new Orange ships and projects

[The Rock Doctor]

My first question is whether you need a quadruple 16" turret for the monitor's intended role (which is...shore bombardment?  Coastal defence).

If you do need a quad 16", then I reckon the beam is far, far too narrow - the turret itself would be probably 14 to 16 metres wide, so I think a beam of at least double that would be necessary to hold it.

[Guinness]

I agree on beam. To me this ship could be much more interesting as a coast defense BB. 4 guns in a quad with adequate fire control and small size could make for a tough nut in such a setting.

[Nobody]

My first question is whether you need a quadruple 16" turret for the monitor's intended role (which is...shore bombardment?  Coastal defence).

If you do need a quad 16", then I reckon the beam is far, far too narrow - the turret itself would be probably 14 to 16 metres wide, so I think a beam of at least double that would be necessary to hold it.

I used a 16" quad because it's the only 16" turret I have.

I agree on beam. To me this ship could be much more interesting as a coast defense BB. 4 guns in a quad with adequate fire control and small size could make for a tough nut in such a setting.

Which is exactly the kind of role I had in mind and I thought such a vessel would be called monitor. (I thought about the two options the Treaty of Versailles left the German shipbuilders, a cruiser or a monitor like ship)

About the beam... the L/B ratio is already as low as 5 I didn't want to go much lower - but might indeed be a bit narrow between the turret and the handrail... I will try to remember when designing the next ship that has a chance of being build.

EDIT:
Anyway, a bit more beam makes it about a thousand tons larger with little benefit (a little more range):
Monitor 1917, Orange Coast defence Battleship laid down 1917 (Engine 1916)

Displacement:
   14.000 t light; 14.938 t standard; 16.014 t normal; 16.874 t full load

Dimensions: Length overall / water x beam x draught
   393,70 ft / 393,70 ft x 85,30 ft x 27,72 ft (normal load)
   120,00 m / 120,00 m x 26,00 m  x 8,45 m

Armament:
      4 - 16,00" / 406 mm guns (1x4 guns), 2.116,44lbs / 960,00kg shells, 1916 Model
     Breech loading guns in a turret (on a barbette)
     on centreline forward
      6 - 6,00" / 152 mm guns (3x2 guns), 105,82lbs / 48,00kg shells, 1912 Model
     Breech loading guns in turrets (on barbettes)
     on centreline ends, majority aft, 2 raised mounts - superfiring
      12 - 4,00" / 102 mm guns (6x2 guns), 30,86lbs / 14,00kg shells, 1912 Model
     Breech loading guns in deck mounts with hoists
     on side, all amidships
      8 - 1,00" / 25,4 mm guns in single mounts, 0,50lbs / 0,23kg shells, 1917 Model
     Anti-aircraft guns in deck mounts
     on side, evenly spread, all raised mounts
      4 - 0,50" / 12,7 mm guns in single mounts, 0,06lbs / 0,03kg shells, 1917 Model
     Machine guns in deck mounts
     on side, evenly spread, all raised mounts
   Weight of broadside 9.475 lbs / 4.298 kg
   Shells per gun, main battery: 115

Armour:
   - Belts:      Width (max)   Length (avg)      Height (avg)
   Main:   15,0" / 380 mm   262,47 ft / 80,00 m   10,50 ft / 3,20 m
   Ends:   5,91" / 150 mm   131,23 ft / 40,00 m   8,20 ft / 2,50 m
   Upper:   5,91" / 150 mm   262,47 ft / 80,00 m   4,92 ft / 1,50 m
     Main Belt covers 103% of normal length

   - Torpedo Bulkhead:
      1,57" / 40 mm   262,47 ft / 80,00 m   29,53 ft / 9,00 m

   - Gun armour:   Face (max)   Other gunhouse (avg)   Barbette/hoist (max)
   Main:   15,7" / 400 mm   8,66" / 220 mm      15,0" / 380 mm
   2nd:   5,91" / 150 mm   3,15" / 80 mm      5,91" / 150 mm
   3rd:   1,97" / 50 mm   1,18" / 30 mm      1,97" / 50 mm

   - Armour deck: 4,72" / 120 mm, Conning tower: 15,75" / 400 mm

Machinery:
   Oil fired boilers, steam turbines,
   Electric motors, 2 shafts, 13.691 shp / 10.214 Kw = 17,50 kts
   Range 4.500nm at 15,00 kts
   Bunker at max displacement = 1.936 tons

Complement:
   711 - 925

Cost:
   £2,782 million / $11,130 million

Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
   Armament: 1.154 tons, 7,2%
   Armour: 6.266 tons, 39,1%
      - Belts: 2.438 tons, 15,2%
      - Torpedo bulkhead: 452 tons, 2,8%
      - Armament: 1.009 tons, 6,3%
      - Armour Deck: 2.151 tons, 13,4%
      - Conning Tower: 216 tons, 1,3%
   Machinery: 510 tons, 3,2%
   Hull, fittings & equipment: 5.736 tons, 35,8%
   Fuel, ammunition & stores: 2.014 tons, 12,6%
   Miscellaneous weights: 335 tons, 2,1%
      250 t FC
       25 t "Radar"
       25 t long range radio
       35 t reserve

Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
   Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
     18.199 lbs / 8.255 Kg = 8,9 x 16,0 " / 406 mm shells or 4,1 torpedoes
   Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1,12
   Metacentric height 4,9 ft / 1,5 m
   Roll period: 16,2 seconds
   Steadiness   - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 51 %
         - Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0,36
   Seaboat quality  (Average = 1.00): 1,01

Hull form characteristics:
   Hull has a flush deck
   Block coefficient: 0,602
   Length to Beam Ratio: 4,62 : 1
   'Natural speed' for length: 19,84 kts
   Power going to wave formation at top speed: 49 %
   Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 50
   Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): 0,00 degrees
   Stern overhang: 0,00 ft / 0,00 m
   Freeboard (% = measuring location as a percentage of overall length):
      - Stem:      17,06 ft / 5,20 m
      - Forecastle (20%):   11,81 ft / 3,60 m
      - Mid (52%):      9,84 ft / 3,00 m
      - Quarterdeck (15%):   9,84 ft / 3,00 m
      - Stern:      11,48 ft / 3,50 m
      - Average freeboard:   11,09 ft / 3,38 m
   Ship tends to be wet forward

Ship space, strength and comments:
   Space   - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 88,4%
      - Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 68,1%
   Waterplane Area: 24.608 Square feet or 2.286 Square metres
   Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 95%
   Structure weight / hull surface area: 178 lbs/sq ft or 870 Kg/sq metre
   Hull strength (Relative):
      - Cross-sectional: 0,91
      - Longitudinal: 2,28
      - Overall: 1,00
   Hull space for machinery, storage, compartmentation is adequate
   Room for accommodation and workspaces is cramped


Way smaller, more like the monitor Rock had in mind:
Monitor 1917, Orange floating turret laid down 1917 (Engine 1916)

Displacement:
   8.300 t light; 8.977 t standard; 9.413 t normal; 9.763 t full load

Dimensions: Length overall / water x beam x draught
   229,66 ft / 229,66 ft x 91,86 ft x 22,97 ft (normal load)
   70,00 m / 70,00 m x 28,00 m  x 7,00 m

Armament:
      4 - 16,00" / 406 mm guns (1x4 guns), 2.116,44lbs / 960,00kg shells, 1916 Model
     Breech loading guns in a turret (on a barbette)
     on centreline forward
      4 - 4,02" / 102 mm guns (2x2 guns), 32,38lbs / 14,69kg shells, 1912 Model
     Quick firing guns in deck mounts with hoists
     on centreline, all aft, 1 raised mount - superfiring
      4 - 4,02" / 102 mm guns (2x2 guns), 32,38lbs / 14,69kg shells, 1912 Model
     Quick firing guns in deck mounts with hoists
     on side, all amidships
      4 - 1,00" / 25,4 mm guns in single mounts, 0,50lbs / 0,23kg shells, 1917 Model
     Anti-aircraft guns in deck mounts
     on side, all amidships, all raised mounts - superfiring
      2 - 0,50" / 12,7 mm guns in single mounts, 0,06lbs / 0,03kg shells, 1917 Model
     Machine guns in deck mounts
     on side, all forward, all raised mounts - superfiring
   Weight of broadside 8.727 lbs / 3.958 kg
   Shells per gun, main battery: 100

Armour:
   - Belts:      Width (max)   Length (avg)      Height (avg)
   Main:   8,66" / 220 mm   180,45 ft / 55,00 m   14,76 ft / 4,50 m
   Ends:   6,69" / 170 mm     49,21 ft / 15,00 m   9,84 ft / 3,00 m
     Main Belt covers 121% of normal length

   - Gun armour:   Face (max)   Other gunhouse (avg)   Barbette/hoist (max)
   Main:   9,84" / 250 mm   5,91" / 150 mm      8,66" / 220 mm
   2nd:   1,18" / 30 mm   0,39" / 10 mm      0,79" / 20 mm
   3rd:   1,18" / 30 mm   0,39" / 10 mm      0,79" / 20 mm
   4th:   0,39" / 10 mm         -               -

   - Armour deck: 4,33" / 110 mm, Conning tower: 9,84" / 250 mm

Machinery:
   Coal and oil fired boilers, steam turbines,
   Electric motors, 2 shafts, 3.579 shp / 2.670 Kw = 12,50 kts
   Range 2.620nm at 12,00 kts
   Bunker at max displacement = 786 tons (90% coal)

Complement:
   477 - 621

Cost:
   £2,179 million / $8,716 million

Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
   Armament: 1.057 tons, 11,2%
   Armour: 3.050 tons, 32,4%
      - Belts: 1.149 tons, 12,2%
      - Torpedo bulkhead: 0 tons, 0,0%
      - Armament: 475 tons, 5,0%
      - Armour Deck: 1.331 tons, 14,1%
      - Conning Tower: 95 tons, 1,0%
   Machinery: 145 tons, 1,5%
   Hull, fittings & equipment: 3.848 tons, 40,9%
   Fuel, ammunition & stores: 1.114 tons, 11,8%
   Miscellaneous weights: 200 tons, 2,1%
      100 t FC
      100 t reserve

Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
   Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
     8.582 lbs / 3.893 Kg = 4,2 x 16,0 " / 406 mm shells or 1,9 torpedoes
   Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1,24
   Metacentric height 6,5 ft / 2,0 m
   Roll period: 15,2 seconds
   Steadiness   - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 53 %
         - Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0,28
   Seaboat quality  (Average = 1.00): 1,05

Hull form characteristics:
   Hull has a flush deck
   Block coefficient: 0,680
   Length to Beam Ratio: 2,50 : 1
   'Natural speed' for length: 15,15 kts
   Power going to wave formation at top speed: 55 %
   Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 50
   Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): 0,00 degrees
   Stern overhang: 0,00 ft / 0,00 m
   Freeboard (% = measuring location as a percentage of overall length):
      - Stem:      13,12 ft / 4,00 m
      - Forecastle (20%):   10,50 ft / 3,20 m
      - Mid (50%):      9,84 ft / 3,00 m
      - Quarterdeck (15%):   9,84 ft / 3,00 m
      - Stern:      10,50 ft / 3,20 m
      - Average freeboard:   10,33 ft / 3,15 m
   Ship tends to be wet forward

Ship space, strength and comments:
   Space   - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 91,3%
      - Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 66,3%
   Waterplane Area: 16.609 Square feet or 1.543 Square metres
   Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 78%
   Structure weight / hull surface area: 193 lbs/sq ft or 942 Kg/sq metre
   Hull strength (Relative):
      - Cross-sectional: 0,82
      - Longitudinal: 5,47
      - Overall: 1,00
   Hull space for machinery, storage, compartmentation is adequate
   Room for accommodation and workspaces is cramped

[Borys]

Ahoj!
I understand that you only have a quad. Personally I would not have used it, but waited a year and developed a twin.
Borys

[Nobody]

A new design study, I thought about something small (new coast guard cutters for instance)

First I came up with this little ship (it was the 3rd try actually):
200t patrol vessel 1918a, Orange Kutter laid down 1918

Displacement:
   200 t light; 209 t standard; 259 t normal; 299 t full load

Dimensions: Length overall / water x beam x draught
   139,44 ft / 137,80 ft x 19,69 ft x 6,23 ft (normal load)
   42,50 m / 42,00 m x 6,00 m  x 1,90 m

Armament:
      2 - 3,00" / 76,2 mm guns in single mounts, 13,50lbs / 6,12kg shells, 1914 Model
     Breech loading guns in deck mounts
     on centreline ends, evenly spread
      3 - 1,00" / 25,4 mm guns in single mounts, 0,50lbs / 0,23kg shells, 1918 Model
     Anti-aircraft guns in deck mounts
     on centreline, evenly spread, 2 raised mounts
      2 - 0,31" / 8,0 mm guns in single mounts, 0,02lbs / 0,01kg shells, 1918 Model
     Machine guns in deck mounts
     on side, all forward, all raised mounts - superfiring
   Weight of broadside 29 lbs / 13 kg
   Shells per gun, main battery: 250

Armour:
   - Gun armour:   Face (max)   Other gunhouse (avg)   Barbette/hoist (max)
   Main:   0,59" / 15 mm   0,39" / 10 mm            -
   2nd:   0,39" / 10 mm         -               -

   - Conning tower: 0,79" / 20 mm

Machinery:
   Coal and oil fired boilers, complex reciprocating steam engines,
   Direct drive, 1 shaft, 922 ihp / 688 Kw = 15,50 kts
   Range 4.200nm at 10,00 kts
   Bunker at max displacement = 90 tons (90% coal)

Complement:
   31 - 41

Cost:
   £0,037 million / $0,146 million

Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
   Armament: 4 tons, 1,4%
   Armour: 3 tons, 1,1%
      - Belts: 0 tons, 0,0%
      - Torpedo bulkhead: 0 tons, 0,0%
      - Armament: 2 tons, 0,8%
      - Armour Deck: 0 tons, 0,0%
      - Conning Tower: 1 tons, 0,3%
   Machinery: 59 tons, 22,9%
   Hull, fittings & equipment: 94 tons, 36,4%
   Fuel, ammunition & stores: 59 tons, 22,9%
   Miscellaneous weights: 40 tons, 15,4%

Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
   Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
     362 lbs / 164 Kg = 26,8 x 3,0 " / 76 mm shells or 0,3 torpedoes
   Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1,22
   Metacentric height 0,6 ft / 0,2 m
   Roll period: 10,5 seconds
   Steadiness   - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 70 %
         - Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0,15
   Seaboat quality  (Average = 1.00): 2,00

Hull form characteristics:
   Hull has raised forecastle
   Block coefficient: 0,536
   Length to Beam Ratio: 7,00 : 1
   'Natural speed' for length: 11,74 kts
   Power going to wave formation at top speed: 60 %
   Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 35
   Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): 0,00 degrees
   Stern overhang: 1,64 ft / 0,50 m
   Freeboard (% = measuring location as a percentage of overall length):
      - Stem:      13,12 ft / 4,00 m
      - Forecastle (20%):   11,81 ft / 3,60 m (9,19 ft / 2,80 m aft of break)
      - Mid (50%):      8,20 ft / 2,50 m
      - Quarterdeck (15%):   8,20 ft / 2,50 m
      - Stern:      9,84 ft / 3,00 m
      - Average freeboard:   9,30 ft / 2,83 m

Ship space, strength and comments:
   Space   - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 102,7%
      - Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 93,6%
   Waterplane Area: 1.808 Square feet or 168 Square metres
   Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 136%
   Structure weight / hull surface area: 25 lbs/sq ft or 123 Kg/sq metre
   Hull strength (Relative):
      - Cross-sectional: 0,81
      - Longitudinal: 6,13
      - Overall: 1,00
   Hull space for machinery, storage, compartmentation is adequate
   Room for accommodation and workspaces is adequate
   Ship has slow, easy roll, a good, steady gun platform
   Excellent seaboat, comfortable, can fire her guns in the heaviest weather

Which trim would you prefer?
a) 35 (as shown): stability 1.22, steadiness 70, seakeeping 2.00
b) 50 (standard): stability 1.11, steadiness 100, seakeeping 2.00

After rereading the 200t vessel rule I modified it a bit
200t patrol vessel 1918b, Orange Kutter laid down 1918

Displacement:
   200 t light; 206 t standard; 253 t normal; 290 t full load

Dimensions: Length overall / water x beam x draught
   139,44 ft / 137,80 ft x 19,69 ft x 6,27 ft (normal load)
   42,50 m / 42,00 m x 6,00 m  x 1,91 m

Armament:
      3 - 1,00" / 25,4 mm guns in single mounts, 0,50lbs / 0,23kg shells, 1918 Model
     Anti-aircraft guns in deck mounts
     on centreline, evenly spread, 1 raised mount
     Aft Main mounts separated by engine room
      4 - 0,50" / 12,7 mm guns in single mounts, 0,06lbs / 0,03kg shells, 1918 Model
     Machine guns in deck mounts
     on side, all amidships, all raised mounts - superfiring
   Weight of broadside 2 lbs / 1 kg
   Shells per gun, main battery: 500

Armour:
   - Gun armour:   Face (max)   Other gunhouse (avg)   Barbette/hoist (max)
   Main:   0,59" / 15 mm         -               -
   2nd:   0,39" / 10 mm         -               -

   - Conning tower: 0,79" / 20 mm

Machinery:
   Coal and oil fired boilers, complex reciprocating steam engines,
   Direct drive, 1 shaft, 900 ihp / 672 Kw = 15,50 kts
   Range 4.000nm at 10,00 kts
   Bunker at max displacement = 84 tons (90% coal)

Complement:
   31 - 41

Cost:
   £0,031 million / $0,122 million

Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
   Armament: 0 tons, 0,1%
   Armour: 1 tons, 0,4%
      - Belts: 0 tons, 0,0%
      - Torpedo bulkhead: 0 tons, 0,0%
      - Armament: 0 tons, 0,2%
      - Armour Deck: 0 tons, 0,0%
      - Conning Tower: 1 tons, 0,3%
   Machinery: 58 tons, 22,9%
   Hull, fittings & equipment: 86 tons, 34,1%
   Fuel, ammunition & stores: 52 tons, 20,7%
   Miscellaneous weights: 55 tons, 21,8%

Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
   Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
     354 lbs / 161 Kg = 708,2 x 1,0 " / 25 mm shells or 0,4 torpedoes
   Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1,15
   Metacentric height 0,6 ft / 0,2 m
   Roll period: 11,0 seconds
   Steadiness   - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 72 %
         - Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0,01
   Seaboat quality  (Average = 1.00): 1,90

Hull form characteristics:
   Hull has raised forecastle
   Block coefficient: 0,520
   Length to Beam Ratio: 7,00 : 1
   'Natural speed' for length: 11,74 kts
   Power going to wave formation at top speed: 59 %
   Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 38
   Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): 0,00 degrees
   Stern overhang: 1,64 ft / 0,50 m
   Freeboard (% = measuring location as a percentage of overall length):
      - Stem:      13,12 ft / 4,00 m
      - Forecastle (20%):   11,48 ft / 3,50 m (8,53 ft / 2,60 m aft of break)
      - Mid (50%):      7,87 ft / 2,40 m
      - Quarterdeck (15%):   7,87 ft / 2,40 m
      - Stern:      8,53 ft / 2,60 m
      - Average freeboard:   8,87 ft / 2,71 m

Ship space, strength and comments:
   Space   - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 99,3%
      - Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 87,6%
   Waterplane Area: 1.776 Square feet or 165 Square metres
   Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 145%
   Structure weight / hull surface area: 24 lbs/sq ft or 118 Kg/sq metre
   Hull strength (Relative):
      - Cross-sectional: 0,83
      - Longitudinal: 5,08
      - Overall: 1,00
   Hull space for machinery, storage, compartmentation is adequate
   Room for accommodation and workspaces is cramped
   Ship has slow, easy roll, a good, steady gun platform
   Excellent seaboat, comfortable, can fire her guns in the heaviest weather

[TexanCowboy]

No main guns? That ship can stop 20 or so airplanes, but it can't stop a 50 ton tramp freighter.

[Nobody]

Well I thought the 1 inch gun would be sufficient (modern coast guard vessel have hardly more). It's supposed to be the same 1 inch gun widely used on all recent Orange designs. Just because it's an (semi?) (automatic?) anti-air gun doesn't mean you can't use it to shoot effectively at ships.

[TexanCowboy]

I don't think we have dual purpose yet, that's a 1923 tech.

[Sachmle]

It's a machine gun. The mount pretty much consists of a stand that the gun sets on w/ a ball bearing cup to make moving it somewhat easier. I'm sure you can pretty much aim at whatever you want. Now if it was a quad or something w/ a real mount that may be different.

Also, most MODERN Coast Guard Cutters have at least 1 REAL gun..usually 75mm/3"

[Nobody]

most MODERN Coast Guard Cutters have at least 1 REAL gun..usually 75mm/3"

Not necessarily, especially not at 200 tons.

Anyway found a BIG mistake in the design (wrong engine year) so back to the drawing board.

200t patrol vessel 1918d, Orange Kutter laid down 1918 (Engine 1916)

Displacement:
   200 t light; 208 t standard; 253 t normal; 288 t full load

Dimensions: Length overall / water x beam x draught
   139,44 ft / 137,80 ft x 19,69 ft x 6,27 ft (normal load)
   42,50 m / 42,00 m x 6,00 m  x 1,91 m

Armament:
     1 - 3,00" / 76,2 mm guns in single mounts, 13,50lbs / 6,12kg shells, 1914 Model
     Quick firing gun in deck mount
     on centreline forward
     1 - 1,00" / 25,4 mm guns in single mounts, 0,50lbs / 0,23kg shells, 1918 Model
     Anti-aircraft gun in deck mount
     on centreline aft
     2 - 0,50" / 12,7 mm guns in single mounts, 0,06lbs / 0,03kg shells, 1918 Model
     Machine guns in deck mounts
     on centreline ends, evenly spread, all raised mounts
   Weight of broadside 14 lbs / 6 kg
   Shells per gun, main battery: 400

Armour:
  - Gun armour:   Face (max)   Other gunhouse (avg)   Barbette/hoist (max)
   Main:   0,59" / 15 mm         -               -
   2nd:   0,39" / 10 mm         -               -
   3rd:   0,31" / 8 mm         -               -

  - Conning tower: 0,79" / 20 mm

Machinery:
   Coal and oil fired boilers, complex reciprocating steam engines,
   Direct drive, 1 shaft, 900 ihp / 672 Kw = 15,50 kts
   Range 3.250nm at 10,50 kts
   Bunker at max displacement = 80 tons (90% coal)

Complement:
   31 - 41

Cost:
   £0,033 million / $0,133 million

Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
   Armament: 2 tons, 0,7%
   Armour: 2 tons, 0,7%
      - Belts: 0 tons, 0,0%
      - Torpedo bulkhead: 0 tons, 0,0%
      - Armament: 1 tons, 0,4%
      - Armour Deck: 0 tons, 0,0%
      - Conning Tower: 1 tons, 0,3%
   Machinery: 58 tons, 23,1%
   Hull, fittings & equipment: 83 tons, 32,9%
   Fuel, ammunition & stores: 53 tons, 20,8%
   Miscellaneous weights: 55 tons, 21,8%
      3 variants (55 t misc)
      a) Leader: 25 t long-range-Radio, 25 t hydrophones(not yet availble), 5 t command facilities
      b) Patrol boat: 10 t short-range-Radio, 25 t hydrophones(not yet availble), 5 t  two depth-charge throwers and hoists, 15 t depth-charges (30?) and two rails
      c) Minesweeper: 25 t long-range-Radio, 20 t mine-sweeping gear, 10 t crew comfort
      d) Minelayer: 25 t long-range-radio, 30 t mines (30)

Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
   Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
     300 lbs / 136 Kg = 22,3 x 3,0 " / 76 mm shells or 0,3 torpedoes
   Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1,14
   Metacentric height 0,6 ft / 0,2 m
   Roll period: 11,0 seconds
   Steadiness   - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 70 %
         - Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0,07
   Seaboat quality  (Average = 1.00): 1,67

Hull form characteristics:
   Hull has raised forecastle
   Block coefficient: 0,520
   Length to Beam Ratio: 7,00 : 1
   'Natural speed' for length: 11,74 kts
   Power going to wave formation at top speed: 59 %
   Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 42
   Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): 0,00 degrees
   Stern overhang: 1,64 ft / 0,50 m
   Freeboard (% = measuring location as a percentage of overall length):
      - Stem:      13,12 ft / 4,00 m
      - Forecastle (20%):   11,15 ft / 3,40 m (7,55 ft / 2,30 m aft of break)
      - Mid (50%):      7,22 ft / 2,20 m
      - Quarterdeck (15%):   7,22 ft / 2,20 m
      - Stern:      8,20 ft / 2,50 m
      - Average freeboard:   8,29 ft / 2,53 m

Ship space, strength and comments:
   Space   - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 105,1%
      - Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 79,6%
   Waterplane Area: 1.776 Square feet or 165 Square metres
   Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 135%
   Structure weight / hull surface area: 25 lbs/sq ft or 121 Kg/sq metre
   Hull strength (Relative):
      - Cross-sectional: 0,85
      - Longitudinal: 4,13
      - Overall: 1,00
   Hull space for machinery, storage, compartmentation is adequate
   Room for accommodation and workspaces is cramped
   Ship has slow, easy roll, a good, steady gun platform
   Excellent seaboat, comfortable, can fire her guns in the heaviest weather


Better now? May I build those to the 200 t rule (mercantile, no slip)?

[Borys]

Ahoj!
I believe that the VTE engines are not limited by year.
Or is the limit on shafts, not years? I'm confused ...
Borys

[Guinness]

Nobody: Armor and Armament equals less than 2% normal displacement, so you can build these to mercantile standards. And since they are under 201t light displacement, they can be built without dedicated military infrastructure. You may build one ship like this in a given region for every 0.5BP that region has, and the ship still costs the same in $ and BP as it would if built in a regular yard.

Borys: VTE == no IHP limit, yes. This is because, among other reasons, up near the SHP limits turbines are always quite a bit lighter than VTE.

[Borys]

OK - so, like Nobody noticed, I have to correct my minesweepers.
Borys

[Sachmle]

Hell, he can build 43/HY as long as there's $$/BP for them w/o using a dock.

[Nobody]

Nobody: Armor and Armament equals less than 2% normal displacement, so you can build these to mercantile standards. And since they are under 201t light displacement, they can be built without dedicated military infrastructure.

Thanks Guinness, I take that as moderator approval. I just wanted to ask, so that no one can say, I can't do that afterwards.