Esc Battle ships for 1917

[ledeper]

Ocean Class , Esc Bb laid down 1917 (Engine 1916)

Displacement:
   34.827 t light; 36.839 t standard; 40.133 t normal; 42.769 t full load

Dimensions: Length overall / water x beam x draught
   720,91 ft / 716,86 ft x 98,43 ft x 30,35 ft (normal load)
   219,73 m / 218,50 m x 30,00 m  x 9,25 m

Armament:
      9 - 15,94" / 405 mm guns (3x3 guns), 2.026,91lbs / 919,39kg shells, 1917 Model
     Breech loading guns in turrets (on barbettes)
     on centreline, evenly spread
     Aft Main mounts separated by engine room
      12 - 5,91" / 150 mm guns (6x2 guns), 102,98lbs / 46,71kg shells, 1917 Model
     Quick firing guns in deck mounts
     on side, all amidships
      2 - 3,94" / 100 mm guns in single mounts, 30,51lbs / 13,84kg shells, 1917 Model
     Anti-aircraft guns in deck mounts
     on side, evenly spread, all raised mounts
      6 - 1,57" / 40,0 mm guns in single mounts, 1,95lbs / 0,89kg shells, 1917 Model
     Anti-aircraft guns in deck mounts
     on side, evenly spread, all raised mounts
   Weight of broadside 19.551 lbs / 8.868 kg
   Shells per gun, main battery: 110

Armour:
   - Belts:      Width (max)   Length (avg)      Height (avg)
   Main:   13,8" / 350 mm   462,37 ft / 140,93 m   14,53 ft / 4,43 m
   Ends:   Unarmoured
   Upper:   5,91" / 150 mm   462,37 ft / 140,93 m   8,01 ft / 2,44 m
     Main Belt covers 99 % of normal length

   - Torpedo Bulkhead:
      1,57" / 40 mm   462,37 ft / 140,93 m   29,13 ft / 8,88 m

   - Gun armour:   Face (max)   Other gunhouse (avg)   Barbette/hoist (max)
   Main:   13,8" / 350 mm   9,84" / 250 mm      13,8" / 350 mm
   2nd:   0,98" / 25 mm         -               -
   3rd:   0,39" / 10 mm         -               -
   4th:   0,39" / 10 mm         -               -

   - Armour deck: 5,91" / 150 mm, Conning tower: 13,78" / 350 mm

Machinery:
   Oil fired boilers, steam turbines,
   Electric cruising motors plus geared drives, 4 shafts, 90.102 shp / 67.216 Kw = 26,00 kts
   Range 10.000nm at 14,00 kts
   Bunker at max displacement = 5.930 tons

Complement:
   1.417 - 1.843

Cost:
   £6,803 million / $27,213 million

Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
   Armament: 2.444 tons, 6,1 %
   Armour: 14.684 tons, 36,6 %
      - Belts: 4.960 tons, 12,4 %
      - Torpedo bulkhead: 785 tons, 2,0 %
      - Armament: 2.653 tons, 6,6 %
      - Armour Deck: 5.938 tons, 14,8 %
      - Conning Tower: 348 tons, 0,9 %
   Machinery: 3.357 tons, 8,4 %
   Hull, fittings & equipment: 13.592 tons, 33,9 %
   Fuel, ammunition & stores: 5.306 tons, 13,2 %
   Miscellaneous weights: 750 tons, 1,9 %

Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
   Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
     47.069 lbs / 21.350 Kg = 23,2 x 15,9 " / 405 mm shells or 6,8 torpedoes
   Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1,18
   Metacentric height 6,6 ft / 2,0 m
   Roll period: 16,0 seconds
   Steadiness   - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 50 %
         - Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0,52
   Seaboat quality  (Average = 1.00): 1,01

Hull form characteristics:
   Hull has a flush deck
   Block coefficient: 0,656
   Length to Beam Ratio: 7,28 : 1
   'Natural speed' for length: 26,77 kts
   Power going to wave formation at top speed: 49 %
   Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 50
   Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): 10,00 degrees
   Stern overhang: 0,00 ft / 0,00 m
   Freeboard (% = measuring location as a percentage of overall length):
      - Stem:      22,97 ft / 7,00 m
      - Forecastle (18 %):   16,40 ft / 5,00 m
      - Mid (50 %):      16,40 ft / 5,00 m
      - Quarterdeck (18 %):   16,40 ft / 5,00 m
      - Stern:      16,40 ft / 5,00 m
      - Average freeboard:   16,87 ft / 5,14 m
   Ship tends to be wet forward

Ship space, strength and comments:
   Space   - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 94,7 %
      - Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 119,8 %
   Waterplane Area: 54.349 Square feet or 5.049 Square metres
   Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 96 %
   Structure weight / hull surface area: 188 lbs/sq ft or 919 Kg/sq metre
   Hull strength (Relative):
      - Cross-sectional: 1,00
      - Longitudinal: 1,01
      - Overall: 1,00
   Hull space for machinery, storage, compartmentation is adequate
   Room for accommodation and workspaces is adequate

Armor Notes:
Main Belt 10 dg outward slope
Deck:
25 mm capping upper belt
100 mm capping main belt
25 mm splinter deck
Misc weigth:
2x F.C. :500 t
L/R W/L :25 t
Seendes Augen 25 t
Star Shell for 100mm AA guns:25 t
Reserve 175 t.

[mentat]

Quite a bruiser!

small point on the 150mm - need hoists? and armour prot'n on them seems light

Also - wondering if the Upper Belt could be shorter - just to cover amidships + the Secondaries

Could we have a picture - I'm intrigued by layout you are going for - Turrets well spaced out??

[Valles]

A-Q-X, looks like to me.

My question is about the layout of the secondary mounts - how do you keep them out of Q's firing arc if they're amidships? Or is that designation relative?

All in all, very interesting to compare to my own designs for similarly sized vessels. Lighter armor but bigger guns, substantially faster - a deadly-dangerous foe for even the best ship out there.

[Guinness]

Even if we take "amidships" to mean "somewhere between main gun A turret and main gun X turret", I think no matter what those secondary mountings would be sporting to serve in, even with closed backs, which since they have no "other" mount armor, I expect they don't have.

If it were me and I was designing such a ship, I'd consider twin mounts nestled in the triangle formed by main gun arcs and superstructure at each corner and mount the rest in casemates amidships below main deck level.

[ledeper]

I am having the impression that one cannot protect sec.guns with no more than 25mm armor.

[Guinness]

Light Cruiser Architecture - Main battery in deck mounts/casemates
1880 Baseline(0): guns in single mounts or casemates, on side/centerline
1900 Advanced(+1): ammunition hoists, deck torpedo armament, superfiring mounts
1910 Cutting Edge (+5): twin gun mounts (require hoists); powered gun mounts; unrestricted weapon armor

Note 1910's tech. If you have that, you can mount secondaries up to 7" in twin mounts with hoists, with no limit on the armor provided.

[ledeper]

Hopefully final draft ;)
Ocean Class , Esc Bb laid down 1917 (Engine 1916)

Displacement:
   35.109 t light; 37.127 t standard; 40.439 t normal; 43.089 t full load

Dimensions: Length overall / water x beam x draught
   720,91 ft / 716,86 ft x 98,43 ft x 30,35 ft (normal load)
   219,73 m / 218,50 m x 30,00 m  x 9,25 m

Armament:
      9 - 15,94" / 405 mm guns (3x3 guns), 2.026,91lbs / 919,39kg shells, 1917 Model
     Breech loading guns in turrets (on barbettes)
     on centreline, evenly spread
     Aft Main mounts separated by engine room
      12 - 5,91" / 150 mm guns (6x2 guns), 102,98lbs / 46,71kg shells, 1917 Model
     Quick firing guns in deck mounts with hoists
     on side, all amidships
      2 - 3,94" / 100 mm guns in single mounts, 30,51lbs / 13,84kg shells, 1917 Model
     Anti-aircraft guns in deck mounts
     on side, evenly spread, all raised mounts
      6 - 1,57" / 40,0 mm guns in single mounts, 1,95lbs / 0,88kg shells, 1917 Model
     Anti-aircraft guns in deck mounts
     on side, evenly spread, all raised mounts
   Weight of broadside 19.551 lbs / 8.868 kg
   Shells per gun, main battery: 110

Armour:
   - Belts:      Width (max)   Length (avg)      Height (avg)
   Main:   13,8" / 350 mm   462,37 ft / 140,93 m   14,53 ft / 4,43 m
   Ends:   Unarmoured
   Upper:   5,91" / 150 mm   462,37 ft / 140,93 m   8,01 ft / 2,44 m
     Main Belt covers 99 % of normal length

   - Torpedo Bulkhead:
      1,57" / 40 mm   462,37 ft / 140,93 m   29,13 ft / 8,88 m

   - Gun armour:   Face (max)   Other gunhouse (avg)   Barbette/hoist (max)
   Main:   13,8" / 350 mm   9,84" / 250 mm      13,8" / 350 mm
   2nd:   3,94" / 100 mm   1,97" / 50 mm            -
   3rd:   0,39" / 10 mm         -               -
   4th:   0,39" / 10 mm         -               -

   - Armour deck: 5,91" / 150 mm, Conning tower: 13,78" / 350 mm

Machinery:
   Oil fired boilers, steam turbines,
   Electric cruising motors plus geared drives, 4 shafts, 90.690 shp / 67.655 Kw = 26,00 kts
   Range 10.000nm at 14,00 kts
   Bunker at max displacement = 5.962 tons

Complement:
   1.425 - 1.853

Cost:
   £6,827 million / $27,307 million

Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
   Armament: 2.444 tons, 6,0 %
   Armour: 14.809 tons, 36,6 %
      - Belts: 4.962 tons, 12,3 %
      - Torpedo bulkhead: 785 tons, 1,9 %
      - Armament: 2.747 tons, 6,8 %
      - Armour Deck: 5.965 tons, 14,8 %
      - Conning Tower: 350 tons, 0,9 %
   Machinery: 3.379 tons, 8,4 %
   Hull, fittings & equipment: 13.728 tons, 33,9 %
   Fuel, ammunition & stores: 5.330 tons, 13,2 %
   Miscellaneous weights: 750 tons, 1,9 %

Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
   Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
     47.382 lbs / 21.492 Kg = 23,4 x 15,9 " / 405 mm shells or 6,8 torpedoes
   Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1,17
   Metacentric height 6,5 ft / 2,0 m
   Roll period: 16,2 seconds
   Steadiness   - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 50 %
         - Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0,53
   Seaboat quality  (Average = 1.00): 1,00

Hull form characteristics:
   Hull has a flush deck
   Block coefficient: 0,661
   Length to Beam Ratio: 7,28 : 1
   'Natural speed' for length: 26,77 kts
   Power going to wave formation at top speed: 49 %
   Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 50
   Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): 10,00 degrees
   Stern overhang: 0,00 ft / 0,00 m
   Freeboard (% = measuring location as a percentage of overall length):
      - Stem:      22,97 ft / 7,00 m
      - Forecastle (18 %):   16,40 ft / 5,00 m
      - Mid (50 %):      16,40 ft / 5,00 m
      - Quarterdeck (18 %):   16,40 ft / 5,00 m
      - Stern:      16,40 ft / 5,00 m
      - Average freeboard:   16,87 ft / 5,14 m
   Ship tends to be wet forward

Ship space, strength and comments:
   Space   - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 94,2 %
      - Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 119,7 %
   Waterplane Area: 54.598 Square feet or 5.072 Square metres
   Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 97 %
   Structure weight / hull surface area: 189 lbs/sq ft or 924 Kg/sq metre
   Hull strength (Relative):
      - Cross-sectional: 1,00
      - Longitudinal: 1,01
      - Overall: 1,00
   Hull space for machinery, storage, compartmentation is adequate
   Room for accommodation and workspaces is adequate

Armor Notes:
Main Belt 10 dg outward slope
Deck:
25 mm capping upper belt
100 mm capping main belt
25 mm splinter deck
Misc weigth:
2x F.C. :500 t
L/R W/L :25 t
Seendes Augen 25 t
Star Shell for 100mm AA guns:25 t
Reserve 175 t.