Fleet-Cruisers

[ledeper]

GUJARAT-Class, Baltic Confederation BCC laid down 1913 (Engine 1912)

Displacement:
   21.376 t light; 22.440 t standard; 24.300 t normal; 25.788 t full load

Dimensions: Length overall / water x beam x draught
   588,68 ft / 583,99 ft x 88,58 ft x 27,89 ft (normal load)
   179,43 m / 178,00 m x 27,00 m  x 8,50 m

Armament:
      9 - 12,00" / 305 mm guns (3x3 guns), 864,00lbs / 391,90kg shells, 1913 Model
     Breech loading guns in turrets (on barbettes)
     on centreline ends, majority forward, 1 raised mount - superfiring
      10 - 6,00" / 152 mm guns in single mounts, 108,00lbs / 48,99kg shells, 1913 Model
     Breech loading guns in casemate mounts
     on side, all amidships
      10 - 4,00" / 102 mm guns in single mounts, 32,00lbs / 14,51kg shells, 1913 Model
     Quick firing guns in deck mounts
     on side, evenly spread
      6 - 1,57" / 40,0 mm guns in single mounts, 1,95lbs / 0,89kg shells, 1913 Model
     Quick firing guns in deck mounts
     on side, evenly spread
   Weight of broadside 9.188 lbs / 4.167 kg
   Shells per gun, main battery: 110

Armour:
   - Belts:      Width (max)   Length (avg)      Height (avg)
   Main:   10,0" / 254 mm   379,59 ft / 115,70 m   11,29 ft / 3,44 m
   Ends:   Unarmoured
   Upper:   4,00" / 102 mm   379,59 ft / 115,70 m   8,00 ft / 2,44 m
     Main Belt covers 100 % of normal length

   - Gun armour:   Face (max)   Other gunhouse (avg)   Barbette/hoist (max)
   Main:   12,0" / 305 mm   6,00" / 152 mm      10,0" / 254 mm
   2nd:   2,00" / 51 mm   1,00" / 25 mm            -
   3rd:   0,50" / 13 mm         -               -
   4th:   0,50" / 13 mm         -               -

   - Armour deck: 4,00" / 102 mm, Conning tower: 10,00" / 254 mm

Machinery:
   Oil fired boilers, steam turbines,
   Electric motors, 4 shafts, 75.756 shp / 56.514 Kw = 26,50 kts
   Range 6.500nm at 14,00 kts
   Bunker at max displacement = 3.348 tons

Complement:
   973 - 1.265

Cost:
   £2,330 million / $9,320 million

Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
   Armament: 1.148 tons, 4,7 %
   Armour: 7.179 tons, 29,5 %
      - Belts: 2.397 tons, 9,9 %
      - Torpedo bulkhead: 0 tons, 0,0 %
      - Armament: 1.828 tons, 7,5 %
      - Armour Deck: 2.773 tons, 11,4 %
      - Conning Tower: 181 tons, 0,7 %
   Machinery: 3.021 tons, 12,4 %
   Hull, fittings & equipment: 9.028 tons, 37,2 %
   Fuel, ammunition & stores: 2.924 tons, 12,0 %
   Miscellaneous weights: 1.000 tons, 4,1 %

Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
   Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
     31.261 lbs / 14.180 Kg = 36,2 x 12,0 " / 305 mm shells or 3,1 torpedoes
   Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1,07
   Metacentric height 4,8 ft / 1,4 m
   Roll period: 17,1 seconds
   Steadiness   - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 61 %
         - Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0,70
   Seaboat quality  (Average = 1.00): 1,22

Hull form characteristics:
   Hull has low quarterdeck
   Block coefficient: 0,590
   Length to Beam Ratio: 6,59 : 1
   'Natural speed' for length: 24,17 kts
   Power going to wave formation at top speed: 56 %
   Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 50
   Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): 10,00 degrees
   Stern overhang: 0,00 ft / 0,00 m
   Freeboard (% = measuring location as a percentage of overall length):
      - Stem:      26,57 ft / 8,10 m
      - Forecastle (20 %):   22,97 ft / 7,00 m
      - Mid (50 %):      22,97 ft / 7,00 m
      - Quarterdeck (15 %):   19,69 ft / 6,00 m (22,97 ft / 7,00 m before break)
      - Stern:      19,69 ft / 6,00 m
      - Average freeboard:   22,76 ft / 6,94 m
   Ship tends to be wet forward

Ship space, strength and comments:
   Space   - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 80,9 %
      - Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 168,4 %
   Waterplane Area: 37.467 Square feet or 3.481 Square metres
   Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 104 %
   Structure weight / hull surface area: 165 lbs/sq ft or 808 Kg/sq metre
   Hull strength (Relative):
      - Cross-sectional: 0,93
      - Longitudinal: 1,95
      - Overall: 1,00
   Hull space for machinery, storage, compartmentation is excellent
   Room for accommodation and workspaces is excellent
   Good seaboat, rides out heavy weather easily

Misc Weight:
F.C. 250t
W/t 50t
"radar", listening dishes, 50t
Air-Condition:500t
Reserve:200t

[Guinness]

500t for air conditioning: I have no idea how much air conditioning would weigh in 1912, but I'm not sure I'd put it on a warship quite yet. Freon wasn't invented until 1928. Until then, AC plants ran on stuff like ammonia, propane, or methyl chloride. This isn't so much a problem for food refrigeration, but once you're talking about AC for a battlecruiser, it's going to be on-board in much larger quantities.  All of that stuff can be really toxic, so it would be a real hazard in interior compartments in battle, I'd think.

[P3D]

When will the BC build ships smaller than 20,000t? There's grumbling in the naval officer corps due to the lack of ANY command billet below Kapitan zur Zee rank.

That means in a few years the navy will have serious leadership issues.

[Sachmle]

Armour:
   - Belts:      Width (max)   Length (avg)      Height (avg)
   Main:   10,0" / 254 mm   379,59 ft / 115,70 m   11,29 ft / 3,44 m
   Ends:   Unarmoured
   Upper:   4,00" / 102 mm   379,59 ft / 115,70 m  8,00 ft / 2,44 m
     Main Belt covers 100 % of normal length

Freeboard (% = measuring location as a percentage of overall length):
      - Stem:      26,57 ft / 8,10 m
      - Forecastle (20 %):   22,97 ft / 7,00 m
      - Mid (50 %):      22,97 ft / 7,00 m
      - Quarterdeck (15 %):   19,69 ft / 6,00 m (22,97 ft / 7,00 m before break)
      - Stern:      19,69 ft / 6,00 m
      - Average freeboard:   22,76 ft / 6,94 m

Even if you start the upper belt at the quarterdeck freeboard you don't have enough height to reach the waterline, let alone underwater.
     8'upper
+11.29' main
----------------
19.29' Quaterdeck freeboard=19.69' means .40' above water exposed, plus all underwater. I suppose you could mean for the upper belt not to extend to the deck level, but then why have it?

[Borys]

Ahoj!
I always thought the Upper Belt is on top of the Main Belt?
Half of the MB is under water (?), so 5' 7,5" above the WL, plus 8' UB, thus 13' 7,5" above the WL  is armoured, leaving one deck unarmoured.

But the internal arangement is strange - the unarmoured deck is 284cm fore and amidships, and 184 cm aft. That 6'1" deck is NOT comfy.

The aftmost part of the top deck is off limits to Sachmle-size men :)

Borys

[Sachmle]

By "Sachmle-sized men" I presume you mean tall, not round.

[Sachmle]

And since when is the MB ALWAYS half under water. I've seen line drawing, blueprints, read info on ships, and alot of them barely have ANY MB below water. Some only have 4-5' of belt below water, but have a 14' belt. I always figure 6' is reasonable, that way you don't have to worry too much about the unarmored part of the hull sticking out in rough seas or at light load. Maybe I'm wrong.

[Borys]

By "Sachmle-sized men" I presume you mean tall, not round.

(very quickly)
YES! YES!

[Borys]

And since when is the MB ALWAYS half under water. I've seen line drawing, blueprints, read info on ships, and alot of them barely have ANY MB below water. Some only have 4-5' of belt below water, but have a 14' belt. I always figure 6' is reasonable, that way you don't have to worry too much about the unarmored part of the hull sticking out in rough seas or at light load. Maybe I'm wrong.

I've been told on several ship related boards that SS puts half of the MB below the WL.
Apparently the below text (looks like "find the G-spot" instructions to me, personally) says that.
I just took the other blokes' word for it.

The default height for the main belt and end belts is the lower of 1.2 x the square root of the beam or the estimated draught of the side of the ship amidships above the bilge radius based on the Keslen formula for Midship section area coefficient.

Borys

[Sachmle]

Actually, I think it's easier to find the G spot than figure that out. P3D's the resident "math genius" maybe he can explain in normal i.e. stupid people speak.

[ledeper]

GUJARAT-Class, Baltic Confederation  BCC laid down 1914 (Engine 1912)

Displacement:
   20.364 t light; 21.406 t standard; 23.200 t normal; 24.636 t full load

Dimensions: Length overall / water x beam x draught
   588,10 ft / 583,99 ft x 88,58 ft x 28,87 ft (normal load)
   179,25 m / 178,00 m x 27,00 m  x 8,80 m

Armament:
      9 - 12,00" / 305 mm guns (3x3 guns), 864,00lbs / 391,90kg shells, 1914 Model
     Breech loading guns in turrets (on barbettes)
     on centreline ends, majority forward, 1 raised mount - superfiring
      10 - 6,00" / 152 mm guns in single mounts, 108,00lbs / 48,99kg shells, 1914 Model
     Breech loading guns in casemate mounts
     on side, all amidships
      10 - 4,00" / 102 mm guns in single mounts, 32,00lbs / 14,51kg shells, 1914 Model
     Quick firing guns in deck mounts
     on side, evenly spread
      6 - 1,57" / 40,0 mm guns in single mounts, 1,95lbs / 0,89kg shells, 1914 Model
     Quick firing guns in deck mounts
     on side, evenly spread
   Weight of broadside 9.188 lbs / 4.167 kg
   Shells per gun, main battery: 110

Armour:
   - Belts:      Width (max)   Length (avg)      Height (avg)
   Main:   10,0" / 254 mm   379,59 ft / 115,70 m   12,01 ft / 3,66 m
   Ends:   Unarmoured
   Upper:   4,00" / 102 mm   379,59 ft / 115,70 m   8,01 ft / 2,44 m
     Main Belt covers 100 % of normal length

   - Gun armour:   Face (max)   Other gunhouse (avg)   Barbette/hoist (max)
   Main:   12,0" / 305 mm   6,00" / 152 mm      10,0" / 254 mm
   2nd:   2,00" / 51 mm   1,00" / 25 mm            -
   3rd:   0,50" / 13 mm         -               -
   4th:   0,50" / 13 mm         -               -

   - Armour deck: 4,00" / 102 mm, Conning tower: 10,00" / 254 mm

Machinery:
   Oil fired boilers, steam turbines,
   Electric motors, 4 shafts, 77.673 shp / 57.944 Kw = 27,00 kts
   Range 6.500nm at 14,00 kts
   Bunker at max displacement = 3.230 tons

Complement:
   939 - 1.221

Cost:
   £2,687 million / $10,747 million

Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
   Armament: 1.148 tons, 5,0 %
   Armour: 7.001 tons, 30,2 %
      - Belts: 2.508 tons, 10,8 %
      - Torpedo bulkhead: 0 tons, 0,0 %
      - Armament: 1.661 tons, 7,2 %
      - Armour Deck: 2.656 tons, 11,4 %
      - Conning Tower: 175 tons, 0,8 %
   Machinery: 3.097 tons, 13,3 %
   Hull, fittings & equipment: 8.518 tons, 36,7 %
   Fuel, ammunition & stores: 2.836 tons, 12,2 %
   Miscellaneous weights: 600 tons, 2,6 %

Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
   Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
     27.089 lbs / 12.287 Kg = 31,4 x 12,0 " / 305 mm shells or 2,9 torpedoes
   Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1,10
   Metacentric height 5,0 ft / 1,5 m
   Roll period: 16,6 seconds
   Steadiness   - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 54 %
         - Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0,56
   Seaboat quality  (Average = 1.00): 1,09

Hull form characteristics:
   Hull has a flush deck
   Block coefficient: 0,544
   Length to Beam Ratio: 6,59 : 1
   'Natural speed' for length: 24,17 kts
   Power going to wave formation at top speed: 55 %
   Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 50
   Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): 10,00 degrees
   Stern overhang: 0,00 ft / 0,00 m
   Freeboard (% = measuring location as a percentage of overall length):
      - Stem:      23,29 ft / 7,10 m
      - Forecastle (20 %):   19,69 ft / 6,00 m
      - Mid (50 %):      19,69 ft / 6,00 m
      - Quarterdeck (15 %):   19,69 ft / 6,00 m
      - Stern:      19,69 ft / 6,00 m
      - Average freeboard:   19,97 ft / 6,09 m
   Ship tends to be wet forward

Ship space, strength and comments:
   Space   - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 83,8 %
      - Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 143,3 %
   Waterplane Area: 35.889 Square feet or 3.334 Square metres
   Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 101 %
   Structure weight / hull surface area: 164 lbs/sq ft or 803 Kg/sq metre
   Hull strength (Relative):
      - Cross-sectional: 0,94
      - Longitudinal: 1,79
      - Overall: 1,00
   Hull space for machinery, storage, compartmentation is adequate
   Room for accommodation and workspaces is excellent

         Misc Weight:
F.C. 250t
W/t 50t
"radar", listening dishes, 50t
Reserve:250t

[Borys]

Looks better :)

But all in all, the ship is not very impressive:
Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1,10  - this is good

Steadiness   - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 54 % - not so exiting

Seaboat quality  (Average = 1.00): 1,09 - passable

Borys

[The Rock Doctor]

It's not bad, but as has been noted elsewhere, construction of additional light forces might be a better option.

[Sachmle]

I'm with Rocky. Building BB/ACs is fun, and they look nice when other nations dignitaries visit, but w/o some DDs and CLs to screen them they'll be expensive coral reefs if you ever have a real war w/ someone.

[Jefgte]

I agree too & more

I use a building plan year after year to have a balanced fleet.


Jef ;)