NUS Shipyards

[Guinness]

I'd probably need to draw it out...

First: the Quad 14" turrets on KGV had a diameter of 40 feet, or a little over 12 meters. The triple 14" barbette on the US standards was only 29 or 30 feet, or 8.8 or 9 meters.

So I think a quad 9.2" might not to be so big as 11 meters. The 9.2" guns need not be quite so far apart, nor are they as big (of course).

If we go by the main belt length, that's 70% of total length. So yeah, the hull is going to pretty narrow forward and aft along the guns. Maybe as narrow as 10 meters.

I still think it might be doable, but it would come down to the details.

[Jefgte]

...you making a pic ...

I have not made drawing with Argentina look.

- They like much & massive funnels.
- They use tripod mast, that mean just one top observation place,
- Casemates in the hull, (exposed to heavy sea...)
- They use massive hull with good protection but with relatively light armament.


Jef

[Jefgte]

Better chance vs Wheeler

3T2x275-A-X-Y, NUS AC from Panzerschiff Study 23 laid down 1920

Displacement:
   12 000 t light; 12 552 t standard; 14 365 t normal; 15 815 t full load

Dimensions: Length overall / water x beam x draught
   649.61 ft / 649.61 ft x 72.18 ft x 23.83 ft (normal load)
   198.00 m / 198.00 m x 22.00 m  x 7.26 m

Armament:
      6 - 10.83" / 275 mm guns (3x2 guns), 634.55lbs / 287.83kg shells, 1920 Model
     Breech loading guns in turrets (on barbettes)
     on centreline ends, majority aft, 1 raised mount aft - superfiring
      8 - 4.72" / 120 mm guns (4x2 guns), 52.72lbs / 23.91kg shells, 1920 Model
     Breech loading guns in deck mounts
     on side, evenly spread
      4 - 1.57" / 40.0 mm guns (2x2 guns), 1.95lbs / 0.88kg shells, 1920 Model
     Anti-aircraft guns in deck mounts
     on side, evenly spread, all raised mounts
      4 - 0.50" / 12.7 mm guns in single mounts, 0.06lbs / 0.03kg shells, 1920 Model
     Anti-aircraft guns in deck mounts
     on side, evenly spread, all raised mounts
   Weight of broadside 4 237 lbs / 1 922 kg
   Shells per gun, main battery: 110
   6 - 21.0" / 533 mm above water torpedoes

Armour:
   - Belts:      Width (max)   Length (avg)      Height (avg)
   Main:   5.91" / 150 mm   419.95 ft / 128.00 m   11.00 ft / 3.35 m
   Ends:   3.15" / 80 mm   209.97 ft / 64.00 m   8.01 ft / 2.44 m
     19.69 ft / 6.00 m Unarmoured ends
     Main Belt covers 99 % of normal length

   - Gun armour:   Face (max)   Other gunhouse (avg)   Barbette/hoist (max)
   Main:   7.09" / 180 mm   3.94" / 100 mm      4.72" / 120 mm
   2nd:   0.79" / 20 mm         -               -
   3rd:   0.79" / 20 mm         -               -
   4th:   0.50" / 13 mm         -               -

   - Armour deck: 1.57" / 40 mm, Conning tower: 5.91" / 150 mm

Machinery:
   Oil fired boilers, steam turbines,
   Geared drive, 4 shafts, 76 000 shp / 56 696 Kw = 29.80 kts
   Range 12 000nm at 14.00 kts
   Bunker at max displacement = 3 263 tons

Complement:
   655 - 852

Cost:
   £2.924 million / $11.695 million

Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
   Armament: 530 tons, 3.7 %
   Armour: 2 891 tons, 20.1 %
      - Belts: 1 339 tons, 9.3 %
      - Torpedo bulkhead: 0 tons, 0.0 %
      - Armament: 605 tons, 4.2 %
      - Armour Deck: 871 tons, 6.1 %
      - Conning Tower: 75 tons, 0.5 %
   Machinery: 2 657 tons, 18.5 %
   Hull, fittings & equipment: 5 622 tons, 39.1 %
   Fuel, ammunition & stores: 2 365 tons, 16.5 %
   Miscellaneous weights: 300 tons, 2.1 %

Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
   Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
     15 194 lbs / 6 892 Kg = 23.9 x 10.8 " / 275 mm shells or 2.1 torpedoes
   Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1.11
   Metacentric height 3.7 ft / 1.1 m
   Roll period: 15.7 seconds
   Steadiness   - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 70 %
         - Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0.45
   Seaboat quality  (Average = 1.00): 1.09

Hull form characteristics:
   Hull has rise forward of midbreak
   Block coefficient: 0.450
   Length to Beam Ratio: 9.00 : 1
   'Natural speed' for length: 25.49 kts
   Power going to wave formation at top speed: 50 %
   Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 64
   Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): 0.00 degrees
   Stern overhang: 0.00 ft / 0.00 m
   Freeboard (% = measuring location as a percentage of overall length):
      - Stem:      28.87 ft / 8.80 m
      - Forecastle (18 %):   26.90 ft / 8.20 m
      - Mid (0 %):      24.41 ft / 7.44 m (16.40 ft / 5.00 m aft of break)
      - Quarterdeck (18 %):   16.40 ft / 5.00 m
      - Stern:      16.40 ft / 5.00 m
      - Average freeboard:   16.77 ft / 5.11 m

Ship space, strength and comments:
   Space   - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 90.5 %
      - Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 109.5 %
   Waterplane Area: 29 908 Square feet or 2 779 Square metres
   Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 113 %
   Structure weight / hull surface area: 127 lbs/sq ft or 620 Kg/sq metre
   Hull strength (Relative):
      - Cross-sectional: 0.99
      - Longitudinal: 1.08
      - Overall: 1.00
   Hull space for machinery, storage, compartmentation is adequate
   Room for accommodation and workspaces is adequate
   Ship has slow, easy roll, a good, steady gun platform

[mentat]

  Very nice

- just wondering if making it to a round 30 knots is better for wargaming purposes

- and how many extra tons required for an 8 gun 323 - that would pack a nice wallop  :)

[TexanCowboy]

Yes, but with armour even a Knoxville can penetrate.

[Sachmle]

Yes, but with armour even a Knoxville can penetrate.

Yes, if she survives long enough to get her 7.5s in range against the 10.8s. 0.70kts isn't much speed diff either..so a long time to close that range.

[Jefgte]

...and how many extra tons required for an 8 gun 323 - that would pack a nice wallop 

4T2x275 -  probably 14.000 to 15.000T - a kind of pocket Derfflinger...

I like  ;)


Jef

[Jefgte]

For the fun...  :D

BB, NUS 16x400-22kts laid down 1921 (Engine 1920)

Displacement:
   45 000 t light; 47 884 t standard; 49 640 t normal; 51 045 t full load

Dimensions: Length overall / water x beam x draught
   721.78 ft / 721.78 ft x 118.11 ft x 32.56 ft (normal load)
   220.00 m / 220.00 m x 36.00 m  x 9.92 m

Armament:
      16 - 15.75" / 400 mm guns (4x4 guns), 2 000.00lbs / 907.18kg shells, 1921 Model
     Breech loading guns in turrets (on barbettes)
     on centreline, evenly spread, 2 raised mounts
     Aft Main mounts separated by engine room
      16 - 6.00" / 152 mm guns (8x2 guns), 108.00lbs / 48.99kg shells, 1921 Model
     Breech loading guns in turrets (on barbettes)
     on side, evenly spread
      8 - 1.57" / 40.0 mm guns (4x2 guns), 1.95lbs / 0.88kg shells, 1921 Model
     Quick firing guns in deck mounts
     on side, evenly spread, all raised mounts
      4 - 0.50" / 12.7 mm guns in single mounts, 0.06lbs / 0.03kg shells, 1921 Model
     Machine guns in deck mounts
     on side, evenly spread, all raised mounts
   Weight of broadside 33 744 lbs / 15 306 kg
   Shells per gun, main battery: 100

Armour:
   - Belts:      Width (max)   Length (avg)      Height (avg)
   Main:   13.4" / 340 mm   469.16 ft / 143.00 m   16.01 ft / 4.88 m
   Ends:   5.98" / 152 mm   229.66 ft / 70.00 m   9.45 ft / 2.88 m
     22.97 ft / 7.00 m Unarmoured ends
   Upper:   5.98" / 152 mm   469.16 ft / 143.00 m   9.45 ft / 2.88 m
     Main Belt covers 100 % of normal length

   - Torpedo Bulkhead:
      1.77" / 45 mm   469.16 ft / 143.00 m   32.15 ft / 9.80 m

   - Gun armour:   Face (max)   Other gunhouse (avg)   Barbette/hoist (max)
   Main:   13.4" / 340 mm   5.98" / 152 mm      13.4" / 340 mm
   2nd:   4.72" / 120 mm   3.15" / 80 mm      3.94" / 100 mm
   3rd:   0.79" / 20 mm         -               -
   4th:   0.50" / 13 mm         -               -

   - Armour deck: 4.72" / 120 mm, Conning tower: 13.39" / 340 mm

Machinery:
   Oil fired boilers, steam turbines,
   Geared drive, 4 shafts, 55 732 shp / 41 576 Kw = 22.11 kts
   Range 7 000nm at 12.00 kts
   Bunker at max displacement = 3 162 tons

Complement:
   1 662 - 2 161

Cost:
   £13.520 million / $54.081 million

Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
   Armament: 4 124 tons, 8.3 %
   Armour: 17 607 tons, 35.5 %
      - Belts: 6 082 tons, 12.3 %
      - Torpedo bulkhead: 989 tons, 2.0 %
      - Armament: 4 564 tons, 9.2 %
      - Armour Deck: 5 583 tons, 11.2 %
      - Conning Tower: 390 tons, 0.8 %
   Machinery: 1 949 tons, 3.9 %
   Hull, fittings & equipment: 20 920 tons, 42.1 %
   Fuel, ammunition & stores: 4 641 tons, 9.3 %
   Miscellaneous weights: 400 tons, 0.8 %

Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
   Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
     57 097 lbs / 25 899 Kg = 29.2 x 15.7 " / 400 mm shells or 9.0 torpedoes
   Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1.03
   Metacentric height 6.8 ft / 2.1 m
   Roll period: 19.1 seconds
   Steadiness   - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 69 %
         - Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0.88
   Seaboat quality  (Average = 1.00): 1.25

Hull form characteristics:
   Hull has a flush deck
   Block coefficient: 0.626
   Length to Beam Ratio: 6.11 : 1
   'Natural speed' for length: 26.87 kts
   Power going to wave formation at top speed: 42 %
   Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 55
   Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): 0.00 degrees
   Stern overhang: 0.00 ft / 0.00 m
   Freeboard (% = measuring location as a percentage of overall length):
      - Stem:      26.25 ft / 8.00 m
      - Forecastle (20 %):   22.31 ft / 6.80 m
      - Mid (50 %):      19.03 ft / 5.80 m
      - Quarterdeck (18 %):   19.03 ft / 5.80 m
      - Stern:      19.03 ft / 5.80 m
      - Average freeboard:   20.49 ft / 6.25 m
   Ship tends to be wet forward

Ship space, strength and comments:
   Space   - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 91.6 %
      - Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 145.1 %
   Waterplane Area: 63 878 Square feet or 5 934 Square metres
   Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 90 %
   Structure weight / hull surface area: 251 lbs/sq ft or 1 225 Kg/sq metre
   Hull strength (Relative):
      - Cross-sectional: 0.97
      - Longitudinal: 1.39
      - Overall: 1.00
   Hull space for machinery, storage, compartmentation is adequate
   Room for accommodation and workspaces is excellent
   Good seaboat, rides out heavy weather easily

[TexanCowboy]

My Eyes!!!

[Borys]

I suggest working on the stability ...
Borys

[Sachmle]

OH MY GOD!! IT'S A QUAD QUAD!!!

Initiate "Brave Sir Robin" maneuver.

[Walter]

Initiate "Brave Sir Robin" maneuver.

We should not forget to play the song that accompanies that maneuver. ;D

Brave Sir Robin ran away.
Bravely ran away, away!
When danger reared its ugly head,
He bravely turned his tail and fled.
Yes, brave Sir Robin turned about
And gallantly he chickened out.
Bravely taking to his feet
He beat a very brave retreat,
Bravest of the brave, Sir Robin!

[Tanthalas]

skips the retreating and opens Fire, while screaming "DIE MOTHAFUCKA DIE"

[Walter]

Should it not be "Burn" instead of "Die"? :D

[Tanthalas]

Should it not be "Burn" instead of "Die"? :D

That is highly Dependant... Personaly I dont yell Burn when im laying down fire, but unto each his own.  For that matter I have a guy in my Platoon that says Ava Marias when he is shooting, so I supose Burn wouldnt be totaly out there.