DD-1916

[Valles]

DD-1916, Maori Destroyer laid down 1912

Displacement:
   1,000 t light; 1,036 t standard; 1,277 t normal; 1,471 t full load

Dimensions: Length overall / water x beam x draught
   368.89 ft / 360.89 ft x 34.45 ft x 8.86 ft (normal load)
   112.44 m / 110.00 m x 10.50 m  x 2.70 m

Armament:
      4 - 3.94" / 100 mm guns (2x2 guns), 33.07lbs / 15.00kg shells, 1912 Model
     Quick firing guns in deck mounts with hoists
     on centreline ends, evenly spread
   Weight of broadside 132 lbs / 60 kg
   Shells per gun, main battery: 150
   6 - 20.7" / 525 mm above water torpedoes

Armour:
   - Gun armour:   Face (max)   Other gunhouse (avg)   Barbette/hoist (max)
   Main:   0.79" / 20 mm   0.79" / 20 mm            -

Machinery:
   Oil fired boilers, steam turbines,
   Electric motors, 2 shafts, 18,496 shp / 13,798 Kw = 29.00 kts
   Range 5,000nm at 14.00 kts
   Bunker at max displacement = 435 tons

Complement:
   106 - 138

Cost:
   £0.133 million / $0.533 million

Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
   Armament: 15 tons, 1.2 %
   Armour: 8 tons, 0.6 %
      - Belts: 0 tons, 0.0 %
      - Torpedo bulkhead: 0 tons, 0.0 %
      - Armament: 8 tons, 0.6 %
      - Armour Deck: 0 tons, 0.0 %
      - Conning Tower: 0 tons, 0.0 %
   Machinery: 610 tons, 47.8 %
   Hull, fittings & equipment: 324 tons, 25.3 %
   Fuel, ammunition & stores: 278 tons, 21.8 %
   Miscellaneous weights: 42 tons, 3.3 %

Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
   Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
     385 lbs / 175 Kg = 12.6 x 3.9 " / 100 mm shells or 0.3 torpedoes
   Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1.43
   Metacentric height 1.9 ft / 0.6 m
   Roll period: 10.5 seconds
   Steadiness   - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 72 %
         - Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0.15
   Seaboat quality  (Average = 1.00): 0.94

Hull form characteristics:
   Hull has rise forward of midbreak
   Block coefficient: 0.406
   Length to Beam Ratio: 10.48 : 1
   'Natural speed' for length: 19.00 kts
   Power going to wave formation at top speed: 58 %
   Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 76
   Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): 5.00 degrees
   Stern overhang: 6.56 ft / 2.00 m
   Freeboard (% = measuring location as a percentage of overall length):
      - Stem:      16.40 ft / 5.00 m
      - Forecastle (20 %):   16.40 ft / 5.00 m
      - Mid (35 %):      16.40 ft / 5.00 m (8.20 ft / 2.50 m aft of break)
      - Quarterdeck (15 %):   8.20 ft / 2.50 m
      - Stern:      8.20 ft / 2.50 m
      - Average freeboard:   11.07 ft / 3.38 m
   Ship tends to be wet forward

Ship space, strength and comments:
   Space   - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 167.2 %
      - Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 94.4 %
   Waterplane Area: 7,680 Square feet or 713 Square metres
   Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 78 %
   Structure weight / hull surface area: 28 lbs/sq ft or 135 Kg/sq metre
   Hull strength (Relative):
      - Cross-sectional: 0.50
      - Longitudinal: 0.62
      - Overall: 0.52
   Hull space for machinery, storage, compartmentation is cramped
   Room for accommodation and workspaces is adequate
   Ship has slow, easy roll, a good, steady gun platform
   Poor seaboat, wet and uncomfortable, reduced performance in heavy weather

6 tons - ready torpedoes
6 tons - reload torpedoes
25 tons - long-range wireless
5 tons - minesweeping gear

I'm really not very happy with this one. Suggestions for possible improvements are welcome.

[Guinness]

For a DD, she's too slow. When you fix that, your seakeeping will go to hell. To figure out what seakeeping should be, I've been using whatever the value is if you put 28.5 knots in the max speed blank as a guideline, aiming for something around 1.1 in that value. This seems to be working for me at least.

Bunkerage may or may not be high. The latest pass at a Confederate 1000ish tonner ships only 329 tons (max) of oil for what we consider acceptable range. There might be some weight to be had there as well.

You might also be able to afford decreasing beam and increasing draft slightly. P3D often talks about a 3-1 ratio there, which is a good place to start. This may give you a few tons to play with.

[Valles]

DD-1916, Maori Destroyer laid down 1912

Displacement:
   1,000 t light; 1,036 t standard; 1,278 t normal; 1,472 t full load

Dimensions: Length overall / water x beam x draught
   368.89 ft / 360.89 ft x 29.53 ft x 9.84 ft (normal load)
   112.44 m / 110.00 m x 9.00 m  x 3.00 m

Armament:
      4 - 3.94" / 100 mm guns (2x2 guns), 33.07lbs / 15.00kg shells, 1912 Model
     Quick firing guns in deck mounts with hoists
     on centreline ends, evenly spread
   Weight of broadside 132 lbs / 60 kg
   Shells per gun, main battery: 150
   6 - 20.7" / 525 mm above water torpedoes

Armour:
   - Gun armour:   Face (max)   Other gunhouse (avg)   Barbette/hoist (max)
   Main:   0.79" / 20 mm   0.79" / 20 mm            -

Machinery:
   Oil fired boilers, steam turbines,
   Electric motors, 2 shafts, 21,008 shp / 15,672 Kw = 30.00 kts
   Range 5,000nm at 14.00 kts
   Bunker at max displacement = 435 tons

Complement:
   106 - 138

Cost:
   £0.137 million / $0.548 million

Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
   Armament: 15 tons, 1.2 %
   Armour: 8 tons, 0.6 %
      - Belts: 0 tons, 0.0 %
      - Torpedo bulkhead: 0 tons, 0.0 %
      - Armament: 8 tons, 0.6 %
      - Armour Deck: 0 tons, 0.0 %
      - Conning Tower: 0 tons, 0.0 %
   Machinery: 637 tons, 49.8 %
   Hull, fittings & equipment: 298 tons, 23.3 %
   Fuel, ammunition & stores: 278 tons, 21.8 %
   Miscellaneous weights: 42 tons, 3.3 %

Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
   Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
     306 lbs / 139 Kg = 10.0 x 3.9 " / 100 mm shells or 0.2 torpedoes
   Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1.36
   Metacentric height 1.4 ft / 0.4 m
   Roll period: 10.6 seconds
   Steadiness   - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 71 %
         - Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0.24
   Seaboat quality  (Average = 1.00): 0.99

Hull form characteristics:
   Hull has raised forecastle
   Block coefficient: 0.427
   Length to Beam Ratio: 12.22 : 1
   'Natural speed' for length: 19.00 kts
   Power going to wave formation at top speed: 59 %
   Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 72
   Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): 5.00 degrees
   Stern overhang: 6.56 ft / 2.00 m
   Freeboard (% = measuring location as a percentage of overall length):
      - Stem:      16.40 ft / 5.00 m
      - Forecastle (20 %):   16.40 ft / 5.00 m (14.11 ft / 4.30 m aft of break)
      - Mid (50 %):      8.20 ft / 2.50 m
      - Quarterdeck (15 %):   8.20 ft / 2.50 m
      - Stern:      8.20 ft / 2.50 m
      - Average freeboard:   10.73 ft / 3.27 m
   Ship tends to be wet forward

Ship space, strength and comments:
   Space   - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 173.7 %
      - Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 71.6 %
   Waterplane Area: 6,674 Square feet or 620 Square metres
   Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 69 %
   Structure weight / hull surface area: 26 lbs/sq ft or 127 Kg/sq metre
   Hull strength (Relative):
      - Cross-sectional: 0.50
      - Longitudinal: 0.66
      - Overall: 0.51
   Hull space for machinery, storage, compartmentation is cramped
   Room for accommodation and workspaces is cramped
   Ship has slow, easy roll, a good, steady gun platform
   Poor seaboat, wet and uncomfortable, reduced performance in heavy weather

6 tons - ready torpedoes
6 tons - reload torpedoes
25 tons - long-range wireless
5 tons - minesweeping gear

Hmn.

Or possibly...

DD-1916, Maori Destroyer laid down 1912

Displacement:
   1,000 t light; 1,036 t standard; 1,278 t normal; 1,472 t full load

Dimensions: Length overall / water x beam x draught
   368.89 ft / 360.89 ft x 29.53 ft x 9.84 ft (normal load)
   112.44 m / 110.00 m x 9.00 m  x 3.00 m

Armament:
      4 - 3.94" / 100 mm guns (2x2 guns), 33.07lbs / 15.00kg shells, 1912 Model
     Quick firing guns in deck mounts with hoists
     on centreline ends, evenly spread
   Weight of broadside 132 lbs / 60 kg
   Shells per gun, main battery: 150
   6 - 20.7" / 525 mm above water torpedoes

Armour:
   - Gun armour:   Face (max)   Other gunhouse (avg)   Barbette/hoist (max)
   Main:   0.79" / 20 mm   0.79" / 20 mm            -

Machinery:
   Oil fired boilers, steam turbines,
   Electric motors, 2 shafts, 21,008 shp / 15,672 Kw = 30.00 kts
   Range 5,000nm at 14.00 kts
   Bunker at max displacement = 435 tons

Complement:
   106 - 138

Cost:
   £0.137 million / $0.548 million

Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
   Armament: 15 tons, 1.2 %
   Armour: 8 tons, 0.6 %
      - Belts: 0 tons, 0.0 %
      - Torpedo bulkhead: 0 tons, 0.0 %
      - Armament: 8 tons, 0.6 %
      - Armour Deck: 0 tons, 0.0 %
      - Conning Tower: 0 tons, 0.0 %
   Machinery: 637 tons, 49.8 %
   Hull, fittings & equipment: 298 tons, 23.3 %
   Fuel, ammunition & stores: 278 tons, 21.8 %
   Miscellaneous weights: 42 tons, 3.3 %

Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
   Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
     306 lbs / 139 Kg = 10.0 x 3.9 " / 100 mm shells or 0.2 torpedoes
   Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1.36
   Metacentric height 1.4 ft / 0.4 m
   Roll period: 10.6 seconds
   Steadiness   - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 70 %
         - Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0.24
   Seaboat quality  (Average = 1.00): 0.97

Hull form characteristics:
   Hull has rise forward of midbreak
   Block coefficient: 0.427
   Length to Beam Ratio: 12.22 : 1
   'Natural speed' for length: 19.00 kts
   Power going to wave formation at top speed: 59 %
   Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 72
   Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): 5.00 degrees
   Stern overhang: 6.56 ft / 2.00 m
   Freeboard (% = measuring location as a percentage of overall length):
      - Stem:      16.40 ft / 5.00 m
      - Forecastle (20 %):   16.40 ft / 5.00 m
      - Mid (30 %):      16.40 ft / 5.00 m (8.20 ft / 2.50 m aft of break)
      - Quarterdeck (15 %):   8.20 ft / 2.50 m
      - Stern:      8.20 ft / 2.50 m
      - Average freeboard:   10.66 ft / 3.25 m
   Ship tends to be wet forward

Ship space, strength and comments:
   Space   - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 173.7 %
      - Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 70.8 %
   Waterplane Area: 6,674 Square feet or 620 Square metres
   Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 69 %
   Structure weight / hull surface area: 26 lbs/sq ft or 127 Kg/sq metre
   Hull strength (Relative):
      - Cross-sectional: 0.50
      - Longitudinal: 0.65
      - Overall: 0.51
   Hull space for machinery, storage, compartmentation is cramped
   Room for accommodation and workspaces is cramped
   Ship has slow, easy roll, a good, steady gun platform
   Poor seaboat, wet and uncomfortable, reduced performance in heavy weather

6 tons - ready torpedoes
6 tons - reload torpedoes
25 tons - long-range wireless
5 tons - minesweeping gear

Really what I'd like would be 3x2x100mm and about 30 knots with half the cruising range of my larger vessels, but that's not liable to happen on 1000 tons.

[ledeper]

Electric motors,

??
On such a small ship? ???

[Valles]

I don't have geared drives and don't regard direct as a viable means of development, so, yeah. Electric.

[Guinness]

Yeah, that's not going to happen on 1000t.

Your L/B is too large now on both, but this is getting there.

Also, to me the freeboard on both doesn't work quite right.  On the second, I think the step down from the forcastle needs to be bigger, like 2.4 meters or more, but I think you can get that and keep seakeeping if you extend the forcastle aft a bit more (leave the first break where it is, or even move it forward a bit, and move the mid break to 30something percent, and lower the deck height aft of the break to something like 2.4 meters and see where it all shakes out).

On the first, I think maybe you are most of the way to a flush-decker, which would be ok (and might just be better than a raised forecastle anyway).

[Valles]

DD-1916, Maori Destroyer laid down 1912

Displacement:
   1,000 t light; 1,037 t standard; 1,277 t normal; 1,470 t full load

Dimensions: Length overall / water x beam x draught
   335.79 ft / 328.08 ft x 32.81 ft x 9.84 ft (normal load)
   102.35 m / 100.00 m x 10.00 m  x 3.00 m

Armament:
      4 - 3.94" / 100 mm guns (2x2 guns), 33.07lbs / 15.00kg shells, 1912 Model
     Quick firing guns in deck mounts with hoists
     on centreline ends, evenly spread
   Weight of broadside 132 lbs / 60 kg
   Shells per gun, main battery: 150
   6 - 20.7" / 525 mm above water torpedoes

Armour:
   - Gun armour:   Face (max)   Other gunhouse (avg)   Barbette/hoist (max)
   Main:   0.79" / 20 mm   0.79" / 20 mm            -

Machinery:
   Oil fired boilers, steam turbines,
   Electric motors, 2 shafts, 22,959 shp / 17,127 Kw = 30.10 kts
   Range 5,000nm at 14.00 kts
   Bunker at max displacement = 433 tons

Complement:
   106 - 138

Cost:
   £0.140 million / $0.561 million

Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
   Armament: 15 tons, 1.2 %
   Armour: 8 tons, 0.6 %
      - Belts: 0 tons, 0.0 %
      - Torpedo bulkhead: 0 tons, 0.0 %
      - Armament: 8 tons, 0.6 %
      - Armour Deck: 0 tons, 0.0 %
      - Conning Tower: 0 tons, 0.0 %
   Machinery: 660 tons, 51.7 %
   Hull, fittings & equipment: 295 tons, 23.1 %
   Fuel, ammunition & stores: 277 tons, 21.7 %
   Miscellaneous weights: 22 tons, 1.7 %

Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
   Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
     285 lbs / 129 Kg = 9.4 x 3.9 " / 100 mm shells or 0.3 torpedoes
   Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1.20
   Metacentric height 1.3 ft / 0.4 m
   Roll period: 12.0 seconds
   Steadiness   - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 73 %
         - Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0.21
   Seaboat quality  (Average = 1.00): 0.73

Hull form characteristics:
   Hull has a flush deck
   Block coefficient: 0.422
   Length to Beam Ratio: 10.00 : 1
   'Natural speed' for length: 18.11 kts
   Power going to wave formation at top speed: 64 %
   Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 100
   Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): 5.00 degrees
   Stern overhang: 6.56 ft / 2.00 m
   Freeboard (% = measuring location as a percentage of overall length):
      - Stem:      13.12 ft / 4.00 m
      - Forecastle (15 %):   9.84 ft / 3.00 m
      - Mid (35 %):      9.84 ft / 3.00 m
      - Quarterdeck (15 %):   9.84 ft / 3.00 m
      - Stern:      9.84 ft / 3.00 m
      - Average freeboard:   10.04 ft / 3.06 m
   Ship tends to be wet forward

Ship space, strength and comments:
   Space   - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 177.9 %
      - Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 74.6 %
   Waterplane Area: 6,720 Square feet or 624 Square metres
   Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 64 %
   Structure weight / hull surface area: 28 lbs/sq ft or 138 Kg/sq metre
   Hull strength (Relative):
      - Cross-sectional: 0.50
      - Longitudinal: 0.68
      - Overall: 0.52
   Hull space for machinery, storage, compartmentation is cramped
   Room for accommodation and workspaces is cramped
   Ship has slow, easy roll, a good, steady gun platform
   Poor seaboat, wet and uncomfortable, reduced performance in heavy weather

6 tons - ready torpedoes
6 tons - reload torpedoes
10 tons - minesweeping gear

[Guinness]

Now that's starting to look good. What's here seakeeping if max speed is set to 28.5 knots (just for comparison sake)?

[Valles]

0.85, it says. Not great. I figure I'll go to two decks - 5m freeboard - once I can start building 2kton cans.

[Valles]

Aha. I decided to try to do it the way the Maori themselves likely would, by starting with the existing DD design and tinkering for the new gun.

I think it worked out a bit better.

DD-1916, Maori Destroyer laid down 1916 (Engine 1912)

Displacement:
   1,000 t light; 1,036 t standard; 1,278 t normal; 1,471 t full load

Dimensions: Length overall / water x beam x draught
   334.84 ft / 328.08 ft x 29.53 ft x 9.84 ft (normal load)
   102.06 m / 100.00 m x 9.00 m  x 3.00 m

Armament:
      4 - 3.94" / 100 mm guns (2x2 guns), 33.07lbs / 15.00kg shells, 1916 Model
     Quick firing guns in deck mounts with hoists
     on centreline ends, evenly spread
   Weight of broadside 132 lbs / 60 kg
   Shells per gun, main battery: 150
   6 - 20.7" / 525 mm above water torpedoes

Armour:
   - Gun armour:   Face (max)   Other gunhouse (avg)   Barbette/hoist (max)
   Main:   0.39" / 10 mm   0.39" / 10 mm            -

Machinery:
   Oil fired boilers, steam turbines,
   Electric motors, 2 shafts, 22,904 shp / 17,086 Kw = 30.00 kts
   Range 5,000nm at 14.00 kts
   Bunker at max displacement = 435 tons

Complement:
   106 - 138

Cost:
   £0.229 million / $0.918 million

Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
   Armament: 15 tons, 1.2 %
   Armour: 4 tons, 0.3 %
      - Belts: 0 tons, 0.0 %
      - Torpedo bulkhead: 0 tons, 0.0 %
      - Armament: 4 tons, 0.3 %
      - Armour Deck: 0 tons, 0.0 %
      - Conning Tower: 0 tons, 0.0 %
   Machinery: 660 tons, 51.7 %
   Hull, fittings & equipment: 296 tons, 23.2 %
   Fuel, ammunition & stores: 278 tons, 21.8 %
   Miscellaneous weights: 24 tons, 1.9 %

Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
   Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
     292 lbs / 132 Kg = 9.6 x 3.9 " / 100 mm shells or 0.2 torpedoes
   Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1.21
   Metacentric height 1.1 ft / 0.3 m
   Roll period: 11.6 seconds
   Steadiness   - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 77 %
         - Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0.32
   Seaboat quality  (Average = 1.00): 0.85

Hull form characteristics:
   Hull has rise forward of midbreak
   Block coefficient: 0.469
   Length to Beam Ratio: 11.11 : 1
   'Natural speed' for length: 18.11 kts
   Power going to wave formation at top speed: 64 %
   Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 90
   Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): 10.00 degrees
   Stern overhang: 3.28 ft / 1.00 m
   Freeboard (% = measuring location as a percentage of overall length):
      - Stem:      19.69 ft / 6.00 m
      - Forecastle (10 %):   16.40 ft / 5.00 m
      - Mid (33 %):      16.40 ft / 5.00 m (8.20 ft / 2.50 m aft of break)
      - Quarterdeck (10 %):   8.20 ft / 2.50 m
      - Stern:      8.20 ft / 2.50 m
      - Average freeboard:   11.04 ft / 3.37 m
   Ship tends to be wet forward

Ship space, strength and comments:
   Space   - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 178.0 %
      - Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 69.9 %
   Waterplane Area: 6,280 Square feet or 583 Square metres
   Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 65 %
   Structure weight / hull surface area: 27 lbs/sq ft or 133 Kg/sq metre
   Hull strength (Relative):
      - Cross-sectional: 0.50
      - Longitudinal: 0.86
      - Overall: 0.53
   Hull space for machinery, storage, compartmentation is cramped
   Room for accommodation and workspaces is cramped
   Ship has slow, easy roll, a good, steady gun platform
   Poor seaboat, wet and uncomfortable, reduced performance in heavy weather

6 tons ready torpedoes
6 tons reload torpedoes
10 tons wireless