An attempt at a Destroyer leader

[ctwaterman]

IMS Sealion, Italia Small PC laid down 1913 (Engine 1912)

Displacement:
   2,127 t light; 2,194 t standard; 2,322 t normal; 2,425 t full load

Dimensions: Length overall / water x beam x draught
   361.55 ft / 352.00 ft x 34.60 ft x 14.20 ft (normal load)
   110.20 m / 107.29 m x 10.55 m  x 4.33 m

Armament:
      4 - 5.00" / 127 mm guns in single mounts, 62.50lbs / 28.35kg shells, 1913 Model
     Breech loading guns in deck mounts
     on centreline ends, evenly spread, 2 raised mounts - superfiring
      6 - 3.00" / 76.2 mm guns in single mounts, 13.50lbs / 6.12kg shells, 1913 Model
     Quick firing guns in casemate mounts
     on side, all aft
     6 guns in hull casemates - Limited use in any sea
      4 - 0.75" / 19.1 mm guns in single mounts, 0.21lbs / 0.10kg shells, 1913 Model
     Breech loading guns in deck mounts
     on side, evenly spread, all raised mounts
   Weight of broadside 332 lbs / 151 kg
   Shells per gun, main battery: 100
   9 - 21.0" / 533.4 mm above water torpedoes

Armour:
   - Gun armour:   Face (max)   Other gunhouse (avg)   Barbette/hoist (max)
   Main:   1.00" / 25 mm         -               -
   2nd:   1.00" / 25 mm         -               -

Machinery:
   Oil fired boilers, steam turbines,
   Direct drive, 2 shafts, 32,996 shp / 24,615 Kw = 30.07 kts
   Range 2,500nm at 12.00 kts
   Bunker at max displacement = 231 tons

Complement:
   166 - 217

Cost:
   £0.293 million / $1.171 million

Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
   Armament: 41 tons, 1.8 %
   Armour: 20 tons, 0.9 %
      - Belts: 0 tons, 0.0 %
      - Torpedo bulkhead: 0 tons, 0.0 %
      - Armament: 20 tons, 0.9 %
      - Armour Deck: 0 tons, 0.0 %
      - Conning Tower: 0 tons, 0.0 %
   Machinery: 1,137 tons, 48.9 %
   Hull, fittings & equipment: 861 tons, 37.1 %
   Fuel, ammunition & stores: 195 tons, 8.4 %
   Miscellaneous weights: 68 tons, 2.9 %

Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
   Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
     930 lbs / 422 Kg = 14.9 x 5.0 " / 127 mm shells or 0.3 torpedoes
   Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1.15
   Metacentric height 1.3 ft / 0.4 m
   Roll period: 12.6 seconds
   Steadiness   - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 68 %
         - Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0.25
   Seaboat quality  (Average = 1.00): 1.01

Hull form characteristics:
   Hull has rise forward of midbreak
   Block coefficient: 0.470
   Length to Beam Ratio: 10.17 : 1
   'Natural speed' for length: 18.76 kts
   Power going to wave formation at top speed: 64 %
   Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 67
   Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): 23.00 degrees
   Stern overhang: 0.00 ft / 0.00 m
   Freeboard (% = measuring location as a percentage of overall length):
      - Stem:      22.50 ft / 6.86 m
      - Forecastle (14 %):   20.00 ft / 6.10 m
      - Mid (37 %):      18.00 ft / 5.49 m (10.80 ft / 3.29 m aft of break)
      - Quarterdeck (7 %):   10.80 ft / 3.29 m
      - Stern:      10.80 ft / 3.29 m
      - Average freeboard:   14.11 ft / 4.30 m

Ship space, strength and comments:
   Space   - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 174.5 %
      - Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 58.7 %
   Waterplane Area: 7,901 Square feet or 734 Square metres
   Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 76 %
   Structure weight / hull surface area: 56 lbs/sq ft or 275 Kg/sq metre
   Hull strength (Relative):
      - Cross-sectional: 0.90
      - Longitudinal: 2.52
      - Overall: 1.00
   Hull space for machinery, storage, compartmentation is cramped
   Room for accommodation and workspaces is cramped

25T Destroyer Fire Control
25T Wire Less
18T EIther 9 or 18 Torpedoes

[Borys]

The 13 pounders are useless.

Are you trying to emulate the SMS Spaun class?

[maddox]

The 70mm in hull casemates are a waste of weight and space.

I would try to get 1 or 2 127mm guns extra, in place of the 6 70mm and the 4 machine gun nests.

Her job is to get the torpedo's launched, not tickle the enemy with 70mm pop guns.

The crew is going to hate her, as she ain't big on crew comfort, but hey, who knows, an elite ship crewed by short men.

IMS Walrus, Italian Destroyer leader laid down 1912

Displacement:
   2.957 t light; 3.049 t standard; 3.419 t normal; 3.714 t full load

Dimensions: Length overall / water x beam x draught
   393,66 ft / 385,50 ft x 39,37 ft x 14,76 ft (normal load)
   119,99 m / 117,50 m x 12,00 m  x 4,50 m

Armament:
      5 - 5,00" / 127 mm guns in single mounts, 57,32lbs / 26,00kg shells, 1912 Model
     Quick firing guns in deck mounts
     on centreline ends, majority forward, 1 raised mount
      2 - 1,00" / 25,4 mm guns in single mounts, 0,50lbs / 0,23kg shells, 1912 Model
     Machine guns in deck mounts
     on centreline, all amidships, 1 raised mount
   Weight of broadside 288 lbs / 130 kg
   Shells per gun, main battery: 150
   9 - 21,0" / 533,4 mm above water torpedoes

Armour:
   - Gun armour:   Face (max)   Other gunhouse (avg)   Barbette/hoist (max)
   Main:   1,00" / 25 mm         -               -

Machinery:
   Oil fired boilers, steam turbines,
   Direct drive, 4 shafts, 41.364 shp / 30.857 Kw = 30,00 kts
   Range 6.000nm at 12,00 kts
   Bunker at max displacement = 665 tons

Complement:
   223 - 290

Cost:
   £0,362 million / $1,447 million

Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
   Armament: 39 tons, 1,1%
   Armour: 14 tons, 0,4%
      - Belts: 0 tons, 0,0%
      - Torpedo bulkhead: 0 tons, 0,0%
      - Armament: 14 tons, 0,4%
      - Armour Deck: 0 tons, 0,0%
      - Conning Tower: 0 tons, 0,0%
   Machinery: 1.609 tons, 47,1%
   Hull, fittings & equipment: 1.226 tons, 35,9%
   Fuel, ammunition & stores: 462 tons, 13,5%
   Miscellaneous weights: 68 tons, 2,0%

Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
   Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
     1.762 lbs / 799 Kg = 28,2 x 5,0 " / 127 mm shells or 0,5 torpedoes
   Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1,30
   Metacentric height 2,0 ft / 0,6 m
   Roll period: 11,8 seconds
   Steadiness   - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 71 %
         - Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0,15
   Seaboat quality  (Average = 1.00): 1,21

Hull form characteristics:
   Hull has a flush deck
   Block coefficient: 0,534
   Length to Beam Ratio: 9,79 : 1
   'Natural speed' for length: 19,63 kts
   Power going to wave formation at top speed: 65 %
   Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 59
   Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): 12,00 degrees
   Stern overhang: 3,28 ft / 1,00 m
   Freeboard (% = measuring location as a percentage of overall length):
      - Stem:      22,97 ft / 7,00 m
      - Forecastle (20%):   19,69 ft / 6,00 m
      - Mid (50%):      14,44 ft / 4,40 m
      - Quarterdeck (15%):   16,08 ft / 4,90 m
      - Stern:      16,40 ft / 5,00 m
      - Average freeboard:   17,09 ft / 5,21 m

Ship space, strength and comments:
   Space   - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 163,0%
      - Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 84,8%
   Waterplane Area: 10.435 Square feet or 969 Square metres
   Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 93%
   Structure weight / hull surface area: 61 lbs/sq ft or 296 Kg/sq metre
   Hull strength (Relative):
      - Cross-sectional: 0,89
      - Longitudinal: 2,80
      - Overall: 1,00
   Hull space for machinery, storage, compartmentation is cramped
   Room for accommodation and workspaces is cramped
   Ship has slow, easy roll, a good, steady gun platform
   Good seaboat, rides out heavy weather easily

[ctwaterman]

Thanks for the critique Im trying to figure out a force ballance for my new fleet view and then figure out how to fund it.... :'(

I was thinking that trying to bring the Destroyer leader in at just around 2000 Tons might be trying to squeeze the size a little to much

[Jefgte]

Casemate ship is an interresting idea but like wrote Maddox, not very good for a Destroyer.

Built casemate ship is certainly better for cruiser or coastal BB

http://www.navalism.org/index.php?topic=2459.0



Jef  ;)

[Borys]

The Omaha class used casemattes, to keep the weight down.
Borys

[Sachmle]

The Omaha class used casemattes, to keep the weight down.
Borys

Yes, and they universally sucked terribly. IMHO.