Untitled Ships

[Logi]

Enter ship name, Enter country Enter ship type laid down 1914 (Engine 1912)

Displacement:
   4,160 t light; 4,335 t standard; 4,715 t normal; 5,019 t full load

Dimensions: Length overall / water x beam x draught
   392.55 ft / 386.00 ft x 45.00 ft x 19.00 ft (normal load)
   119.65 m / 117.65 m x 13.72 m  x 5.79 m

Armament:
      4 - 7.00" / 178 mm guns in single mounts, 171.50lbs / 77.79kg shells, 1914 Model
     Breech loading guns in deck mounts with hoists
     on centreline ends, evenly spread
      2 - 3.00" / 76.2 mm guns in single mounts, 13.50lbs / 6.12kg shells, 1914 Model
     Anti-aircraft guns in deck mounts
     on side, all amidships
      4 - 0.50" / 12.7 mm guns in single mounts, 0.06lbs / 0.03kg shells, 1914 Model
     Machine guns in deck mounts
     on side, evenly spread
   Weight of broadside 713 lbs / 324 kg
   Shells per gun, main battery: 200
   8 - 20.0" / 508 mm above water torpedoes

Armour:
   - Belts:      Width (max)   Length (avg)      Height (avg)
   Main:   3.00" / 76 mm   314.00 ft / 95.71 m   10.00 ft / 3.05 m
   Ends:   Unarmoured
   Upper:   2.00" / 51 mm   314.00 ft / 95.71 m   5.00 ft / 1.52 m
     Main Belt covers 125 % of normal length

   - Gun armour:   Face (max)   Other gunhouse (avg)   Barbette/hoist (max)
   Main:   1.00" / 25 mm   1.00" / 25 mm      1.00" / 25 mm
   2nd:   1.00" / 25 mm   1.00" / 25 mm            -
   3rd:   0.25" / 6 mm         -               -

   - Armour deck: 1.00" / 25 mm, Conning tower: 3.00" / 76 mm

Machinery:
   Oil fired boilers, steam turbines,
   Direct drive, 2 shafts, 38,010 shp / 28,355 Kw = 28.00 kts
   Range 5,050nm at 12.00 kts
   Bunker at max displacement = 684 tons

Complement:
   283 - 369

Cost:
   £0.551 million / $2.203 million

Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
   Armament: 89 tons, 1.9 %
   Armour: 772 tons, 16.4 %
      - Belts: 510 tons, 10.8 %
      - Torpedo bulkhead: 0 tons, 0.0 %
      - Armament: 30 tons, 0.6 %
      - Armour Deck: 214 tons, 4.5 %
      - Conning Tower: 18 tons, 0.4 %
   Machinery: 1,516 tons, 32.1 %
   Hull, fittings & equipment: 1,634 tons, 34.7 %
   Fuel, ammunition & stores: 555 tons, 11.8 %
   Miscellaneous weights: 150 tons, 3.2 %

Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
   Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
     3,688 lbs / 1,673 Kg = 21.5 x 7.0 " / 178 mm shells or 0.8 torpedoes
   Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1.10
   Metacentric height 1.8 ft / 0.5 m
   Roll period: 14.1 seconds
   Steadiness   - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 70 %
         - Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0.54
   Seaboat quality  (Average = 1.00): 1.19

Hull form characteristics:
   Hull has low quarterdeck
   Block coefficient: 0.500
   Length to Beam Ratio: 8.58 : 1
   'Natural speed' for length: 19.65 kts
   Power going to wave formation at top speed: 62 %
   Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 59
   Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): 20.00 degrees
   Stern overhang: 0.00 ft / 0.00 m
   Freeboard (% = measuring location as a percentage of overall length):
      - Stem:      18.00 ft / 5.49 m
      - Forecastle (20 %):   18.00 ft / 5.49 m
      - Mid (50 %):      18.00 ft / 5.49 m
      - Quarterdeck (15 %):   15.00 ft / 4.57 m (18.00 ft / 5.49 m before break)
      - Stern:      15.00 ft / 4.57 m
      - Average freeboard:   17.55 ft / 5.35 m
   Ship tends to be wet forward

Ship space, strength and comments:
   Space   - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 122.8 %
      - Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 99.9 %
   Waterplane Area: 11,573 Square feet or 1,075 Square metres
   Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 101 %
   Structure weight / hull surface area: 75 lbs/sq ft or 368 Kg/sq metre
   Hull strength (Relative):
      - Cross-sectional: 0.88
      - Longitudinal: 2.92
      - Overall: 1.00
   Hull space for machinery, storage, compartmentation is cramped
   Room for accommodation and workspaces is adequate
   Ship has slow, easy roll, a good, steady gun platform

It's a small cruiser. Feedback please...

[The Rock Doctor]

I have my doubts you could get the four mounts on the centerline without raising two, but it's an interesting start.

[P3D]

7" is too large for deck mounting.
There's no reason I see to have a 5' upper belt. Why would you protect 5' of the ~8' deck height?

[Logi]

Enter ship name, Enter country Enter ship type laid down 1914 (Engine 1912)

Displacement:
   4,192 t light; 4,338 t standard; 4,715 t normal; 5,016 t full load

Dimensions: Length overall / water x beam x draught
   392.55 ft / 386.00 ft x 45.00 ft x 19.00 ft (normal load)
   119.65 m / 117.65 m x 13.72 m  x 5.79 m

Armament:
      4 - 6.00" / 152 mm guns in single mounts, 108.00lbs / 48.99kg shells, 1914 Model
     Breech loading guns in turrets (on barbettes)
     on centreline ends, evenly spread, 2 raised mounts - superfiring
      2 - 3.00" / 76.2 mm guns in single mounts, 13.50lbs / 6.12kg shells, 1914 Model
     Anti-aircraft guns in deck mounts
     on side, all amidships
      4 - 0.50" / 12.7 mm guns in single mounts, 0.06lbs / 0.03kg shells, 1914 Model
     Machine guns in deck mounts
     on side, evenly spread
   Weight of broadside 459 lbs / 208 kg
   Shells per gun, main battery: 200
   8 - 20.0" / 508 mm above water torpedoes

Armour:
   - Belts:      Width (max)   Length (avg)      Height (avg)
   Main:   3.00" / 76 mm   314.00 ft / 95.71 m   10.00 ft / 3.05 m
   Ends:   Unarmoured
   Upper:   2.00" / 51 mm   314.00 ft / 95.71 m   8.00 ft / 2.44 m
     Main Belt covers 125 % of normal length

   - Gun armour:   Face (max)   Other gunhouse (avg)   Barbette/hoist (max)
   Main:   2.00" / 51 mm   1.00" / 25 mm      2.00" / 51 mm
   2nd:   1.00" / 25 mm   1.00" / 25 mm            -
   3rd:   0.25" / 6 mm         -               -

   - Armour deck: 1.00" / 25 mm, Conning tower: 3.00" / 76 mm

Machinery:
   Oil fired boilers, steam turbines,
   Direct drive, 2 shafts, 38,010 shp / 28,355 Kw = 28.00 kts
   Range 5,000nm at 12.00 kts
   Bunker at max displacement = 678 tons

Complement:
   283 - 369

Cost:
   £0.518 million / $2.073 million

Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
   Armament: 57 tons, 1.2 %
   Armour: 901 tons, 19.1 %
      - Belts: 586 tons, 12.4 %
      - Torpedo bulkhead: 0 tons, 0.0 %
      - Armament: 82 tons, 1.7 %
      - Armour Deck: 214 tons, 4.5 %
      - Conning Tower: 18 tons, 0.4 %
   Machinery: 1,516 tons, 32.1 %
   Hull, fittings & equipment: 1,608 tons, 34.1 %
   Fuel, ammunition & stores: 523 tons, 11.1 %
   Miscellaneous weights: 110 tons, 2.3 %

Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
   Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
     4,038 lbs / 1,831 Kg = 37.4 x 6.0 " / 152 mm shells or 0.8 torpedoes
   Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1.07
   Metacentric height 1.7 ft / 0.5 m
   Roll period: 14.5 seconds
   Steadiness   - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 69 %
         - Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0.41
   Seaboat quality  (Average = 1.00): 1.17

Hull form characteristics:
   Hull has low quarterdeck
   Block coefficient: 0.500
   Length to Beam Ratio: 8.58 : 1
   'Natural speed' for length: 19.65 kts
   Power going to wave formation at top speed: 62 %
   Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 59
   Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): 20.00 degrees
   Stern overhang: 0.00 ft / 0.00 m
   Freeboard (% = measuring location as a percentage of overall length):
      - Stem:      18.00 ft / 5.49 m
      - Forecastle (20 %):   18.00 ft / 5.49 m
      - Mid (50 %):      18.00 ft / 5.49 m
      - Quarterdeck (15 %):   15.00 ft / 4.57 m (18.00 ft / 5.49 m before break)
      - Stern:      15.00 ft / 4.57 m
      - Average freeboard:   17.55 ft / 5.35 m
   Ship tends to be wet forward

Ship space, strength and comments:
   Space   - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 116.7 %
      - Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 99.9 %
   Waterplane Area: 11,573 Square feet or 1,075 Square metres
   Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 105 %
   Structure weight / hull surface area: 74 lbs/sq ft or 362 Kg/sq metre
   Hull strength (Relative):
      - Cross-sectional: 0.89
      - Longitudinal: 2.80
      - Overall: 1.00
   Hull space for machinery, storage, compartmentation is cramped
   Room for accommodation and workspaces is adequate

@TRD
I forgot about that  :-\
@P3D
I forgot that I changed the freeboard height to 18', fixed it now.

[P3D]

If you take 15' freeboard and 8' deck height, the belt would reach only 3' below the waterline.
Now, 4x6" guns are very weak firepower for 4000t.
Stability is getting into the marginal range.

What is the distribution of misc. weight? Do you have fire control? In the latter case 110t is not enough for torpedoes+FC+long/medium-range Wireless.


From whom you are buying oil? My guess would be the Dutch.

[The Rock Doctor]

6" guns of this period ought to be in deck mounts with hoists, rather than turrets.  Once you've made this switch, I'd guess that you would have enough hull strength left over to allow for a pair of adidtional 6" on the beams.

Note that your armor belts cover somewhat more of the ship's length that the "Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better)" figure indicates is necessary.  If you trim the length down a bit, that'll also free up hull strength for use in other ways.

[Logi]

Enter ship name, Enter country Enter ship type laid down 1914 (Engine 1912)

Displacement:
   4,146 t light; 4,305 t standard; 4,715 t normal; 5,043 t full load

Dimensions: Length overall / water x beam x draught
   392.55 ft / 386.00 ft x 45.00 ft x 19.00 ft (normal load)
   119.65 m / 117.65 m x 13.72 m  x 5.79 m

Armament:
      5 - 6.00" / 152 mm guns in single mounts, 108.00lbs / 48.99kg shells, 1914 Model
     Breech loading guns in deck mounts with hoists
     on centreline ends, majority aft, 2 raised mounts - superfiring
      2 - 3.00" / 76.2 mm guns in single mounts, 13.50lbs / 6.12kg shells, 1914 Model
     Anti-aircraft guns in deck mounts
     on side, all amidships
      4 - 0.50" / 12.7 mm guns in single mounts, 0.06lbs / 0.03kg shells, 1914 Model
     Machine guns in deck mounts
     on side, evenly spread
   Weight of broadside 567 lbs / 257 kg
   Shells per gun, main battery: 200
   5 - 21.0" / 533.4 mm above water torpedoes

Armour:
   - Belts:      Width (max)   Length (avg)      Height (avg)
   Main:   3.00" / 76 mm   295.00 ft / 89.92 m   10.00 ft / 3.05 m
   Ends:   Unarmoured
   Upper:   2.00" / 51 mm   295.00 ft / 89.92 m   5.00 ft / 1.52 m
     Main Belt covers 118 % of normal length
     Main belt does not fully cover magazines and engineering spaces

   - Gun armour:   Face (max)   Other gunhouse (avg)   Barbette/hoist (max)
   Main:   1.00" / 25 mm   1.00" / 25 mm      1.00" / 25 mm
   2nd:   1.00" / 25 mm   1.00" / 25 mm            -
   3rd:   0.25" / 6 mm         -               -

   - Armour deck: 1.00" / 25 mm, Conning tower: 3.00" / 76 mm

Machinery:
   Oil fired boilers, steam turbines,
   Direct drive, 2 shafts, 38,010 shp / 28,355 Kw = 28.00 kts
   Range 5,475nm at 12.00 kts
   Bunker at max displacement = 738 tons

Complement:
   283 - 369

Cost:
   £0.531 million / $2.122 million

Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
   Armament: 71 tons, 1.5 %
   Armour: 747 tons, 15.8 %
      - Belts: 484 tons, 10.3 %
      - Torpedo bulkhead: 0 tons, 0.0 %
      - Armament: 31 tons, 0.7 %
      - Armour Deck: 214 tons, 4.5 %
      - Conning Tower: 18 tons, 0.4 %
   Machinery: 1,516 tons, 32.1 %
   Hull, fittings & equipment: 1,603 tons, 34.0 %
   Fuel, ammunition & stores: 568 tons, 12.1 %
   Miscellaneous weights: 210 tons, 4.5 %

Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
   Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
     3,759 lbs / 1,705 Kg = 34.8 x 6.0 " / 152 mm shells or 0.8 torpedoes
   Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1.08
   Metacentric height 1.8 ft / 0.5 m
   Roll period: 14.3 seconds
   Steadiness   - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 70 %
         - Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0.48
   Seaboat quality  (Average = 1.00): 1.19

Hull form characteristics:
   Hull has low quarterdeck
   Block coefficient: 0.500
   Length to Beam Ratio: 8.58 : 1
   'Natural speed' for length: 19.65 kts
   Power going to wave formation at top speed: 62 %
   Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 59
   Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): 20.00 degrees
   Stern overhang: 0.00 ft / 0.00 m
   Freeboard (% = measuring location as a percentage of overall length):
      - Stem:      18.00 ft / 5.49 m
      - Forecastle (20 %):   18.00 ft / 5.49 m
      - Mid (50 %):      18.00 ft / 5.49 m
      - Quarterdeck (15 %):   15.00 ft / 4.57 m (18.00 ft / 5.49 m before break)
      - Stern:      15.00 ft / 4.57 m
      - Average freeboard:   17.55 ft / 5.35 m
   Ship tends to be wet forward

Ship space, strength and comments:
   Space   - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 121.1 %
      - Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 112.4 %
   Waterplane Area: 11,573 Square feet or 1,075 Square metres
   Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 103 %
   Structure weight / hull surface area: 74 lbs/sq ft or 361 Kg/sq metre
   Hull strength (Relative):
      - Cross-sectional: 0.88
      - Longitudinal: 2.86
      - Overall: 1.00
   Hull space for machinery, storage, compartmentation is cramped
   Room for accommodation and workspaces is adequate
   Ship has slow, easy roll, a good, steady gun platform

Misc. Weight is distributed as:
100t FC
25t Long Range Wireless
25t Flag Facilities
60t Torpedoes (30) [1913]

@P3D
Buying oil? China produces about 3.5 million barrels of oil a day, more than alot of countries.

@TRD
I forgot that I changed the guns to 6". Gee... I forget alot of things....  :-[

Edit: Oh yea... When am I going to get the info about South China, I need it to finish my report...

[P3D]

@P3D
Buying oil? China produces about 3.5 million barrels of oil a day, more than alot of countries.

The largest and most easily exploitable oilfields are in Manchuria, currently belonging to Japan. Japan was investigating oil seepage before WWII, but could not find oil there before WWII (discovery 1959). Hardly anything to the South save the oilfield at the Jangtze delta, discovered in 1961.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Category:Oil_fields_of_China
http://images.google.com/images?hl=en&q=china%20oilfields&um=1&ie=UTF-8&sa=N&tab=wi

[Logi]

bah! I didn't look up the dates thatt the fields were discovered :( Well then I suppose I would be buying the oil.

[Kaiser Kirk]

7" is too large for deck mounting.
There's no reason I see to have a 5' upper belt. Why would you protect 5' of the ~8' deck height?

The Devonshire and Hawkins classes  featured 7.5" guns in simple center pivot mounts.  Admittedly they were not the best and Hawkins had a 10hp electric assist, but turrets were not requisite.

[Guinness]

There are also more than a few 7.5" armed ships using mounts with hoists running about the Nverse, including the three ships of the Confederate Hatchitigbee class.