Dutch Replacements

[Korpen]

As Boyrs said we who had allot of obsolete ships could lay down some replacements using half our BP in the period 1901-1905.
I have taken that quite literary, and basically laid down one-for-one replacements of most of the ships getting obsolete in that period (20years for BB/AC, 15 for cruisers and 12 for Destroyers/TBs).
So 01-05 is five years, giving me 57,5BP to play with (115/2).
I have not been very exact with what was laid down were and when, but used the earliest possible year. This is because i have enough slips to pretty much lay down all the replacements at the same time.

The ships involved
3 Armoured frigates of Willem van der Zaan-class (8400ton x3) 25,2 BP: Replacing 3 Evertsen class armoured frigates.
4  Sloops of War, á 4000tons (16BP): Replacing 4 van Nassaun Class sloops.
23 E-class Torpedboots á 700 ton (16,1 BP): Replacing 24 B-class TBs
For a total of 57,3 BPs used.

About 10 of the TBs will be built in Singapore and Batavia, and one AC will also be built in Singapore (witch happens to be my 2nd largest port).

[Korpen]

Hr.Ms. Willem van der Zaan, The Netherlands Armoured frigate laid down 1904 (Engine 1905)

Displacement:
   8 600 t light; 9 050 t standard; 10 434 t normal; 11 541 t full load

Dimensions: Length overall / water x beam x draught
   406,82 ft / 406,82 ft x 59,06 ft x 24,93 ft (normal load)
   124,00 m / 124,00 m x 18,00 m  x 7,60 m

Armament:
      4 - 9,45" / 240 mm guns (2x2 guns), 418,88lbs / 190,00kg shells, 1904 Model
     Breech loading guns in turrets (on barbettes)
     on centreline ends, evenly spread
      4 - 9,45" / 240 mm guns in single mounts, 418,88lbs / 190,00kg shells, 1904 Model
     Breech loading guns in turrets (on barbettes)
     on side ends, evenly spread
      10 - 5,91" / 150 mm guns in single mounts, 99,21lbs / 45,00kg shells, 1904 Model
     Breech loading guns in casemate mounts
     on side, evenly spread
     4 guns in hull casemates - Limited use in all but light seas
      6 - 3,46" / 88,0 mm guns in single mounts, 19,84lbs / 9,00kg shells, 1904 Model
     Quick firing guns in deck mounts
     on side, evenly spread, all raised mounts
   Weight of broadside 4 462 lbs / 2 024 kg
   Shells per gun, main battery: 90
   2 - 17,7" / 450 mm submerged torpedo tubes

Armour:
   - Belts:      Width (max)   Length (avg)      Height (avg)
   Main:   7,68" / 195 mm   260,83 ft / 79,50 m   9,84 ft / 3,00 m
   Ends:   3,07" / 78 mm   144,36 ft / 44,00 m   8,20 ft / 2,50 m
     1,64 ft / 0,50 m Unarmoured ends
   Upper:   4,13" / 105 mm   260,83 ft / 79,50 m   8,01 ft / 2,44 m
     Main Belt covers 99 % of normal length

   - Gun armour:   Face (max)   Other gunhouse (avg)   Barbette/hoist (max)
   Main:   8,27" / 210 mm   4,13" / 105 mm      6,18" / 157 mm
   2nd:   8,27" / 210 mm   4,13" / 105 mm      6,18" / 157 mm
   3rd:   4,13" / 105 mm         -               -

   - Armour deck: 2,05" / 52 mm, Conning tower: 6,18" / 157 mm

Machinery:
   Coal and oil fired boilers, steam turbines,
   Direct drive, 4 shafts, 20 000 shp / 14 920 Kw = 20,92 kts
   Range 6 000nm at 12,00 kts
   Bunker at max displacement = 2 491 tons (90% coal)

Complement:
   516 - 671

Cost:
   £1,008 million / $4,030 million

Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
   Armament: 566 tons, 5,4 %
   Armour: 2 977 tons, 28,5 %
      - Belts: 1 369 tons, 13,1 %
      - Torpedo bulkhead: 0 tons, 0,0 %
      - Armament: 873 tons, 8,4 %
      - Armour Deck: 672 tons, 6,4 %
      - Conning Tower: 64 tons, 0,6 %
   Machinery: 1 650 tons, 15,8 %
   Hull, fittings & equipment: 3 106 tons, 29,8 %
   Fuel, ammunition & stores: 1 834 tons, 17,6 %
   Miscellaneous weights: 300 tons, 2,9 %

Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
   Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
     9 043 lbs / 4 102 Kg = 21,4 x 9,4 " / 240 mm shells or 1,4 torpedoes
   Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1,08
   Metacentric height 2,6 ft / 0,8 m
   Roll period: 15,3 seconds
   Steadiness   - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 53 %
         - Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0,70
   Seaboat quality  (Average = 1.00): 1,08

Hull form characteristics:
   Hull has rise forward of midbreak
   Block coefficient: 0,610
   Length to Beam Ratio: 6,89 : 1
   'Natural speed' for length: 20,17 kts
   Power going to wave formation at top speed: 53 %
   Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 49
   Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): 0,00 degrees
   Stern overhang: 0,00 ft / 0,00 m
   Freeboard (% = measuring location as a percentage of overall length):
      - Stem:      19,69 ft / 6,00 m
      - Forecastle (15 %):   19,69 ft / 6,00 m
      - Mid (30 %):      19,69 ft / 6,00 m (11,48 ft / 3,50 m aft of break)
      - Quarterdeck (15 %):   11,48 ft / 3,50 m
      - Stern:      11,48 ft / 3,50 m
      - Average freeboard:   13,94 ft / 4,25 m
   Ship tends to be wet forward

Ship space, strength and comments:
   Space   - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 98,0 %
      - Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 86,7 %
   Waterplane Area: 17 730 Square feet or 1 647 Square metres
   Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 94 %
   Structure weight / hull surface area: 114 lbs/sq ft or 557 Kg/sq metre
   Hull strength (Relative):
      - Cross-sectional: 0,93
      - Longitudinal: 1,85
      - Overall: 1,00
   Hull space for machinery, storage, compartmentation is adequate
   Room for accommodation and workspaces is cramped

[Korpen]

(Picture comming as soon as i am finished with it..)
Borneo, Nederländerna Sloop of war laid down 1901 (Engine 1905)

Displacement:
   4 000 t light; 4 155 t standard; 5 048 t normal; 5 763 t full load

Dimensions: Length overall / water x beam x draught
   360,89 ft / 360,89 ft x 45,93 ft x 20,34 ft (normal load)
   110,00 m / 110,00 m x 14,00 m  x 6,20 m

Armament:
      2 - 5,91" / 150 mm guns in single mounts, 99,21lbs / 45,00kg shells, 1901 Model
     Breech loading guns in deck mounts with hoists
     on centreline ends, evenly spread
      4 - 5,91" / 150 mm guns in single mounts, 99,21lbs / 45,00kg shells, 1901 Model
     Breech loading guns in deck mounts with hoists
     on side, all amidships
      6 - 3,46" / 88,0 mm guns in single mounts, 20,79lbs / 9,43kg shells, 1901 Model
     Quick firing guns in deck mounts
     on side, evenly spread, all raised mounts
      8 - 0,31" / 8,0 mm guns in single mounts, 0,02lbs / 0,01kg shells, 1901 Model
     Machine guns in deck mounts
     on side, evenly spread, all raised mounts
   Weight of broadside 720 lbs / 327 kg
   Shells per gun, main battery: 118
   4 - 17,7" / 450 mm submerged torpedo tubes

Armour:
   - Belts:      Width (max)   Length (avg)      Height (avg)
   Main:   3,72" / 95 mm   308,40 ft / 94,00 m   9,19 ft / 2,80 m
   Ends:   Unarmoured
     Main Belt covers 131 % of normal length

   - Gun armour:   Face (max)   Other gunhouse (avg)   Barbette/hoist (max)
   Main:   2,07" / 53 mm         -         0,98" / 25 mm
   2nd:   2,07" / 53 mm         -         0,98" / 25 mm
   3rd:   0,79" / 20 mm         -               -

   - Armour deck: 1,97" / 50 mm, Conning tower: 0,98" / 25 mm

Machinery:
   Coal and oil fired boilers, steam turbines,
   Direct drive, 4 shafts, 19 947 shp / 14 880 Kw = 23,38 kts
   Range 6 000nm at 12,00 kts
   Bunker at max displacement = 1 608 tons (90% coal)

Complement:
   299 - 389

Cost:
   £0,448 million / $1,794 million

Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
   Armament: 93 tons, 1,8 %
   Armour: 896 tons, 17,7 %
      - Belts: 426 tons, 8,4 %
      - Torpedo bulkhead: 0 tons, 0,0 %
      - Armament: 52 tons, 1,0 %
      - Armour Deck: 411 tons, 8,1 %
      - Conning Tower: 6 tons, 0,1 %
   Machinery: 1 646 tons, 32,6 %
   Hull, fittings & equipment: 1 355 tons, 26,8 %
   Fuel, ammunition & stores: 1 048 tons, 20,8 %
   Miscellaneous weights: 10 tons, 0,2 %

Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
   Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
     3 157 lbs / 1 432 Kg = 30,7 x 5,9 " / 150 mm shells or 0,7 torpedoes
   Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1,45
   Metacentric height 3,0 ft / 0,9 m
   Roll period: 11,2 seconds
   Steadiness   - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 54 %
         - Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0,23
   Seaboat quality  (Average = 1.00): 1,08

Hull form characteristics:
   Hull has a flush deck
   Block coefficient: 0,524
   Length to Beam Ratio: 7,86 : 1
   'Natural speed' for length: 19,00 kts
   Power going to wave formation at top speed: 57 %
   Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 50
   Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): 0,00 degrees
   Stern overhang: 0,00 ft / 0,00 m
   Freeboard (% = measuring location as a percentage of overall length):
      - Stem:      16,40 ft / 5,00 m
      - Forecastle (20 %):   12,47 ft / 3,80 m
      - Mid (50 %):      12,47 ft / 3,80 m
      - Quarterdeck (15 %):   12,47 ft / 3,80 m
      - Stern:      12,47 ft / 3,80 m
      - Average freeboard:   12,78 ft / 3,90 m
   Ship tends to be wet forward

Ship space, strength and comments:
   Space   - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 131,3 %
      - Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 89,7 %
   Waterplane Area: 11 291 Square feet or 1 049 Square metres
   Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 102 %
   Structure weight / hull surface area: 73 lbs/sq ft or 356 Kg/sq metre
   Hull strength (Relative):
      - Cross-sectional: 0,93
      - Longitudinal: 1,80
      - Overall: 1,00
   Hull space for machinery, storage, compartmentation is cramped
   Room for accommodation and workspaces is cramped

[Korpen]

E-Class, Nederländsk Torpedbåt laid down 1902 (Engine 1905)

Displacement:
   700 t light; 722 t standard; 810 t normal; 881 t full load

Dimensions: Length overall / water x beam x draught
   229,66 ft / 229,66 ft x 26,25 ft x 10,50 ft (normal load)
   70,00 m / 70,00 m x 8,00 m  x 3,20 m

Armament:
      1 - 4,72" / 120 mm guns in single mounts, 46,30lbs / 21,00kg shells, 1902 Model
     Quick firing gun in deck mount
     on centreline forward, 1 raised gun
      2 - 3,46" / 88,0 mm guns in single mounts, 19,84lbs / 9,00kg shells, 1902 Model
     Quick firing guns in deck mounts
     on centreline, all aft, 1 raised mount
      4 - 0,31" / 8,0 mm guns in single mounts, 0,02lbs / 0,01kg shells, 1902 Model
     Machine guns in deck mounts
     on side, evenly spread, all raised mounts
   Weight of broadside 86 lbs / 39 kg
   Shells per gun, main battery: 90
   4 - 17,7" / 450 mm above water torpedoes

Armour:
   - Gun armour:   Face (max)   Other gunhouse (avg)   Barbette/hoist (max)
   Main:   0,39" / 10 mm         -               -

Machinery:
   Coal and oil fired boilers, steam turbines,
   Direct drive, 3 shafts, 14 750 shp / 11 004 Kw = 27,42 kts
   Range 1 700nm at 12,00 kts
   Bunker at max displacement = 159 tons (90% coal)
     Caution: Delicate, lightweight machinery

Complement:
   75 - 98

Cost:
   £0,100 million / $0,400 million

Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
   Armament: 12 tons, 1,5 %
   Armour: 1 tons, 0,1 %
      - Belts: 0 tons, 0,0 %
      - Torpedo bulkhead: 0 tons, 0,0 %
      - Armament: 1 tons, 0,1 %
      - Armour Deck: 0 tons, 0,0 %
      - Conning Tower: 0 tons, 0,0 %
   Machinery: 468 tons, 57,7 %
   Hull, fittings & equipment: 214 tons, 26,4 %
   Fuel, ammunition & stores: 110 tons, 13,5 %
   Miscellaneous weights: 6 tons, 0,7 %

Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
   Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
     206 lbs / 93 Kg = 3,9 x 4,7 " / 120 mm shells or 0,2 torpedoes
   Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1,53
   Metacentric height 1,4 ft / 0,4 m
   Roll period: 9,4 seconds
   Steadiness   - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 54 %
         - Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0,16
   Seaboat quality  (Average = 1.00): 1,07

Hull form characteristics:
   Hull has rise forward of midbreak
   Block coefficient: 0,448
   Length to Beam Ratio: 8,75 : 1
   'Natural speed' for length: 15,15 kts
   Power going to wave formation at top speed: 71 %
   Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 50
   Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): 0,00 degrees
   Stern overhang: 0,00 ft / 0,00 m
   Freeboard (% = measuring location as a percentage of overall length):
      - Stem:      16,67 ft / 5,08 m
      - Forecastle (20 %):   16,40 ft / 5,00 m
      - Mid (53 %):      16,40 ft / 5,00 m (8,20 ft / 2,50 m aft of break)
      - Quarterdeck (15 %):   8,20 ft / 2,50 m
      - Stern:      8,20 ft / 2,50 m
      - Average freeboard:   12,57 ft / 3,83 m
   Ship tends to be wet forward

Ship space, strength and comments:
   Space   - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 197,8 %
      - Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 81,3 %
   Waterplane Area: 3 839 Square feet or 357 Square metres
   Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 32 %
   Structure weight / hull surface area: 25 lbs/sq ft or 124 Kg/sq metre
   Hull strength (Relative):
      - Cross-sectional: 0,50
      - Longitudinal: 3,37
      - Overall: 0,60
   Hull space for machinery, storage, compartmentation is cramped
   Room for accommodation and workspaces is cramped

[Borys]

Ahoj!
In anything but the camest seas the 120mm gun is not very useful.
Its effective ROF will be 2-3 rpm.
Open mount on lively, slippery hull, with separate ammunition = bad idea.

Hull width - 8 meters. You have the gun forward. is the hull at its full width here? Low block coeficient, so probably not. But maximum 4 meters from centrline to railing.

Gun - lenght c. 5,5m - trunnioned at one third of lenght. 1,8 metre sticks out, leaving just over 2 metres working area when shooting t the sides.

Look at the last photo and imagine them firing to the side of your ship.
http://www.navweaps.com/Weapons/WNBR_47-45_mk1.htm
Such a gun on such a ship IS possible, but effectiveness is low.

Borys

[Korpen]

Ahoj!
In anything but the camest seas the 120mm gun is not very useful.
Its effective ROF will be 2-3 rpm.
Open mount on lively, slippery hull, with separate ammunition = bad idea.

Hull width - 8 meters. You have the gun forward. is the hull at its full width here? Low block coeficient, so probably not. But maximum 4 meters from centrline to railing.

Gun - lenght c. 5,5m - trunnioned at one third of lenght. 1,8 metre sticks out, leaving just over 2 metres working area when shooting t the sides.

Look at the last photo and imagine them firing to the side of your ship.
http://www.navweaps.com/Weapons/WNBR_47-45_mk1.htm
Such a gun on such a ship IS possible, but effectiveness is low.

Borys

It is QF gun, so the ammunition is not separate.  QF increases the burst ROF but it slows down the sustained ROF.
And i don't really see what the problem is, the ships you point to are only about 1m wider, and have no higher block coefficient.
Also the gun is raised to keep it away from as much sea as possible, and there is some misc misc eight that more then cover the weight of a large platform around the gun.
So i would guess on around 12 round the first minute of fire, and slacking of after that.
But after looking a bit more on destroyer gun, i will add a small shield and drop the shell weight a bit.

[P3D]

3.2m draught is a lot for such a small ship.

[Korpen]

3.2m draught is a lot for such a small ship.

Sure, but not un-heard of, most destroyers in the same size category i find has around 3m draught.
So she is deep, but  not outside the realm of possibillity.
And i intend to design another class for island partoling in the HOI, she is a bit too deep (and short ranged) for that.
But that will wait untill we start 1906. :)

[Desertfox]

My original destroyers had draughts of 15+ feet! Thats one of the things Im going to fix here.