Ends:   Unarmoured
     Main Belt covers 100 % of normal length

  - Gun armour:   Face (max)   Other gunhouse (avg)   Barbette/hoist (max)
   Main:   5.91" / 150 mm   1.97" / 50 mm      5.91" / 150 mm

  - Armour deck: 2.36" / 60 mm, Conning tower: 5.91" / 150 mm

Machinery:
   Oil fired boilers, steam turbines,
   Geared drive, 4 shafts, 114,000 shp / 85,044 Kw = 31.56 kts
   Range 8,500nm at 14.00 kts
   Bunker at max displacement = 2,850 tons

Complement:
   819 - 1,065

Cost:
   £4.108 million / $16.433 million

Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
   Armament: 697 tons, 3.6 %
   Armour: 3,887 tons, 20.1 %
      - Belts: 1,269 tons, 6.6 %
      - Torpedo bulkhead: 0 tons, 0.0 %
      - Armament: 850 tons, 4.4 %
      - Armour Deck: 1,677 tons, 8.7 %
      - Conning Tower: 92 tons, 0.5 %
   Machinery: 3,986 tons, 20.6 %
   Hull, fittings & equipment: 8,081 tons, 41.8 %
   Fuel, ammunition & stores: 2,325 tons, 12.0 %
   Miscellaneous weights: 350 tons, 1.8 %

Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
   Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
     22,862 lbs / 10,370 Kg = 34.1 x 11.0 " / 280 mm shells or 2.3 torpedoes
   Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1.10
   Metacentric height 4.3 ft / 1.3 m
   Roll period: 16.2 seconds
   Steadiness   - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 70 %
         - Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0.63
   Seaboat quality  (Average = 1.00): 1.15

Hull form characteristics:
   Hull has a flush deck
   Block coefficient: 0.514
   Length to Beam Ratio: 9.00 : 1
   'Natural speed' for length: 26.74 kts
   Power going to wave formation at top speed: 52 %
   Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 61
   Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): 12.50 degrees
   Stern overhang: -4.92 ft / -1.50 m
   Freeboard (% = measuring location as a percentage of overall length):
      - Stem:      29.53 ft / 9.00 m
      - Forecastle (18 %):   20.67 ft / 6.30 m
      - Mid (50 %):      20.67 ft / 6.30 m
      - Quarterdeck (18 %):   20.67 ft / 6.30 m
      - Stern:      20.67 ft / 6.30 m
      - Average freeboard:   21.29 ft / 6.49 m

Ship space, strength and comments:
   Space   - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 96.4 %
      - Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 168.8 %
   Waterplane Area: 38,383 Square feet or 3,566 Square metres
   Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 109 %
   Structure weight / hull surface area: 143 lbs/sq ft or 700 Kg/sq metre
   Hull strength (Relative):
      - Cross-sectional: 0.99
      - Longitudinal: 1.15
      - Overall: 1.00
   Hull space for machinery, storage, compartmentation is adequate
   Room for accommodation and workspaces is excellent
   Ship has slow, easy roll, a good, steady gun platform

250t 1912 FC
25t LR W/T
24t 8 3t 50cm Torpedoes
51t Reserve
"All treaties between great states cease to be binding when they come in conflict with the struggle for existence."
Otto von Bismarck

"Give me a woman who loves beer and I will conquer the world."
Kaiser Wilhelm

"If stupidity were painfull I would be deaf from all the screaming." Sam A. Grim

P3D

Does it worth building a cruiser killer with specifications to face the old Swiss cruisers with 8" guns?
The first purpose of a warship is to remain afloat. Anon.
Below 40 degrees, there is no law. Below 50 degrees, there is no God. sailor's maxim on weather in the Southern seas

Sachmle

#5
Quote from: P3D on July 21, 2010, 09:42:00 AM
Does it worth building a cruiser killer with specifications to face the old Swiss cruisers with 8" guns?
Really wasn't thinking about them, but still a good point. I looked over the "Cruisers of Navalism" and for ships in this size bracket (16-18,000t) 11" is the average main battery size. Belt is proof against 11" from ~12,000yds out and deck is proof from ~19,000yds in.

Kruezer A11b, Deutsche Reich Große Kruezer laid down 1920

Displacement:
   18,000 t light; 18,763 t standard; 20,400 t normal; 21,710 t full load

Dimensions: Length overall / water x beam x draught
   721.79 ft / 716.04 ft x 79.56 ft x 23.46 ft (normal load)
   220.00 m / 218.25 m x 24.25 m  x 7.15 m

Armament:
     8 - 11.02" / 280 mm guns (4x2 guns), 661.39lbs / 300.00kg shells, 1920 Model
     Breech loading guns in turrets (on barbettes)
     on centreline ends, evenly spread, 2 raised mounts - superfiring
     8 - 4.72" / 120 mm guns (4x2 guns), 52.91lbs / 24.00kg shells, 1920 Model
     Quick firing guns in deck mounts with hoists
     on side, evenly spread
     2 - 1.46" / 37.0 mm guns in single mounts, 1.55lbs / 0.70kg shells, 1920 Model
     Anti-aircraft guns in deck mounts
     on side, evenly spread, all raised mounts
     4 - 0.30" / 7.7 mm guns in single mounts, 0.02lbs / 0.01kg shells, 1920 Model
     Machine guns in deck mounts
     on side, evenly spread, all raised mounts
   Weight of broadside 5,718 lbs / 2,593 kg
   Shells per gun, main battery: 110
   8 - 19.7" / 500 mm above water torpedoes

Armour:
  - Belts:      Width (max)   Length (avg)      Height (avg)
   Main:   8.07" / 205 mm   464.90 ft / 141.70 m   10.99 ft / 3.35 m
   Ends:   Unarmoured
     Main Belt covers 100 % of normal length

  - Gun armour:   Face (max)   Other gunhouse (avg)   Barbette/hoist (max)
   Main:   8.07" / 205 mm   1.97" / 50 mm      8.07" / 205 mm
   2nd:   1.97" / 50 mm   0.98" / 25 mm      2.95" / 75 mm
   3rd:   0.98" / 25 mm         -               -
   4th:   0.59" / 15 mm         -               -

  - Armour deck: 2.17" / 55 mm, Conning tower: 7.87" / 200 mm

Machinery:
   Oil fired boilers, steam turbines,
   Geared drive, 4 shafts, 120,000 shp / 89,520 Kw = 31.64 kts
   Range 8,500nm at 14.00 kts
   Bunker at max displacement = 2,947 tons

Complement:
   853 - 1,109

Cost:
   £4.313 million / $17.251 million

Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
   Armament: 723 tons, 3.5 %
   Armour: 4,554 tons, 22.3 %
      - Belts: 1,736 tons, 8.5 %
      - Torpedo bulkhead: 0 tons, 0.0 %
      - Armament: 1,122 tons, 5.5 %
      - Armour Deck: 1,569 tons, 7.7 %
      - Conning Tower: 127 tons, 0.6 %
   Machinery: 4,196 tons, 20.6 %
   Hull, fittings & equipment: 8,177 tons, 40.1 %
   Fuel, ammunition & stores: 2,400 tons, 11.8 %
   Miscellaneous weights: 350 tons, 1.7 %

Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
   Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
     23,173 lbs / 10,511 Kg = 34.6 x 11.0 " / 280 mm shells or 2.3 torpedoes
   Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1.10
   Metacentric height 4.2 ft / 1.3 m
   Roll period: 16.2 seconds
   Steadiness   - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 62 %
         - Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0.58
   Seaboat quality  (Average = 1.00): 1.04

Hull form characteristics:
   Hull has a flush deck
   Block coefficient: 0.534
   Length to Beam Ratio: 9.00 : 1
   'Natural speed' for length: 26.76 kts
   Power going to wave formation at top speed: 53 %
   Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 60
   Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): 12.65 degrees
   Stern overhang: -8.20 ft / -2.50 m
   Freeboard (% = measuring location as a percentage of overall length):
      - Stem:      25.59 ft / 7.80 m
      - Forecastle (18 %):   19.69 ft / 6.00 m
      - Mid (50 %):      19.69 ft / 6.00 m
      - Quarterdeck (15 %):   19.69 ft / 6.00 m
      - Stern:      19.69 ft / 6.00 m
      - Average freeboard:   20.10 ft / 6.13 m
   Ship tends to be wet forward

Ship space, strength and comments:
   Space   - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 95.6 %
      - Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 157.6 %
   Waterplane Area: 39,178 Square feet or 3,640 Square metres
   Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 107 %
   Structure weight / hull surface area: 144 lbs/sq ft or 704 Kg/sq metre
   Hull strength (Relative):
      - Cross-sectional: 0.99
      - Longitudinal: 1.03
      - Overall: 1.00
   Hull space for machinery, storage, compartmentation is adequate
   Room for accommodation and workspaces is excellent

250t 1912 FC
25t LR W/T
24t 8 3t 50cm Torpedoes
51t Reserve
"All treaties between great states cease to be binding when they come in conflict with the struggle for existence."
Otto von Bismarck

"Give me a woman who loves beer and I will conquer the world."
Kaiser Wilhelm

"If stupidity were painfull I would be deaf from all the screaming." Sam A. Grim

P3D

I'd have more than four secondaries on a side, and increase draught a bit. Also, ~2.4m deep decks suggest 1.2m armor belt above water, and 2.15m below - the latter is excessive.
And on a 18000t ship, I'd put a TDS.
The first purpose of a warship is to remain afloat. Anon.
Below 40 degrees, there is no law. Below 50 degrees, there is no God. sailor's maxim on weather in the Southern seas

Desertfox

Building 18k ton ships to kill 6k ton ones is not very cost effective.
"We don't run from the end of the world. We CHARGE!" Schlock

http://www.schlockmercenary.com/d/20090102.html

P3D

Quote from: Desertfox on July 21, 2010, 11:48:28 AM
Building 18k ton ships to kill 6k ton ones is not very cost effective.

As the ship seems to be able to take on three without risking itself much, I'd say it is cost-effective.
The first purpose of a warship is to remain afloat. Anon.
Below 40 degrees, there is no law. Below 50 degrees, there is no God. sailor's maxim on weather in the Southern seas

Walter

QuoteAnd on a 18000t ship, I'd put a TDS.
Despite its size, the beam's so-so for an effective TDS.

Kaiser Kirk

It's interesting as it's similar- but overall better - to my Donar.  My engine tech isn't there, and I use coal, plus I made some purposely different decisions for a slightly different role.

For my part, I found a TDS unworkable unless I expanded the ship to over 20k light, and you'd probably want another meter or two of beam to fit minimal internal bulges and still have room for twin 11". Figure 17-18m minimal beam for twin 11", and 4m for each internal bulge, 25-26m would about minimum.
Did they beat the drum slowly,
Did they play the fife lowly,
Did they sound the death march, as they lowered you down,
Did the band play the last post and chorus,
Did the pipes play the flowers of the forest

Sachmle

#11
Quote from: P3D on July 21, 2010, 11:39:11 AM
I'd have more than four secondaries on a side, and increase draught a bit. Also, ~2.4m deep decks suggest 1.2m armor belt above water, and 2.15m below - the latter is excessive.
And on a 18000t ship, I'd put a TDS.
Quote from: Walter on July 21, 2010, 12:49:04 PM
QuoteAnd on a 18000t ship, I'd put a TDS.
Despite its size, the beam's so-so for an effective TDS.
Kruezer A11c, Deutsche Reich Große Kruezer laid down 1920

Displacement:
   18,000 t light; 18,762 t standard; 20,390 t normal; 21,692 t full load

Dimensions: Length overall / water x beam x draught
   721.79 ft / 716.04 ft x 80.38 ft x 25.26 ft (normal load)
   220.00 m / 218.25 m x 24.50 m  x 7.70 m

Armament:
     8 - 11.02" / 280 mm guns (4x2 guns), 661.39lbs / 300.00kg shells, 1920 Model
     Breech loading guns in turrets (on barbettes)
     on centreline ends, evenly spread, 2 raised mounts - superfiring
     12 - 4.72" / 120 mm guns (6x2 guns), 52.91lbs / 24.00kg shells, 1920 Model
     Quick firing guns in deck mounts with hoists
     on side, evenly spread
     4 - 1.46" / 37.0 mm guns (2x2 guns), 1.55lbs / 0.70kg shells, 1920 Model
     Anti-aircraft guns in deck mounts
     on centreline ends, evenly spread, all raised mounts
     4 - 0.30" / 7.7 mm guns in single mounts, 0.02lbs / 0.01kg shells, 1920 Model
     Machine guns in deck mounts
     on side ends, evenly spread, all raised mounts - superfiring
   Weight of broadside 5,932 lbs / 2,691 kg
   Shells per gun, main battery: 105
   8 - 19.7" / 500 mm above water torpedoes

Armour:
  - Belts:      Width (max)   Length (avg)      Height (avg)
   Main:   7.87" / 200 mm   465.88 ft / 142.00 m   10.66 ft / 3.25 m
   Ends:   Unarmoured
     Main Belt covers 100 % of normal length

  - Gun armour:   Face (max)   Other gunhouse (avg)   Barbette/hoist (max)
   Main:   7.87" / 200 mm   2.36" / 60 mm      7.87" / 200 mm
   2nd:   2.36" / 60 mm   1.18" / 30 mm      3.15" / 80 mm
   3rd:   1.18" / 30 mm         -               -
   4th:   1.18" / 30 mm         -               -

  - Armour deck: 2.36" / 60 mm, Conning tower: 7.87" / 200 mm

Machinery:
   Oil fired boilers, steam turbines,
   Geared drive, 4 shafts, 116,000 shp / 86,536 Kw = 31.53 kts
   Range 8,500nm at 14.00 kts
   Bunker at max displacement = 2,930 tons

Complement:
   853 - 1,109

Cost:
   £4.320 million / $17.279 million

Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
   Armament: 750 tons, 3.7 %
   Armour: 4,579 tons, 22.5 %
      - Belts: 1,644 tons, 8.1 %
      - Torpedo bulkhead: 0 tons, 0.0 %
      - Armament: 1,147 tons, 5.6 %
      - Armour Deck: 1,662 tons, 8.2 %
      - Conning Tower: 127 tons, 0.6 %
   Machinery: 4,056 tons, 19.9 %
   Hull, fittings & equipment: 8,261 tons, 40.5 %
   Fuel, ammunition & stores: 2,390 tons, 11.7 %
   Miscellaneous weights: 355 tons, 1.7 %

Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
   Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
     23,067 lbs / 10,463 Kg = 34.4 x 11.0 " / 280 mm shells or 2.4 torpedoes
   Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1.10
   Metacentric height 4.3 ft / 1.3 m
   Roll period: 16.3 seconds
   Steadiness   - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 62 %
         - Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0.59
   Seaboat quality  (Average = 1.00): 1.10

Hull form characteristics:
   Hull has a flush deck
   Block coefficient: 0.491
   Length to Beam Ratio: 8.91 : 1
   'Natural speed' for length: 26.76 kts
   Power going to wave formation at top speed: 52 %
   Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 57
   Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): 12.65 degrees
   Stern overhang: -8.20 ft / -2.50 m
   Freeboard (% = measuring location as a percentage of overall length):
      - Stem:      25.59 ft / 7.80 m
      - Forecastle (18 %):   19.69 ft / 6.00 m
      - Mid (50 %):      19.69 ft / 6.00 m
      - Quarterdeck (15 %):   19.69 ft / 6.00 m
      - Stern:      19.69 ft / 6.00 m
      - Average freeboard:   20.10 ft / 6.13 m
   Ship tends to be wet forward

Ship space, strength and comments:
   Space   - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 94.3 %
      - Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 153.1 %
   Waterplane Area: 38,031 Square feet or 3,533 Square metres
   Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 107 %
   Structure weight / hull surface area: 147 lbs/sq ft or 718 Kg/sq metre
   Hull strength (Relative):
      - Cross-sectional: 0.98
      - Longitudinal: 1.13
      - Overall: 1.00
   Hull space for machinery, storage, compartmentation is adequate
   Room for accommodation and workspaces is excellent

250t 1912 FC
25t LR W/T
24t 8 3t 50cm Torpedoes
56t Reserve
"All treaties between great states cease to be binding when they come in conflict with the struggle for existence."
Otto von Bismarck

"Give me a woman who loves beer and I will conquer the world."
Kaiser Wilhelm

"If stupidity were painfull I would be deaf from all the screaming." Sam A. Grim

Kaiser Kirk

Quote
Block coefficient: 0.491

Based on the BC's that Guinness has posted, I don't think that BC is enough. The only large warship with less was the CV Ranger, but even 6" cruisers are over .5

http://www.navalism.org/index.php?topic=727.msg44539#msg44539

Also, why trim the ship up to 57? It doesn't seem to have any benefit.
Did they beat the drum slowly,
Did they play the fife lowly,
Did they sound the death march, as they lowered you down,
Did the band play the last post and chorus,
Did the pipes play the flowers of the forest

Sachmle

#13
Block coefficient is a byproduct of 1) Not wanting to go over 18,000t 2) Following P3Ds advice to deepen the draft.

Trim to 57 increases the steadiness. While not 70, 62 is better than 58.
"All treaties between great states cease to be binding when they come in conflict with the struggle for existence."
Otto von Bismarck

"Give me a woman who loves beer and I will conquer the world."
Kaiser Wilhelm

"If stupidity were painfull I would be deaf from all the screaming." Sam A. Grim

Sachmle

#14
125t heavier, 32kts
Kruezer A11d, Deutsche Reich Große Kruezer laid down 1920

Displacement:
   18,125 t light; 18,889 t standard; 20,525 t normal; 21,833 t full load

Dimensions: Length overall / water x beam x draught
   721.79 ft / 716.04 ft x 79.56 ft x 25.00 ft (normal load)
   220.00 m / 218.25 m x 24.25 m  x 7.62 m

Armament:
     8 - 11.02" / 280 mm guns (4x2 guns), 661.39lbs / 300.00kg shells, 1920 Model
     Breech loading guns in turrets (on barbettes)
     on centreline ends, evenly spread, 2 raised mounts - superfiring
     12 - 4.72" / 120 mm guns (6x2 guns), 52.91lbs / 24.00kg shells, 1920 Model
     Quick firing guns in deck mounts with hoists
     on side, evenly spread
     4 - 1.46" / 37.0 mm guns (2x2 guns), 1.55lbs / 0.70kg shells, 1920 Model
     Anti-aircraft guns in deck mounts
     on centreline ends, evenly spread, all raised mounts
     4 - 0.30" / 7.7 mm guns in single mounts, 0.02lbs / 0.01kg shells, 1920 Model
     Machine guns in deck mounts
     on side ends, evenly spread, all raised mounts - superfiring
   Weight of broadside 5,932 lbs / 2,691 kg
   Shells per gun, main battery: 105
   8 - 19.7" / 500 mm above water torpedoes

Armour:
  - Belts:      Width (max)   Length (avg)      Height (avg)
   Main:   7.87" / 200 mm   465.22 ft / 141.80 m   10.66 ft / 3.25 m
   Ends:   Unarmoured
     Main Belt covers 100 % of normal length

  - Gun armour:   Face (max)   Other gunhouse (avg)   Barbette/hoist (max)
   Main:   7.87" / 200 mm   2.36" / 60 mm      7.87" / 200 mm
   2nd:   2.36" / 60 mm   1.18" / 30 mm      3.15" / 80 mm
   3rd:   1.18" / 30 mm         -               -
   4th:   1.18" / 30 mm         -               -

  - Armour deck: 2.17" / 55 mm, Conning tower: 7.87" / 200 mm

Machinery:
   Oil fired boilers, steam turbines,
   Geared drive, 4 shafts, 124,000 shp / 92,504 Kw = 32.00 kts
   Range 8,500nm at 14.00 kts
   Bunker at max displacement = 2,944 tons

Complement:
   856 - 1,114

Cost:
   £4.423 million / $17.690 million

Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
   Armament: 750 tons, 3.7 %
   Armour: 4,442 tons, 21.6 %
      - Belts: 1,641 tons, 8.0 %
      - Torpedo bulkhead: 0 tons, 0.0 %
      - Armament: 1,147 tons, 5.6 %
      - Armour Deck: 1,527 tons, 7.4 %
      - Conning Tower: 127 tons, 0.6 %
   Machinery: 4,336 tons, 21.1 %
   Hull, fittings & equipment: 8,243 tons, 40.2 %
   Fuel, ammunition & stores: 2,400 tons, 11.7 %
   Miscellaneous weights: 355 tons, 1.7 %

Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
   Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
     22,882 lbs / 10,379 Kg = 34.2 x 11.0 " / 280 mm shells or 2.2 torpedoes
   Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1.15
   Metacentric height 4.6 ft / 1.4 m
   Roll period: 15.5 seconds
   Steadiness   - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 52 %
         - Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0.53
   Seaboat quality  (Average = 1.00): 1.04

Hull form characteristics:
   Hull has a flush deck
   Block coefficient: 0.504
   Length to Beam Ratio: 9.00 : 1
   'Natural speed' for length: 26.76 kts
   Power going to wave formation at top speed: 53 %
   Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 50
   Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): 12.65 degrees
   Stern overhang: -8.20 ft / -2.50 m
   Freeboard (% = measuring location as a percentage of overall length):
      - Stem:      25.59 ft / 7.80 m
      - Forecastle (18 %):   19.69 ft / 6.00 m
      - Mid (50 %):      19.69 ft / 6.00 m
      - Quarterdeck (15 %):   19.69 ft / 6.00 m
      - Stern:      19.69 ft / 6.00 m
      - Average freeboard:   20.10 ft / 6.13 m
   Ship tends to be wet forward

Ship space, strength and comments:
   Space   - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 98.1 %
      - Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 152.7 %
   Waterplane Area: 38,109 Square feet or 3,540 Square metres
   Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 105 %
   Structure weight / hull surface area: 146 lbs/sq ft or 715 Kg/sq metre
   Hull strength (Relative):
      - Cross-sectional: 0.98
      - Longitudinal: 1.10
      - Overall: 1.00
   Hull space for machinery, storage, compartmentation is adequate
   Room for accommodation and workspaces is excellent

250t 1912 FC
25t LR W/T
24t 8 3t 50cm Torpedoes
56t Reserve
"All treaties between great states cease to be binding when they come in conflict with the struggle for existence."
Otto von Bismarck

"Give me a woman who loves beer and I will conquer the world."
Kaiser Wilhelm

"If stupidity were painfull I would be deaf from all the screaming." Sam A. Grim