Orange mini Battleship design competition

[Nobody]

To utilize their new 16"/40 quadruple turret design the new Orange administration is seeking additional opinions on how do design the smallest practically possible platform to hold 2 such turrets. The ship has to be decently armored against known adversaries though and while speed and range is not a priority, the new ships should not be step back compared to the existing Orange battlefleet.

Design guidelines

• a small Battleship to hold two 16" quads, 960 kg shell weight, 120 to 150 shells per gun
  
• if possible it should fit into a type 2 Dock/Slip (170 m)
  
• a full fledged anti-BB-armor, "All or Nothing" concept is available
  
• 1916 Engine year, electric drive, not much less than 23 knots (more is preferred of course)
  
• give range at 15 knots for comparision
  
• anti-torpedo-boat-battery may consist of 6" or 5" guns in twin or single turrets or casemate arrangement, 48 and 28 kg shell weight
  
  Ok, I hope I didn't forget something important.
  Waiting for your suggestions - I'm curious :)
  
  Edit:
  added shell weight and shells per gun

[Blooded]

Two quad 16" is going to be a tub. At one point it was suggested we try to use max widths for docks and a size 2 had a 93' max(I have been using this, though I dont believe it was official) .

I have used size 0=230'/38'; 1=393'/66'; 2=557'/93'; 3=721'/120'. if using metric you get a hair more in size. The idea was to limit max widths to 6:1 so that infrastructure had to be invested in( as the British had to do around the turn of the century).

I see it as a good idea.

[The Rock Doctor]

Does Orange have specific requirements for:

-Seakeeping/Steadiness/Stability

-Miscellaneous weight (Fire Control, etc)

[maddox]

The secundaries in turret/barbette setup, and how many? 

[Nobody]

The idea was to limit max widths to 6:1 so that infrastructure had to be invested in( as the British had to do around the turn of the century).

I haven't heard of such a limit so far. And since real world Battleships like the Nassau-class had a L:B-ratio of only 5.4:1 and most (at least German ships) were (slightly) below 6:1, i would place it (if necessary) at 5:1 (and 4:1 for size-0). But that is not the point here, isn't it?
Up to 31 meters beam should be ok I think.

Does Orange have specific requirements for:

-Seakeeping/Steadiness/Stability

-Miscellaneous weight (Fire Control, etc)

Good question. All values should be "ok" meaning
seekeeping and stability >1
steadiness around 50, at least >30

Miscellaneous weight... I was hoping to learn here what I need ;D
Anyway a ship without fire control is pointless, isn't it? So FC, Radar (maybe 2 because they are unreliable) and long range radio are considered a "must have" by the new administration. And a small building reserve for future grow (more AA and a floatplane) should not be forgotten. Torpedos are considered too dangerous for such a cramped craft though.

Is that enough now?

btw is the a way to get rid of that "DevComponents unregistered component" popup whenever I start springsharp? (without buying it of course) I can't remember having seen it last time I used Springsharp.

P.S.:

The secundaries in turret/barbette setup, and how many?

Thats up to you, anything between 5 and 8 guns per side would be plausible. Maybe superfiring secondaries behind/above the main turrets?

[Korpen]

Quick throw-together

Enter ship name, Orange Enter ship type laid down 1916

Displacement:
   24 600 t light; 26 376 t standard; 28 500 t normal; 30 199 t full load

Dimensions: Length overall / water x beam x draught
   557,74 ft / 557,74 ft x 98,43 ft x 29,53 ft (normal load)
   170,00 m / 170,00 m x 30,00 m  x 9,00 m

Armament:
     8 - 15,98" / 406 mm guns (2x4 guns), 2 041,96lbs / 926,22kg shells, 1916 Model
     Breech loading guns in turrets (on barbettes)
     on centreline ends, evenly spread
     6 - 5,98" / 152 mm guns in single mounts, 107,15lbs / 48,60kg shells, 1916 Model
     Breech loading guns in casemate mounts
     on side, all aft
     8 - 5,98" / 152 mm guns in single mounts, 107,15lbs / 48,60kg shells, 1916 Model
     Breech loading guns in deck mounts with hoists
     on side, all forward
   Weight of broadside 17 836 lbs / 8 090 kg
   Shells per gun, main battery: 120

Armour:
  - Belts:      Width (max)   Length (avg)      Height (avg)
   Main:   12,6" / 320 mm   377,30 ft / 115,00 m   16,40 ft / 5,00 m
   Ends:   Unarmoured
     Main Belt covers 104 % of normal length

  - Torpedo Bulkhead:
      1,57" / 40 mm   377,30 ft / 115,00 m   29,53 ft / 9,00 m

  - Gun armour:   Face (max)   Other gunhouse (avg)   Barbette/hoist (max)
   Main:   13,8" / 350 mm   7,09" / 180 mm      12,6" / 320 mm
   2nd:   3,94" / 100 mm   3,94" / 100 mm            -
   3rd:   3,54" / 90 mm   0,98" / 25 mm      2,76" / 70 mm

  - Armour deck: 3,74" / 95 mm, Conning tower: 13,78" / 350 mm

Machinery:
   Oil fired boilers, steam turbines,
   Geared drive, 4 shafts, 50 000 shp / 37 300 Kw = 23,01 kts
   Range 6 680nm at 15,00 kts
   Bunker at max displacement = 3 823 tons

Complement:
   1 096 - 1 425

Cost:
   £4,900 million / $19,601 million

Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
   Armament: 2 229 tons, 7,8 %
   Armour: 9 014 tons, 31,6 %
      - Belts: 3 430 tons, 12,0 %
      - Torpedo bulkhead: 649 tons, 2,3 %
      - Armament: 1 840 tons, 6,5 %
      - Armour Deck: 2 818 tons, 9,9 %
      - Conning Tower: 277 tons, 1,0 %
   Machinery: 1 863 tons, 6,5 %
   Hull, fittings & equipment: 11 144 tons, 39,1 %
   Fuel, ammunition & stores: 3 900 tons, 13,7 %
   Miscellaneous weights: 350 tons, 1,2 %

Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
   Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
     33 193 lbs / 15 056 Kg = 16,3 x 16,0 " / 406 mm shells or 5,1 torpedoes
   Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1,18
   Metacentric height 6,6 ft / 2,0 m
   Roll period: 16,0 seconds
   Steadiness   - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 58 %
         - Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0,63
   Seaboat quality  (Average = 1.00): 1,20

Hull form characteristics:
   Hull has rise forward of midbreak
   Block coefficient: 0,615
   Length to Beam Ratio: 5,67 : 1
   'Natural speed' for length: 23,62 kts
   Power going to wave formation at top speed: 52 %
   Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 48
   Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): 0,00 degrees
   Stern overhang: 0,00 ft / 0,00 m
   Freeboard (% = measuring location as a percentage of overall length):
      - Stem:      26,25 ft / 8,00 m
      - Forecastle (20 %):   21,33 ft / 6,50 m
      - Mid (65 %):      21,33 ft / 6,50 m (13,12 ft / 4,00 m aft of break)
      - Quarterdeck (15 %):   13,12 ft / 4,00 m
      - Stern:      13,12 ft / 4,00 m
      - Average freeboard:   18,85 ft / 5,75 m

Ship space, strength and comments:
   Space   - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 103,0 %
      - Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 133,1 %
   Waterplane Area: 40 730 Square feet or 3 784 Square metres
   Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 92 %
   Structure weight / hull surface area: 202 lbs/sq ft or 987 Kg/sq metre
   Hull strength (Relative):
      - Cross-sectional: 0,92
      - Longitudinal: 1,95
      - Overall: 1,00
   Hull space for machinery, storage, compartmentation is adequate
   Room for accommodation and workspaces is excellent
   Good seaboat, rides out heavy weather easily

[Blooded]

It was an old conversation, the 6:1 limit was put down quickly. Personally, I am fine with down to 5:1 for most bulkier types.

It would appear the beam limit for docks was not put into effect. Perhaps, something to consider anyway.

Best of luck, I am sure you will see many nice ships appear here.

[ledeper]

Another throw together:
Enter ship name, Enter country Enter ship type laid down 1917 (Engine 1916)

Displacement:
   24.000 t light; 25.632 t standard; 27.600 t normal; 29.174 t full load

Dimensions: Length overall / water x beam x draught
   556,29 ft / 552,82 ft x 98,43 ft x 30,35 ft (normal load)
   169,56 m / 168,50 m x 30,00 m  x 9,25 m

Armament:
      8 - 15,94" / 405 mm guns (2x4 guns), 2.026,91lbs / 919,39kg shells, 1917 Model
     Breech loading guns in turrets (on barbettes)
     on centreline ends, evenly spread
      12 - 5,91" / 150 mm guns in single mounts, 102,98lbs / 46,71kg shells, 1917 Model
     Quick firing guns in deck mounts with hoists
     on side, all amidships
      4 - 1,57" / 40,0 mm guns in single mounts, 1,95lbs / 0,89kg shells, 1917 Model
     Anti-aircraft guns in deck mounts
     on centreline, all amidships, all raised mounts - superfiring
   Weight of broadside 17.459 lbs / 7.919 kg
   Shells per gun, main battery: 110

Armour:
   - Belts:      Width (max)   Length (avg)      Height (avg)
   Main:   13,8" / 350 mm   381,82 ft / 116,38 m   11,91 ft / 3,63 m
   Ends:   Unarmoured
   Upper:   4,92" / 125 mm   414,63 ft / 126,38 m   8,01 ft / 2,44 m
     Main Belt covers 106 % of normal length
     Main belt does not fully cover magazines and engineering spaces

   - Torpedo Bulkhead:
      1,18" / 30 mm   414,63 ft / 126,38 m   28,61 ft / 8,72 m

   - Gun armour:   Face (max)   Other gunhouse (avg)   Barbette/hoist (max)
   Main:   13,8" / 350 mm   7,87" / 200 mm      11,8" / 300 mm
   2nd:   0,39" / 10 mm         -               -
   3rd:   0,20" / 5 mm         -               -

   - Armour deck: 3,94" / 100 mm, Conning tower: 11,81" / 300 mm

Machinery:
   Oil fired boilers, steam turbines,
   Electric cruising motors plus geared drives, 4 shafts, 52.749 shp / 39.351 Kw = 23,50 kts
   Range 7.500nm at 14,00 kts
   Bunker at max displacement = 3.542 tons

Complement:
   1.069 - 1.391

Cost:
   £5,361 million / $21,442 million

Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
   Armament: 2.182 tons, 7,9 %
   Armour: 8.676 tons, 31,4 %
      - Belts: 3.438 tons, 12,5 %
      - Torpedo bulkhead: 518 tons, 1,9 %
      - Armament: 1.630 tons, 5,9 %
      - Armour Deck: 2.858 tons, 10,4 %
      - Conning Tower: 232 tons, 0,8 %
   Machinery: 1.965 tons, 7,1 %
   Hull, fittings & equipment: 10.676 tons, 38,7 %
   Fuel, ammunition & stores: 3.600 tons, 13,0 %
   Miscellaneous weights: 500 tons, 1,8 %

Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
   Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
     29.106 lbs / 13.202 Kg = 14,4 x 15,9 " / 405 mm shells or 4,6 torpedoes
   Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1,15
   Metacentric height 6,4 ft / 1,9 m
   Roll period: 16,4 seconds
   Steadiness   - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 51 %
         - Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0,55
   Seaboat quality  (Average = 1.00): 1,03

Hull form characteristics:
   Hull has a flush deck
   Block coefficient: 0,585
   Length to Beam Ratio: 5,62 : 1
   'Natural speed' for length: 23,51 kts
   Power going to wave formation at top speed: 53 %
   Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 50
   Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): 10,00 degrees
   Stern overhang: 0,00 ft / 0,00 m
   Freeboard (% = measuring location as a percentage of overall length):
      - Stem:      19,69 ft / 6,00 m
      - Forecastle (10 %):   16,47 ft / 5,02 m
      - Mid (70 %):      16,47 ft / 5,02 m
      - Quarterdeck (15 %):   16,47 ft / 5,02 m
      - Stern:      16,47 ft / 5,02 m
      - Average freeboard:   16,60 ft / 5,06 m
   Ship tends to be wet forward

Ship space, strength and comments:
   Space   - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 106,4 %
      - Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 115,2 %
   Waterplane Area: 39.241 Square feet or 3.646 Square metres
   Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 90 %
   Structure weight / hull surface area: 203 lbs/sq ft or 990 Kg/sq metre
   Hull strength (Relative):
      - Cross-sectional: 0,93
      - Longitudinal: 1,83
      - Overall: 1,00
   Hull space for machinery, storage, compartmentation is adequate
   Room for accommodation and workspaces is adequate

[maddox]

There isn't a restriction on the L/B ratio, but too far below 6 will be frowned upon by any ship designer of repute.

I opted for the French 140mm/5.5" secundaries, but those can be exchanged for the 165mm/6.5" guns in exchange for armor.
She's also a tad bigger  than the other desings, but with her 24 kts and a range of 7000@ 15 kts  Nm it's a fair trade off.

La Belle, Republique Orange Battleship laid down 1917 (Engine 1916)

Displacement:
   26.999 t light; 29.248 t standard; 31.628 t normal; 33.532 t full load

Dimensions: Length overall / water x beam x draught
   557,74 ft / 554,46 ft x 104,99 ft x 30,51 ft (normal load)
   170,00 m / 169,00 m x 32,00 m  x 9,30 m

Armament:
      8 - 16,00" / 406 mm guns (2x4 guns), 2.204,62lbs / 1.000,00kg shells, 1917 Model
     Breech loading guns in turrets (on barbettes)
     on centreline ends, evenly spread
      4 - 5,51" / 140 mm guns (2x2 guns), 92,59lbs / 42,00kg shells, 1917 Model
     Quick firing guns in deck mounts with hoists
     on centreline ends, evenly spread, all raised mounts
      12 - 5,51" / 140 mm guns (6x2 guns), 92,59lbs / 42,00kg shells, 1917 Model
     Quick firing guns in deck mounts with hoists
     on side, evenly spread, 2 raised mounts
      4 - 1,46" / 37,0 mm guns in single mounts, 1,55lbs / 0,70kg shells, 1917 Model
     Anti-aircraft guns in deck mounts
     on centreline, evenly spread, all raised mounts
   Weight of broadside 19.125 lbs / 8.675 kg
   Shells per gun, main battery: 150

Armour:
   - Belts:      Width (max)   Length (avg)      Height (avg)
   Main:   13,0" / 330 mm   360,40 ft / 109,85 m   14,50 ft / 4,42 m
   Ends:   Unarmoured
     Main Belt covers 100% of normal length

   - Torpedo Bulkhead:
      2,00" / 51 mm   360,40 ft / 109,85 m   29,04 ft / 8,85 m

   - Gun armour:   Face (max)   Other gunhouse (avg)   Barbette/hoist (max)
   Main:   14,0" / 356 mm   12,0" / 305 mm      14,0" / 356 mm
   2nd:   2,00" / 51 mm   1,00" / 25 mm      3,00" / 76 mm
   3rd:   2,00" / 51 mm   1,00" / 25 mm      3,00" / 76 mm
   4th:   0,50" / 13 mm         -               -

   - Armour deck: 3,75" / 95 mm, Conning tower: 15,00" / 381 mm

Machinery:
   Oil fired boilers, steam turbines,
   Electric motors, 4 shafts, 64.078 shp / 47.802 Kw = 24,00 kts
   Range 7.000nm at 15,00 kts
   Bunker at max displacement = 4.285 tons

Complement:
   1.185 - 1.541

Cost:
   £5,711 million / $22,842 million

Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
   Armament: 2.216 tons, 7,0%
   Armour: 9.469 tons, 29,9%
      - Belts: 3.046 tons, 9,6%
      - Torpedo bulkhead: 774 tons, 2,4%
      - Armament: 2.307 tons, 7,3%
      - Armour Deck: 3.018 tons, 9,5%
      - Conning Tower: 323 tons, 1,0%
   Machinery: 2.387 tons, 7,5%
   Hull, fittings & equipment: 12.476 tons, 39,4%
   Fuel, ammunition & stores: 4.629 tons, 14,6%
   Miscellaneous weights: 450 tons, 1,4%

Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
   Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
     36.327 lbs / 16.478 Kg = 17,7 x 16,0 " / 406 mm shells or 5,9 torpedoes
   Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1,10
   Metacentric height 6,4 ft / 2,0 m
   Roll period: 17,4 seconds
   Steadiness   - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 65 %
         - Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0,66
   Seaboat quality  (Average = 1.00): 1,10

Hull form characteristics:
   Hull has a flush deck
   Block coefficient: 0,623
   Length to Beam Ratio: 5,28 : 1
   'Natural speed' for length: 23,55 kts
   Power going to wave formation at top speed: 56 %
   Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 59
   Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): -5,00 degrees
   Stern overhang: 3,28 ft / 1,00 m
   Freeboard (% = measuring location as a percentage of overall length):
      - Stem:      29,53 ft / 9,00 m
      - Forecastle (18%):   19,69 ft / 6,00 m
      - Mid (50%):      19,69 ft / 6,00 m
      - Quarterdeck (17%):   19,69 ft / 6,00 m
      - Stern:      19,69 ft / 6,00 m
      - Average freeboard:   20,39 ft / 6,22 m

Ship space, strength and comments:
   Space   - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 99,9%
      - Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 137,7%
   Waterplane Area: 43.507 Square feet or 4.042 Square metres
   Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 98%
   Structure weight / hull surface area: 213 lbs/sq ft or 1.040 Kg/sq metre
   Hull strength (Relative):
      - Cross-sectional: 0,92
      - Longitudinal: 2,19
      - Overall: 1,00
   Hull space for machinery, storage, compartmentation is adequate
   Room for accommodation and workspaces is excellent

250 tons FC
50 tons  twin ERADe
25 tons Long range marconi
25 tons crew comfort messures
100 tons admiral quarters.

[Tanthalas]

Oh I like this kinda stuff, ill post one later but I thought I should reserve my spot in advance.

[TexanCowboy]

I was working on one, but it kept posting the "Main-Guns limited to end-on fire" commet. How do you fix that without drastically reducing the freeboard.

[maddox]

Nobody, why the restriction to Lvl 2 slipsdocks?  The OR is the next country to France with the big yards.

You easely can build the ship type 3 sized. And with yearly  43 Ktons of new Ship building capacity, you're also not restricted to budget ships.

In the OR tech tree, it's clear that 1912 engine tech is the best there is for the OR, so I adjusted that bit too.

I adjusted armament size from " to mm, having in mind the origins of the OR , and yours, Nobody.  ( German If I ain't wrong)

La Beaux, Republique Orange Battleship laid down 1917 (Engine 1912)

Displacement:
   29.999 t light; 32.100 t standard; 35.233 t normal; 37.739 t full load

Dimensions: Length overall / water x beam x draught
   693,08 ft / 688,98 ft x 101,71 ft x 29,53 ft (normal load)
   211,25 m / 210,00 m x 31,00 m  x 9,00 m

Armament:
      8 - 15,94" / 405 mm guns (2x4 guns), 2.094,39lbs / 950,00kg shells, 1917 Model
     Breech loading guns in turrets (on barbettes)
     on centreline ends, evenly spread
      4 - 5,91" / 150 mm guns (2x2 guns), 99,21lbs / 45,00kg shells, 1917 Model
     Breech loading guns in deck mounts with hoists
     on centreline ends, evenly spread, all raised mounts
      12 - 5,91" / 150 mm guns (6x2 guns), 99,21lbs / 45,00kg shells, 1917 Model
     Breech loading guns in deck mounts with hoists
     on side, all amidships, 2 raised mounts - superfiring
      4 - 1,57" / 40,0 mm guns in single mounts, 1,95lbs / 0,89kg shells, 1917 Model
     Breech loading guns in deck mounts
     on centreline, evenly spread, all raised mounts
   Weight of broadside 18.350 lbs / 8.324 kg
   Shells per gun, main battery: 135

Armour:
   - Belts:      Width (max)   Length (avg)      Height (avg)
   Main:   14,0" / 356 mm   434,06 ft / 132,30 m   14,25 ft / 4,34 m
   Ends:   Unarmoured
     Main Belt covers 97% of normal length

   - Torpedo Bulkhead:
      2,00" / 51 mm   434,06 ft / 132,30 m   27,79 ft / 8,47 m

   - Gun armour:   Face (max)   Other gunhouse (avg)   Barbette/hoist (max)
   Main:   15,0" / 381 mm   9,00" / 229 mm      15,0" / 381 mm
   2nd:   2,00" / 51 mm   1,00" / 25 mm      3,00" / 76 mm
   3rd:   0,50" / 13 mm         -               -

   - Armour deck: 4,00" / 102 mm, Conning tower: 14,00" / 356 mm

Machinery:
   Oil fired boilers, steam turbines,
   Electric motors, 4 shafts, 71.493 shp / 53.334 Kw = 25,00 kts
   Range 7.500nm at 15,00 kts
   Bunker at max displacement = 5.639 tons

Complement:
   1.285 - 1.671

Cost:
   £6,046 million / $24,185 million

Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
   Armament: 2.234 tons, 6,3%
   Armour: 10.842 tons, 30,8%
      - Belts: 3.791 tons, 10,8%
      - Torpedo bulkhead: 893 tons, 2,5%
      - Armament: 2.056 tons, 5,8%
      - Armour Deck: 3.778 tons, 10,7%
      - Conning Tower: 324 tons, 0,9%
   Machinery: 2.851 tons, 8,1%
   Hull, fittings & equipment: 13.622 tons, 38,7%
   Fuel, ammunition & stores: 5.234 tons, 14,9%
   Miscellaneous weights: 450 tons, 1,3%

Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
   Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
     42.259 lbs / 19.168 Kg = 20,8 x 15,9 " / 405 mm shells or 6,6 torpedoes
   Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1,15
   Metacentric height 6,6 ft / 2,0 m
   Roll period: 16,6 seconds
   Steadiness   - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 71 %
         - Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0,60
   Seaboat quality  (Average = 1.00): 1,20

Hull form characteristics:
   Hull has a flush deck
   Block coefficient: 0,596
   Length to Beam Ratio: 6,77 : 1
   'Natural speed' for length: 26,25 kts
   Power going to wave formation at top speed: 48 %
   Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 59
   Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): 0,00 degrees
   Stern overhang: 4,10 ft / 1,25 m
   Freeboard (% = measuring location as a percentage of overall length):
      - Stem:      27,89 ft / 8,50 m
      - Forecastle (20%):   17,72 ft / 5,40 m
      - Mid (50%):      17,39 ft / 5,30 m
      - Quarterdeck (17%):   17,39 ft / 5,30 m
      - Stern:      17,39 ft / 5,30 m
      - Average freeboard:   18,32 ft / 5,58 m
   Ship tends to be wet forward

Ship space, strength and comments:
   Space   - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 95,5%
      - Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 132,2%
   Waterplane Area: 51.058 Square feet or 4.743 Square metres
   Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 101%
   Structure weight / hull surface area: 200 lbs/sq ft or 976 Kg/sq metre
   Hull strength (Relative):
      - Cross-sectional: 0,97
      - Longitudinal: 1,28
      - Overall: 1,00
   Hull space for machinery, storage, compartmentation is adequate
   Room for accommodation and workspaces is excellent
   Ship has slow, easy roll, a good, steady gun platform
   Good seaboat, rides out heavy weather easily

[Nobody]

Thanks for your designs so far it look promising.

Nobody, why the restriction to Lvl 2 slipsdocks?  The OR is the next country to France with the big yards.

You easely can build the ship type 3 sized. And with yearly  43 Ktons of new Ship building capacity, you're also not restricted to budget ships.

Well but Orange doesn't have any type 3 slip or dock, and I want to reserve the type 4 for something else  ;D

In the OR tech tree, it's clear that 1912 engine tech is the best there is for the OR, so I adjusted that bit too.

No, actually the 1913(?) Engine tech allowing 1916 engine year was successfully finished some time ago (see hear, it says 1912 though). I just haven't updated the tech page yet.

I adjusted armament size from " to mm, having in mind the origins of the OR , and yours, Nobody.

There might be a change of policy in the future, but these guns were developed as 16", 6" and 5" and I see no reason change that just "out of the blue". Gun calibre is one of the few things I don't mind to see measured in inch, btw.

Korpen: well balanced, small. I like the brought armor belt and the interesting arrangement for the secondaries.

ledeper:
"Main belt does not fully cover magazines and engineering spaces" <-- sorry disqualified, please try again ;). Also very narrow belt and wrong cruising speed (15 knots please).

maddox: 27kt is still smaller than the design I inherited from P3D which are ~28kt if I remember correctly.

I was working on one, but it kept posting the "Main-Guns limited to end-on fire" commet. How do you fix that without drastically reducing the freeboard.

Interesting, I have never seen that message in any of my designs - which is not much though.

[maddox]

This better

La Glorieuze, Republique Orange Battleship laid down 1917 (Engine 1916)

Displacement:
   27.003 t light; 29.171 t standard; 31.685 t normal; 33.696 t full load

Dimensions: Length overall / water x beam x draught
   557,74 ft / 554,46 ft x 98,43 ft x 32,81 ft (normal load)
   170,00 m / 169,00 m x 30,00 m  x 10,00 m

Armament:
      8 - 16,00" / 406 mm guns (2x4 guns), 2.048,00lbs / 928,96kg shells, 1917 Model
     Breech loading guns in turrets (on barbettes)
     on centreline ends, evenly spread
      4 - 6,00" / 152 mm guns (2x2 guns), 108,00lbs / 48,99kg shells, 1917 Model
     Breech loading guns in deck mounts with hoists
     on centreline ends, evenly spread, all raised mounts
      12 - 6,00" / 152 mm guns (6x2 guns), 108,00lbs / 48,99kg shells, 1917 Model
     Breech loading guns in deck mounts with hoists
     on side, evenly spread, 2 raised mounts
      4 - 1,57" / 40,0 mm guns in single mounts, 1,95lbs / 0,89kg shells, 1917 Model
     Anti-aircraft guns in deck mounts
     on centreline, evenly spread, all raised mounts
   Weight of broadside 18.120 lbs / 8.219 kg
   Shells per gun, main battery: 150

Armour:
   - Belts:      Width (max)   Length (avg)      Height (avg)
   Main:   14,0" / 356 mm   377,03 ft / 114,92 m   14,00 ft / 4,27 m
   Ends:   Unarmoured
     Main Belt covers 105% of normal length

   - Torpedo Bulkhead:
      2,00" / 51 mm   377,03 ft / 114,92 m   31,18 ft / 9,50 m

   - Gun armour:   Face (max)   Other gunhouse (avg)   Barbette/hoist (max)
   Main:   15,0" / 381 mm   10,0" / 254 mm      15,0" / 381 mm
   2nd:   2,00" / 51 mm   1,00" / 25 mm      3,00" / 76 mm
   3rd:   2,00" / 51 mm   1,00" / 25 mm      3,00" / 76 mm
   4th:   0,50" / 13 mm         -               -

   - Armour deck: 4,00" / 102 mm, Conning tower: 15,00" / 381 mm

Machinery:
   Oil fired boilers, steam turbines,
   Electric motors, 4 shafts, 63.116 shp / 47.084 Kw = 24,00 kts
   Range 7.500nm at 15,00 kts
   Bunker at max displacement = 4.526 tons

Complement:
   1.186 - 1.543

Cost:
   £5,776 million / $23,105 million

Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
   Armament: 2.265 tons, 7,1%
   Armour: 9.915 tons, 31,3%
      - Belts: 3.249 tons, 10,3%
      - Torpedo bulkhead: 870 tons, 2,7%
      - Armament: 2.465 tons, 7,8%
      - Armour Deck: 3.007 tons, 9,5%
      - Conning Tower: 324 tons, 1,0%
   Machinery: 2.352 tons, 7,4%
   Hull, fittings & equipment: 12.071 tons, 38,1%
   Fuel, ammunition & stores: 4.682 tons, 14,8%
   Miscellaneous weights: 400 tons, 1,3%

Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
   Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
     36.702 lbs / 16.648 Kg = 17,9 x 16,0 " / 406 mm shells or 5,6 torpedoes
   Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1,10
   Metacentric height 5,8 ft / 1,8 m
   Roll period: 17,1 seconds
   Steadiness   - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 58 %
         - Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0,80
   Seaboat quality  (Average = 1.00): 1,20

Hull form characteristics:
   Hull has a flush deck
   Block coefficient: 0,619
   Length to Beam Ratio: 5,63 : 1
   'Natural speed' for length: 23,55 kts
   Power going to wave formation at top speed: 55 %
   Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 48
   Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): -5,00 degrees
   Stern overhang: 3,28 ft / 1,00 m
   Freeboard (% = measuring location as a percentage of overall length):
      - Stem:      28,87 ft / 8,80 m
      - Forecastle (20%):   21,65 ft / 6,60 m
      - Mid (50%):      21,65 ft / 6,60 m
      - Quarterdeck (12%):   21,65 ft / 6,60 m
      - Stern:      21,65 ft / 6,60 m
      - Average freeboard:   22,23 ft / 6,78 m

Ship space, strength and comments:
   Space   - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 101,6%
      - Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 141,3%
   Waterplane Area: 40.641 Square feet or 3.776 Square metres
   Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 96%
   Structure weight / hull surface area: 208 lbs/sq ft or 1.015 Kg/sq metre
   Hull strength (Relative):
      - Cross-sectional: 0,90
      - Longitudinal: 2,44
      - Overall: 1,00
   Hull space for machinery, storage, compartmentation is adequate
   Room for accommodation and workspaces is excellent
   Good seaboat, rides out heavy weather easily

250 tons FC
50 tons twin Huelsmeyer setup
25 tons Long range marconi
75 tons reserve.

[Walter]

I was working on one, but it kept posting the "Main-Guns limited to end-on fire" commet. How do you fix that without drastically reducing the freeboard.

Well it depends on how the design looks, but adjusting trim to a lower setting should work.

Just throwing something useless out of my computer. :)


Project O, Orange Battleship laid down 1917 (Engine 1916)

Displacement:
   25,356 t light; 27,230 t standard; 29,813 t normal; 31,879 t full load

Dimensions: Length overall / water x beam x draught
   556.73 ft / 550.00 ft x 100.00 ft x 31.00 ft (normal load)
   169.69 m / 167.64 m x 30.48 m  x 9.45 m

Armament:
      8 - 16.00" / 406 mm guns (2x4 guns), 2,116.44lbs / 960.00kg shells, 1917 Model
     Breech loading guns in turrets (on barbettes)
     on centreline ends, evenly spread
      4 - 6.00" / 152 mm guns (2x2 guns), 105.82lbs / 48.00kg shells, 1917 Model
     Breech loading guns in turrets (on barbettes)
     on centreline ends, evenly spread, all raised mounts
      4 - 6.00" / 152 mm guns (2x2 guns), 105.82lbs / 48.00kg shells, 1917 Model
     Breech loading guns in turrets (on barbettes)
     on side, all amidships
      16 - 5.00" / 127 mm guns (8x2 guns), 61.73lbs / 28.00kg shells, 1917 Model
     Breech loading guns in deck mounts with hoists
     on side ends, evenly spread, 4 raised mounts - superfiring
      4 - 3.00" / 76.2 mm guns in single mounts, 13.50lbs / 6.12kg shells, 1917 Model
     Breech loading guns in deck mounts
     on side, evenly spread, all raised mounts
   Weight of broadside 18,820 lbs / 8,536 kg
   Shells per gun, main battery: 120

Armour:
   - Belts:      Width (max)   Length (avg)      Height (avg)
   Main:   13.8" / 350 mm   374.02 ft / 114.00 m   13.12 ft / 4.00 m
   Ends:   Unarmoured
     Main Belt covers 105% of normal length

   - Torpedo Bulkhead:
      1.77" / 45 mm   374.02 ft / 114.00 m   29.53 ft / 9.00 m

   - Gun armour:   Face (max)   Other gunhouse (avg)   Barbette/hoist (max)
   Main:   15.0" / 380 mm   9.45" / 240 mm      13.8" / 350 mm
   2nd:   3.94" / 100 mm   1.97" / 50 mm      2.95" / 75 mm
   3rd:   3.94" / 100 mm   1.97" / 50 mm      2.95" / 75 mm
   4th:   1.57" / 40 mm   0.79" / 20 mm      1.57" / 40 mm

   - Armour deck: 3.54" / 90 mm, Conning tower: 14.96" / 380 mm

Machinery:
   Oil fired boilers, steam turbines,
   Geared drive, 4 shafts, 56,201 shp / 41,926 Kw = 23.50 kts
   Range 8,000nm at 15.00 kts
   Bunker at max displacement = 4,649 tons

Complement:
   1,133 - 1,474

Cost:
   £5.641 million / $22.562 million

Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
   Armament: 2,288 tons, 7.7%
   Armour: 8,865 tons, 29.7%
      - Belts: 2,979 tons, 10.0%
      - Torpedo bulkhead: 724 tons, 2.4%
      - Armament: 2,185 tons, 7.3%
      - Armour Deck: 2,667 tons, 8.9%
      - Conning Tower: 310 tons, 1.0%
   Machinery: 2,094 tons, 7.0%
   Hull, fittings & equipment: 11,509 tons, 38.6%
   Fuel, ammunition & stores: 4,458 tons, 15.0%
   Miscellaneous weights: 600 tons, 2.0%

Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
   Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
     31,549 lbs / 14,310 Kg = 15.4 x 16.0 " / 406 mm shells or 5.0 torpedoes
   Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1.13
   Metacentric height 6.3 ft / 1.9 m
   Roll period: 16.7 seconds
   Steadiness   - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 51 %
         - Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0.59
   Seaboat quality  (Average = 1.00): 1.03

Hull form characteristics:
   Hull has a flush deck
   Block coefficient: 0.612
   Length to Beam Ratio: 5.50 : 1
   'Natural speed' for length: 23.45 kts
   Power going to wave formation at top speed: 54 %
   Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 50
   Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): 14.00 degrees
   Stern overhang: 0.00 ft / 0.00 m
   Freeboard (% = measuring location as a percentage of overall length):
      - Stem:      27.00 ft / 8.23 m
      - Forecastle (20%):   17.00 ft / 5.18 m
      - Mid (50%):      17.00 ft / 5.18 m
      - Quarterdeck (15%):   17.00 ft / 5.18 m
      - Stern:      17.00 ft / 5.18 m
      - Average freeboard:   17.80 ft / 5.43 m

Ship space, strength and comments:
   Space   - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 104.4%
      - Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 116.3%
   Waterplane Area: 40,679 Square feet or 3,779 Square metres
   Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 93%
   Structure weight / hull surface area: 210 lbs/sq ft or 1,024 Kg/sq metre
   Hull strength (Relative):
      - Cross-sectional: 0.93
      - Longitudinal: 1.95
      - Overall: 1.00
   Hull space for machinery, storage, compartmentation is adequate
   Room for accommodation and workspaces is adequate