Iberia Patrol Cruiser (2,000 tons)

[P3D]

I don't know what good four 6" weapons would be...  sure it can hurt the larger protected cruisers, it's still not going to win.  I would rather have the higher rate of fire of the 120mm weapons vs. lighter targets and if I have any chance either way its going to be from the 6 torpedo's.  Might as well be more usefull vs. the TB's.

Part of the problem is I want to keep these things down to 120 meters in length otherwise I will need to upgrade my bases even more than already.  I could build a 3,500 ton design I am sure that could have some armor and the higher speed but... that would mean increasing the design size by 40% and would require increasing the size of my dry docks even more than I currently have to.

IMO you are less likely to run into a DD/TB on the oceans you have to patrol. In the med where running into DDs has a much larger chance, you could use DDs on patrol as well. That's where my preference for 6" comes from.
Or build the ship after merchant standards to spare BP?

[miketr]

I thought it was shot down on the use of Civilian Standard for the use of warships?

I could fit the four 150mm's on the 3,500 ton design in place of the twin 120's.  The broad side is about the same, four 100 lb shells or eight 50 lb shells.  If I want to riddle ships with fire, and something this small I think that's it's only course of action, then having the number of guns is a big thing. My own thought on big vs. small weapons is situation...  My larger cruisers have the 150mm guns.  Something this small I think calls for lighter guns that can fire more often.

At anyrate...  Any comment on the 3,500 ton design?  Good, bad, ugly?

Michael

[P3D]

If you want 5" guns, the smaller one.

And I dunno what is the current version of the rules. For patrol ships that'd make sense.

[Sachmle]

I like it, if the idea is to use the "rain of shells" technique. I wonder what one w/ battery of 105s instead of the mixed 120/75s would look like. THAT would be rain of shells.

[miketr]

If you want 5" guns, the smaller one.

And I dunno what is the current version of the rules. For patrol ships that'd make sense.

I dunno either...  For myself as I figure they might time to time face real combat just assume they not be built to that standard.

Any reason why the smaller over the larger?  The larger has armor, it has the space to fit fire control, it's a better seaboat, 25% more firepower and about the same speed.  28 knots vs. 28.5 knots.

Michael

[miketr]

I like it, if the idea is to use the "rain of shells" technique. I wonder what one w/ battery of 105s instead of the mixed 120/75s would look like. THAT would be rain of shells.

At some point the 75's will get replaced with AAA.  I think the 105's would but too light...  I might be able to get more speed... let me check...  I can create a uniform battery of fourteen 105's...  4x2 and 6x1.  But not enough composite strength to get any more speed out of it.  I just worry about deck space for anything larger than 75's on the flanks.


PC-1913-3.5K-c, Iberia Protected Cruiser laid down 1913 (Engine 1912)

Displacement:
   3,500 t light; 3,655 t standard; 3,930 t normal; 4,150 t full load

Dimensions: Length overall / water x beam x draught
   426.51 ft / 426.51 ft x 46.26 ft x 13.94 ft (normal load)
   130.00 m / 130.00 m x 14.10 m  x 4.25 m

Armament:
      8 - 4.13" / 105 mm guns (4x2 guns), 35.32lbs / 16.02kg shells, 1913 Model
     Breech loading guns in deck mounts with hoists
     on centreline ends, evenly spread, 2 raised mounts - superfiring
      6 - 4.13" / 105 mm guns in single mounts, 35.32lbs / 16.02kg shells, 1913 Model
     Breech loading guns in deck mounts with hoists
     on side, all amidships
      6 - 0.49" / 12.5 mm guns in single mounts, 0.06lbs / 0.03kg shells, 1913 Model
     Machine guns in deck mounts
     on side, evenly spread, all raised mounts
   Weight of broadside 495 lbs / 224 kg
   Shells per gun, main battery: 250
   6 - 20.0" / 508 mm above water torpedoes

Armour:
   - Belts:      Width (max)   Length (avg)      Height (avg)
   Main:   1.97" / 50 mm   338.91 ft / 103.30 m   7.84 ft / 2.39 m
   Ends:   Unarmoured
     Main Belt covers 122 % of normal length
     Main belt does not fully cover magazines and engineering spaces

   - Gun armour:   Face (max)   Other gunhouse (avg)   Barbette/hoist (max)
   Main:   0.98" / 25 mm         -               -
   2nd:   0.98" / 25 mm         -               -

   - Armour deck: 0.98" / 25 mm, Conning tower: 1.97" / 50 mm

Machinery:
   Oil fired boilers, steam turbines,
   Direct drive, 2 shafts, 32,060 shp / 23,916 Kw = 28.00 kts
   Range 5,900nm at 10.00 kts
   Bunker at max displacement = 496 tons

Complement:
   247 - 322

Cost:
   £0.386 million / $1.542 million

Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
   Armament: 62 tons, 1.6 %
   Armour: 491 tons, 12.5 %
      - Belts: 212 tons, 5.4 %
      - Torpedo bulkhead: 0 tons, 0.0 %
      - Armament: 28 tons, 0.7 %
      - Armour Deck: 239 tons, 6.1 %
      - Conning Tower: 11 tons, 0.3 %
   Machinery: 1,278 tons, 32.5 %
   Hull, fittings & equipment: 1,538 tons, 39.1 %
   Fuel, ammunition & stores: 430 tons, 10.9 %
   Miscellaneous weights: 131 tons, 3.3 %

Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
   Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
     3,602 lbs / 1,634 Kg = 102.0 x 4.1 " / 105 mm shells or 0.8 torpedoes
   Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1.20
   Metacentric height 2.2 ft / 0.7 m
   Roll period: 13.0 seconds
   Steadiness   - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 70 %
         - Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0.33
   Seaboat quality  (Average = 1.00): 1.20

Hull form characteristics:
   Hull has a flush deck
   Block coefficient: 0.500
   Length to Beam Ratio: 9.22 : 1
   'Natural speed' for length: 20.65 kts
   Power going to wave formation at top speed: 58 %
   Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 58
   Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): 0.00 degrees
   Stern overhang: 0.00 ft / 0.00 m
   Freeboard (% = measuring location as a percentage of overall length):
      - Stem:      21.33 ft / 6.50 m
      - Forecastle (20 %):   18.04 ft / 5.50 m
      - Mid (50 %):      15.09 ft / 4.60 m
      - Quarterdeck (15 %):   15.09 ft / 4.60 m
      - Stern:      14.76 ft / 4.50 m
      - Average freeboard:   16.36 ft / 4.99 m
   Ship tends to be wet forward

Ship space, strength and comments:
   Space   - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 122.2 %
      - Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 129.5 %
   Waterplane Area: 13,146 Square feet or 1,221 Square metres
   Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 107 %
   Structure weight / hull surface area: 72 lbs/sq ft or 351 Kg/sq metre
   Hull strength (Relative):
      - Cross-sectional: 0.94
      - Longitudinal: 1.68
      - Overall: 1.00
   Hull space for machinery, storage, compartmentation is cramped
   Room for accommodation and workspaces is excellent
   Ship has slow, easy roll, a good, steady gun platform
   Good seaboat, rides out heavy weather easily

Long range radio 25 tons, Six 20" torpedos (2x3) 6 tons and 100 tons construction reserve
 

[Sachmle]

Yeah, I see your point about deck space. Swinging the 105s around on the beam would be a problem on that width. I think you'd be better off w/ something between the 2.5k and 3.5k versions. Keep the deck, lose the belt and see if you get that 0.5kts back.

[P3D]

Any reason why the smaller over the larger?  The larger has armor, it has the space to fit fire control, it's a better seaboat, 25% more firepower and about the same speed.  28 knots vs. 28.5 knots.

Michael

Iberia needs numbers. The smaller ship can be used just as well against unarmed ships, have TTs against larger ships and as fast as any cruiser. Against destroyers of same tonnage it would lose, but the ship is not supposed to fight them.

Merchant standard rules, copied here allows such ships, apparently not changed since I last checked:

Cheap patrol ships/AMC/troop transports/CVE/etc. built to merchant standards.

The ships costs 1/4th of the total SS price to build. The Springsharp indicated weight of non-VTE machinery, armament and armor is to be paid from BP. Plus $ at rate of 1$ per 1000 tonnes of machinery, armament and armour.

So, if a 1000 tons merchant hull has 200 tons of armor, weapons and turbines included, the 200 tons (in this case 20%) of the indicated pricetag has to be paid from the military budget BP and $,
PLUS the 1/4$ of the Springsharp indicated pricetag for the ship.

Restrictions on merchant based warships.
No Torpedo bulkheads.
Armor not thicker than 1".
Single screw propelled.
Guns not larger than 6"
Hull strength 1.0 or higher.

And Borys also wants to get rid of the single screw criterion.

You need size for endurance and seakeeping not for tonnage, that's why merchant standard should be acceptable. If 25-26kts is enough for you.

Ship laid down 1912

A large patrol ship with 4x15cm and 25.8kts, cost 1.55BP and $2.8, built to merchant standards.

Displacement:
   2,582 t light; 2,712 t standard; 3,049 t normal; 3,319 t full load

Dimensions: Length overall / water x beam x draught
   393.70 ft / 393.70 ft x 36.09 ft x 14.76 ft (normal load)
   120.00 m / 120.00 m x 11.00 m  x 4.50 m

Armament:
      4 - 5.91" / 150 mm guns in single mounts, 102.98lbs / 46.71kg shells, 1912 Model
     Breech loading guns in deck mounts with hoists
     on centreline ends, evenly spread, 2 raised mounts - superfiring
   Weight of broadside 412 lbs / 187 kg
   Shells per gun, main battery: 300
   4 - 19.7" / 500 mm above water torpedoes

Armour:
   - Belts:      Width (max)   Length (avg)      Height (avg)
   Main:   0.98" / 25 mm   282.15 ft / 86.00 m   9.84 ft / 3.00 m
   Ends:   Unarmoured
     Main Belt covers 110 % of normal length
     Main belt does not fully cover magazines and engineering spaces

   - Gun armour:   Face (max)   Other gunhouse (avg)   Barbette/hoist (max)
   Main:   0.98" / 25 mm   0.39" / 10 mm            -

   - Armour deck: 0.98" / 25 mm, Conning tower: 0.98" / 25 mm

Machinery:
   Coal and oil fired boilers, steam turbines,
   Electric motors, 1 shaft, 20,238 shp / 15,098 Kw = 25.90 kts
   Range 5,000nm at 12.00 kts
   Bunker at max displacement = 607 tons (50% coal)

Complement:
   204 - 266

Cost:
   £0.252 million / $1.008 million

Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
   Armament: 51 tons, 1.7 %
   Armour: 294 tons, 9.7 %
      - Belts: 111 tons, 3.7 %
      - Torpedo bulkhead: 0 tons, 0.0 %
      - Armament: 11 tons, 0.4 %
      - Armour Deck: 167 tons, 5.5 %
      - Conning Tower: 4 tons, 0.1 %
   Machinery: 845 tons, 27.7 %
   Hull, fittings & equipment: 1,191 tons, 39.1 %
   Fuel, ammunition & stores: 467 tons, 15.3 %
   Miscellaneous weights: 200 tons, 6.6 %

Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
   Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
     3,026 lbs / 1,373 Kg = 29.4 x 5.9 " / 150 mm shells or 0.7 torpedoes
   Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1.12
   Metacentric height 1.3 ft / 0.4 m
   Roll period: 13.1 seconds
   Steadiness   - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 80 %
         - Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0.75
   Seaboat quality  (Average = 1.00): 1.77

Hull form characteristics:
   Hull has rise forward of midbreak
   Block coefficient: 0.509
   Length to Beam Ratio: 10.91 : 1
   'Natural speed' for length: 19.84 kts
   Power going to wave formation at top speed: 54 %
   Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 45
   Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): 0.00 degrees
   Stern overhang: 0.00 ft / 0.00 m
   Freeboard (% = measuring location as a percentage of overall length):
      - Stem:      22.97 ft / 7.00 m
      - Forecastle (15 %):   21.33 ft / 6.50 m
      - Mid (35 %):      21.33 ft / 6.50 m (13.12 ft / 4.00 m aft of break)
      - Quarterdeck (15 %):   13.12 ft / 4.00 m
      - Stern:      13.12 ft / 4.00 m
      - Average freeboard:   16.09 ft / 4.91 m

Ship space, strength and comments:
   Space   - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 111.5 %
      - Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 110.1 %
   Waterplane Area: 9,187 Square feet or 854 Square metres
   Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 117 %
   Structure weight / hull surface area: 62 lbs/sq ft or 301 Kg/sq metre
   Hull strength (Relative):
      - Cross-sectional: 0.90
      - Longitudinal: 2.66
      - Overall: 1.00
   Hull space for machinery, storage, compartmentation is cramped
   Room for accommodation and workspaces is adequate
   Ship has slow, easy roll, a good, steady gun platform
   Excellent seaboat, comfortable, can fire her guns in the heaviest weather

[Borys]

Ahoj!
As concerns the single screw - it seemed a good idea at that time :)
And is IMO fine for tenders, coaliers, tankers, crane ships, etc.
But fast troopships, similar in design to passanger liners, have to be with mutliple screws ...

Borys

[miketr]

Max speed design for the 3,500 tons... of course it has no armor at all...

PC-1913-3.5K-d, Iberia Protected Cruiser laid down 1913 (Engine 1912)

Displacement:
   3,500 t light; 3,647 t standard; 3,930 t normal; 4,157 t full load

Dimensions: Length overall / water x beam x draught
   426.51 ft / 426.51 ft x 46.26 ft x 13.94 ft (normal load)
   130.00 m / 130.00 m x 14.10 m  x 4.25 m

Armament:
      8 - 4.72" / 120 mm guns (4x2 guns), 52.72lbs / 23.91kg shells, 1913 Model
     Breech loading guns in deck mounts with hoists
     on centreline ends, evenly spread, 2 raised mounts - superfiring
      4 - 2.95" / 75.0 mm guns in single mounts, 12.87lbs / 5.84kg shells, 1913 Model
     Breech loading guns in deck mounts
     on side, all amidships
      6 - 0.49" / 12.5 mm guns in single mounts, 0.06lbs / 0.03kg shells, 1913 Model
     Machine guns in deck mounts
     on side, evenly spread, all raised mounts
   Weight of broadside 474 lbs / 215 kg
   Shells per gun, main battery: 250
   6 - 20.0" / 508 mm above water torpedoes

Armour:
   - Gun armour:   Face (max)   Other gunhouse (avg)   Barbette/hoist (max)
   Main:   0.98" / 25 mm         -               -
   2nd:   0.98" / 25 mm         -               -

   - Conning tower: 1.97" / 50 mm

Machinery:
   Oil fired boilers, steam turbines,
   Direct drive, 2 shafts, 40,000 shp / 29,840 Kw = 29.55 kts
   Range 6,080nm at 10.00 kts
   Bunker at max displacement = 510 tons

Complement:
   247 - 322

Cost:
   £0.431 million / $1.726 million

Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
   Armament: 59 tons, 1.5 %
   Armour: 34 tons, 0.9 %
      - Belts: 0 tons, 0.0 %
      - Torpedo bulkhead: 0 tons, 0.0 %
      - Armament: 24 tons, 0.6 %
      - Armour Deck: 0 tons, 0.0 %
      - Conning Tower: 11 tons, 0.3 %
   Machinery: 1,595 tons, 40.6 %
   Hull, fittings & equipment: 1,633 tons, 41.5 %
   Fuel, ammunition & stores: 430 tons, 10.9 %
   Miscellaneous weights: 179 tons, 4.6 %

Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
   Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
     2,560 lbs / 1,161 Kg = 48.5 x 4.7 " / 120 mm shells or 0.6 torpedoes
   Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1.20
   Metacentric height 2.2 ft / 0.7 m
   Roll period: 13.1 seconds
   Steadiness   - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 71 %
         - Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0.33
   Seaboat quality  (Average = 1.00): 1.22

Hull form characteristics:
   Hull has a flush deck
   Block coefficient: 0.500
   Length to Beam Ratio: 9.22 : 1
   'Natural speed' for length: 20.65 kts
   Power going to wave formation at top speed: 61 %
   Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 58
   Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): 0.00 degrees
   Stern overhang: 0.00 ft / 0.00 m
   Freeboard (% = measuring location as a percentage of overall length):
      - Stem:      22.15 ft / 6.75 m
      - Forecastle (20 %):   19.69 ft / 6.00 m
      - Mid (50 %):      16.40 ft / 5.00 m
      - Quarterdeck (15 %):   16.40 ft / 5.00 m
      - Stern:      16.40 ft / 5.00 m
      - Average freeboard:   17.75 ft / 5.41 m
   Ship tends to be wet forward

Ship space, strength and comments:
   Space   - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 148.6 %
      - Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 140.9 %
   Waterplane Area: 13,146 Square feet or 1,221 Square metres
   Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 101 %
   Structure weight / hull surface area: 72 lbs/sq ft or 353 Kg/sq metre
   Hull strength (Relative):
      - Cross-sectional: 0.91
      - Longitudinal: 2.15
      - Overall: 1.00
   Hull space for machinery, storage, compartmentation is cramped
   Room for accommodation and workspaces is excellent
   Ship has slow, easy roll, a good, steady gun platform
   Good seaboat, rides out heavy weather easily

Long range radio 25 tons, Six 20" torpedos (2x3) 6 tons and 146 tons construction reserve

[Borys]

Frankly, I don't like either of these designs.
I believe that 27 knots is enough to catch the raier or run away from it - a stern chase is a long chase, and raiders are not likely to spend lots of coal/oil on chasing shadowing cruisers.
For 3500 tonnes a slightly smaller version of the current KKK cruiser should do. OK - I got her down to 3700. And this is with 1909 engines

Displacement:
   3 730 t light; 3 860 t standard; 4 295 t normal; 4 643 t full load

Dimensions: Length overall / water x beam x draught
   380,00 ft / 380,00 ft x 44,00 ft x 18,50 ft (normal load)
   115,82 m / 115,82 m x 13,41 m  x 5,64 m

Armament:
      5 - 6,00" / 152 mm guns in single mounts, 100,00lbs / 45,36kg shells, 1908 Model
     Breech loading guns in deck mounts with hoists
     on side, evenly spread
      4 - 0,43" / 11,0 mm guns in single mounts, 0,04lbs / 0,02kg shells, 1909 Model
     Machine guns in deck mounts
     on side, evenly spread
   Weight of broadside 500 lbs / 227 kg
   Shells per gun, main battery: 160
   8 - 20,0" / 508 mm above water torpedoes

Armour:
   - Belts:      Width (max)   Length (avg)      Height (avg)
   Main:   3,00" / 76 mm   301,00 ft / 91,74 m   11,00 ft / 3,35 m
   Ends:   Unarmoured
     Main Belt covers 122% of normal length

   - Gun armour:   Face (max)   Other gunhouse (avg)   Barbette/hoist (max)
   Main:   1,00" / 25 mm         -         1,00" / 25 mm

   - Armour deck: 1,00" / 25 mm, Conning tower: 4,00" / 102 mm

Machinery:
   Oil fired boilers, steam turbines,
   Direct drive, 2 shafts, 30 808 shp / 22 983 Kw = 27,00 kts
   Range 8 000nm at 10,00 kts
   Bunker at max displacement = 783 tons

Complement:
   264 - 344

Cost:
   £0,383 million / $1,533 million

Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
   Armament: 68 tons, 1,6%
   Armour: 649 tons, 15,1%
      - Belts: 404 tons, 9,4%
      - Torpedo bulkhead: 0 tons, 0,0%
      - Armament: 19 tons, 0,4%
      - Armour Deck: 204 tons, 4,7%
      - Conning Tower: 23 tons, 0,5%
   Machinery: 1 400 tons, 32,6%
   Hull, fittings & equipment: 1 462 tons, 34,0%
   Fuel, ammunition & stores: 565 tons, 13,2%
   Miscellaneous weights: 150 tons, 3,5%

Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
   Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
     3 489 lbs / 1 582 Kg = 32,3 x 6,0 " / 152 mm shells or 0,8 torpedoes
   Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1,19
   Metacentric height 2,0 ft / 0,6 m
   Roll period: 13,0 seconds
   Steadiness   - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 70 %
         - Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0,37
   Seaboat quality  (Average = 1.00): 1,39

Hull form characteristics:
   Hull has rise forward of midbreak
   Block coefficient: 0,486
   Length to Beam Ratio: 8,64 : 1
   'Natural speed' for length: 19,49 kts
   Power going to wave formation at top speed: 60 %
   Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 50
   Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): 0,00 degrees
   Stern overhang: 0,00 ft / 0,00 m
   Freeboard (% = measuring location as a percentage of overall length):
      - Stem:      25,00 ft / 7,62 m
      - Forecastle (25%):   18,00 ft / 5,49 m
      - Mid (50%):      17,00 ft / 5,18 m (16,00 ft / 4,88 m aft of break)
      - Quarterdeck (15%):   16,00 ft / 4,88 m
      - Stern:      16,00 ft / 4,88 m
      - Average freeboard:   17,58 ft / 5,36 m

Ship space, strength and comments:
   Space   - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 121,7%
      - Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 92,5%
   Waterplane Area: 11 000 Square feet or 1 022 Square metres
   Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 104%
   Structure weight / hull surface area: 70 lbs/sq ft or 340 Kg/sq metre
   Hull strength (Relative):
      - Cross-sectional: 0,88
      - Longitudinal: 2,99
      - Overall: 1,00
   Hull space for machinery, storage, compartmentation is cramped
   Room for accommodation and workspaces is adequate
   Ship has slow, easy roll, a good, steady gun platform
   Good seaboat, rides out heavy weather easily

[The Rock Doctor]

Civilian standards are fine for slow, supporting stuff like minesweepers and sloops.  It is not at all fine for frontline warships.  If we start down that slope, the Swiss will be cranking out battlecruisers built to civvie standards, and nobody wants that. 

I'm thinking you'd want:

-Small and affordable, therefore numerous and expendable:  so no armor.

-Capable of hurting auxiliary cruisers in a stern chase:  so either all 6", or a 6" bowchaser and 4.7" singles on the broadside and astern.

-Fast enough to play with destroyers, or control the range to any larger quarry you're shadowing.  Twenty-eight knots minimum - contemporary light cruisers are that fast, and armored cruisers are getting close.

My recommendation - take P3D's design, drop any pretence of civilian standards, dump the armor, and bump the speed up.

[Borys]

How about this:

Enter ship name, Enter country Enter ship type laid down 1913 (Engine 1912)

Displacement:
   3 801 t light; 3 939 t standard; 4 492 t normal; 4 934 t full load

Dimensions: Length overall / water x beam x draught
   380,00 ft / 380,00 ft x 50,00 ft x 14,00 ft (normal load)
   115,82 m / 115,82 m x 15,24 m  x 4,27 m

Armament:
      4 - 6,00" / 152 mm guns in single mounts, 100,00lbs / 45,36kg shells, 1913 Model
     Breech loading guns in deck mounts with hoists
     on side ends, evenly spread
      2 - 3,00" / 76,2 mm guns in single mounts, 13,50lbs / 6,12kg shells, 1913 Model
     Breech loading guns in deck mounts
     on side, all amidships
   Weight of broadside 427 lbs / 194 kg
   Shells per gun, main battery: 200
   4 - 20,0" / 508 mm above water torpedoes

Armour:
   - Belts:      Width (max)   Length (avg)      Height (avg)
   Main:   2,50" / 64 mm   260,00 ft / 79,25 m   12,00 ft / 3,66 m
   Ends:   Unarmoured
     Main Belt covers 105% of normal length

   - Gun armour:   Face (max)   Other gunhouse (avg)   Barbette/hoist (max)
   Main:   1,00" / 25 mm         -         1,00" / 25 mm

   - Armour deck: 1,50" / 38 mm, Conning tower: 2,00" / 51 mm

Machinery:
   Coal and oil fired boilers, steam turbines,
   Direct drive, 2 shafts, 29 335 shp / 21 884 Kw = 26,00 kts
   Range 6 500nm at 12,00 kts
   Bunker at max displacement = 995 tons (50% coal)

Complement:
   273 - 356

Cost:
   £0,385 million / $1,539 million

Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
   Armament: 57 tons, 1,3%
   Armour: 740 tons, 16,5%
      - Belts: 332 tons, 7,4%
      - Torpedo bulkhead: 0 tons, 0,0%
      - Armament: 15 tons, 0,3%
      - Armour Deck: 382 tons, 8,5%
      - Conning Tower: 12 tons, 0,3%
   Machinery: 1 225 tons, 27,3%
   Hull, fittings & equipment: 1 577 tons, 35,1%
   Fuel, ammunition & stores: 691 tons, 15,4%
   Miscellaneous weights: 200 tons, 4,5%

Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
   Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
     6 035 lbs / 2 737 Kg = 55,9 x 6,0 " / 152 mm shells or 1,1 torpedoes
   Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1,23
   Metacentric height 2,6 ft / 0,8 m
   Roll period: 13,0 seconds
   Steadiness   - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 70 %
         - Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0,22
   Seaboat quality  (Average = 1.00): 1,21

Hull form characteristics:
   Hull has rise forward of midbreak
   Block coefficient: 0,591
   Length to Beam Ratio: 7,60 : 1
   'Natural speed' for length: 19,49 kts
   Power going to wave formation at top speed: 62 %
   Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 58
   Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): 0,00 degrees
   Stern overhang: 0,00 ft / 0,00 m
   Freeboard (% = measuring location as a percentage of overall length):
      - Stem:      25,00 ft / 7,62 m
      - Forecastle (20%):   20,00 ft / 6,10 m
      - Mid (70%):      20,00 ft / 6,10 m (12,72 ft / 3,88 m aft of break)
      - Quarterdeck (15%):   12,72 ft / 3,88 m
      - Stern:      12,72 ft / 3,88 m
      - Average freeboard:   18,22 ft / 5,55 m

Ship space, strength and comments:
   Space   - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 103,8%
      - Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 153,0%
   Waterplane Area: 13 780 Square feet or 1 280 Square metres
   Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 117%
   Structure weight / hull surface area: 72 lbs/sq ft or 351 Kg/sq metre
   Hull strength (Relative):
      - Cross-sectional: 0,91
      - Longitudinal: 2,30
      - Overall: 1,00
   Hull space for machinery, storage, compartmentation is adequate
   Room for accommodation and workspaces is excellent
   Ship has slow, easy roll, a good, steady gun platform
   Good seaboat, rides out heavy weather easily

[Jefgte]

Not a bad ship for me  ;)


Jef  ;)

[miketr]

All the suggestion revolve around giving the design a 6" gun.  Here is the thing...  what good is it going to be to land two or three 100lb ships on a cruiser with armor?  Unless blind luck favors me it's not going to really damage it.  If someone puts a couple of 6" guns on a freighter or a liner the 120mm shells will wreck it just as well as the 150mm weapons.  I am just trying to understand the desire for the larger weapons.  If I go with the uniform battery of 120mm the ship has real punch vs. DD's and has enough torpedo's to deal with larger ships if pressed.

Michael