Borys gave me an idea

[Sachmle]

So, here's a KM idea for 1920.

Germania, Brandenburg Schlachtschiffen laid down 1920

Displacement:
   46,000 t light; 48,008 t standard; 49,812 t normal; 51,255 t full load

Dimensions: Length overall / water x beam x draught
   885.81 ft / 879.27 ft x 117.29 ft x 29.53 ft (normal load)
   270.00 m / 268.00 m x 35.75 m  x 9.00 m

Armament:
      8 - 16.54" / 420 mm guns (4x2 guns), 2,259.74lbs / 1,025.00kg shells, 1920 Model
     Breech loading guns in turrets (on barbettes)
     on centreline, evenly spread, 1 raised mount
     Aft Main mounts separated by engine room
      16 - 5.91" / 150 mm guns (8x2 guns), 99.21lbs / 45.00kg shells, 1920 Model
     Quick firing guns in deck mounts with hoists
     on side, all amidships, 4 raised mounts - superfiring
      8 - 3.46" / 88.0 mm guns (4x2 guns), 22.05lbs / 10.00kg shells, 1920 Model
     Anti-aircraft guns in deck mounts
     on side ends, evenly spread, all raised mounts - superfiring
      8 - 1.97" / 50.0 mm guns (2x4 guns), 3.86lbs / 1.75kg shells, 1920 Model
     Anti-aircraft guns in deck mounts
     on side, all aft
      12 - 1.46" / 37.0 mm guns (3x4 guns), 1.55lbs / 0.70kg shells, 1920 Model
     Anti-aircraft guns in deck mounts
     on centreline, evenly spread, all raised mounts
   Weight of broadside 19,891 lbs / 9,022 kg
   Shells per gun, main battery: 90
   6 - 23.6" / 600 mm submerged torpedo tubes

Armour:
   - Belts:      Width (max)   Length (avg)      Height (avg)
   Main:   15.0" / 380 mm   571.69 ft / 174.25 m   16.40 ft / 5.00 m
   Ends:   3.94" / 100 mm   307.58 ft / 93.75 m   9.84 ft / 3.00 m
     Main Belt covers 100 % of normal length

   - Torpedo Bulkhead:
      1.97" / 50 mm   571.69 ft / 174.25 m   37.73 ft / 11.50 m

   - Gun armour:   Face (max)   Other gunhouse (avg)   Barbette/hoist (max)
   Main:   15.0" / 380 mm   9.84" / 250 mm      13.8" / 350 mm
   2nd:   3.94" / 100 mm   1.97" / 50 mm      2.95" / 75 mm

   - Armour deck: 5.12" / 130 mm, Conning tower: 14.96" / 380 mm

Machinery:
   Oil fired boilers, steam turbines,
   Direct drive, 4 shafts, 88,000 shp / 65,648 Kw = 25.45 kts
   Range 10,000nm at 10.00 kts
   Bunker at max displacement = 3,247 tons

Complement:
   1,666 - 2,167

Cost:
   £9.774 million / $39.097 million

Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
   Armament: 2,493 tons, 5.0 %
   Armour: 19,354 tons, 38.9 %
      - Belts: 6,466 tons, 13.0 %
      - Torpedo bulkhead: 1,571 tons, 3.2 %
      - Armament: 3,921 tons, 7.9 %
      - Armour Deck: 6,960 tons, 14.0 %
      - Conning Tower: 436 tons, 0.9 %
   Machinery: 3,077 tons, 6.2 %
   Hull, fittings & equipment: 20,575 tons, 41.3 %
   Fuel, ammunition & stores: 3,812 tons, 7.7 %
   Miscellaneous weights: 500 tons, 1.0 %

Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
   Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
     84,961 lbs / 38,538 Kg = 37.6 x 16.5 " / 420 mm shells or 15.4 torpedoes
   Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1.13
   Metacentric height 8.0 ft / 2.4 m
   Roll period: 17.4 seconds
   Steadiness   - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 70 %
         - Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0.52
   Seaboat quality  (Average = 1.00): 1.23

Hull form characteristics:
   Hull has rise forward of midbreak
   Block coefficient: 0.573
   Length to Beam Ratio: 7.50 : 1
   'Natural speed' for length: 29.65 kts
   Power going to wave formation at top speed: 39 %
   Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 57
   Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): 12.50 degrees
   Stern overhang: -4.10 ft / -1.25 m
   Freeboard (% = measuring location as a percentage of overall length):
      - Stem:      29.53 ft / 9.00 m
      - Forecastle (25 %):   24.61 ft / 7.50 m
      - Mid (66 %):      24.61 ft / 7.50 m (16.40 ft / 5.00 m aft of break)
      - Quarterdeck (20 %):   16.40 ft / 5.00 m
      - Stern:      16.40 ft / 5.00 m
      - Average freeboard:   22.31 ft / 6.80 m
   Ship tends to be wet forward

Ship space, strength and comments:
   Space   - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 73.3 %
      - Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 189.3 %
   Waterplane Area: 73,510 Square feet or 6,829 Square metres
   Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 108 %
   Structure weight / hull surface area: 213 lbs/sq ft or 1,042 Kg/sq metre
   Hull strength (Relative):
      - Cross-sectional: 1.03
      - Longitudinal: 0.99
      - Overall: 1.00
   Hull space for machinery, storage, compartmentation is excellent
   Room for accommodation and workspaces is excellent
   Ship has slow, easy roll, a good, steady gun platform
   Good seaboat, rides out heavy weather easily

250t 1912 FC
25t 1908 Sehendes Auge
25t Long Range Markoni
25t Starshells for 88mm guns and extra large searchlights
24t 12 2t 60cm torpedoes, 2 per tube
50t Flag Bridge
101t Weight Reserve

[TexanCowboy]

Would be the second biggest ship in Navalism. I'm fairly interested in the difference of design philsophy between the New Swiss and the DKB. On one end we have the Alaska design, about 10,000 tons less, and with 4 triples of a lesser caliber, like a soft kill design. On the other had we have this, heaver, bigger guns, and with 4 twins.

[The Rock Doctor]

Bad Borys!  BAD!

[Sachmle]

Would be the second biggest ship in Navalism. I'm fairly interested in the difference of design philsophy between the New Swiss and the DKB. On one end we have the Alaska design, about 10,000 tons less, and with 4 triples of a lesser caliber, like a soft kill design. On the other had we have this, heaver, bigger guns, and with 4 twins.

I like twins. Triples are OK, quads are the anti-Christ. Manly, I don't like the ABY layout, I like balanced fire. IF I use triples, there would be ABXY, so 12 guns and that's HEAVY. Now, I could go 4x3x15" but the it would weigh more, or 3223 ABXY and the weight drops, but so does the broadside weight.

[Desertfox]

The Swiss design is cheaper, faster, and would be finished earlier. It also uses 6 twins, not triples. Swiss philosophy is to soft kill the enemy before sinking them with torpedoes. Swiss battleships support the destroyers, not the other way around.

[TexanCowboy]

6 twin?!?!  :o. Why? Triples are much more efficiant, and you can get 12 guns with two less turrets.

[The Rock Doctor]

Six twins look cooler than four triples.

They do provide more redundancy,and may enjoy better rates of fire.

[TexanCowboy]

True, but since the Swiss seem to enjoy light-weight ships, and 4 triples are definatly lighter than 6 twins, you have to wonder. That is exactly why all my ships in the future will mount triples.

[Guinness]

I don't think the Swiss have a triple 14" turret.

[Desertfox]

Awesomeness > practicality... ;D The Swiss do have triple 14" turrets, but the ROF for the twin gunned ship will just own every other ship out there. Also triples are logical, can't have the Swiss be logical.

Finally, I can't have this ships unless it has twins:

[Tanthalas]

The Swiss design is cheaper, faster, and would be finished earlier. It also uses 6 twins, not triples. Swiss philosophy is to soft kill the enemy before sinking them with torpedoes. Swiss battleships support the destroyers, not the other way around.

and this Concludes your lesson on why the NS have never won a War... They get low on DDs by the end of the first year and from that point on they have insuficiant Naval power to do anything

(Nothing Personal DF but I watched what happend during the 2PW and saw what was left after it your Capital ships fared far better than your DDs)

[Desertfox]

Haven't lost a war either. In fact I have not lost a battle where my officers have fought as they where supposed to. And well, when have I fought where the odds where on my side? When you are outnumbered 4-5 to 1, doesn't matter how good your ships are.

[The Rock Doctor]

If you guys start down this conversation again, it will rain cow shit on your capitals for a week.

[Tanthalas]

If you guys start down this conversation again, it will rain cow shit on your capitals for a week.

Conversation what conversation... I have no idea what your talking about...  and Cow shit is better than Pig Shit.

[Desertfox]

Rocky, I'm doing that to myself already...