Refits for the French ships.

[maddox]

To start with.   The 4 Formidable class battleships are slated for scrapping and/or selling. So that is no problem.

But the next class is now 15 years in use, so the refit is important.
These are the 4 Carnot class battleships.

But, should I just refit, or rebuild?
Refit can give me the ships back for front line duty for a reasonable pricetag and only a short time.
But a rebuild can make from these, small but tough cookies more than capable front line units in their own respect.

Any suggestions?

Bouvet, France Battleship laid down 1892

Displacement:
   12.459 t light; 13.173 t standard; 14.992 t normal; 16.447 t full load

Dimensions: Length overall / water x beam x draught
   410,00 ft / 410,00 ft x 75,00 ft x 27,00 ft (normal load)
   124,97 m / 124,97 m x 22,86 m  x 8,23 m

Armament:
      4 - 12,01" / 305 mm guns (2x2 guns), 865,69lbs / 392,67kg shells, 1892 Model
     Breech loading guns in turrets (on barbettes)
     on centreline ends, evenly spread
      4 - 10,83" / 275 mm guns (2x2 guns), 634,56lbs / 287,83kg shells, 1892 Model
     Breech loading guns in turrets (on barbettes)
     on side, all amidships
      10 - 5,51" / 140 mm guns in single mounts, 83,71lbs / 37,97kg shells, 1892 Model
     Breech loading guns in casemate mounts
     on side, evenly spread
     10 guns in hull casemates - Limited use in heavy seas
      12 - 2,76" / 70,0 mm guns in single mounts, 10,47lbs / 4,75kg shells, 1892 Model
     Breech loading guns in deck mounts
     on side, evenly spread
      12 - 1,85" / 47,0 mm guns in single mounts, 3,17lbs / 1,44kg shells, 1892 Model
     Quick firing guns in deck mounts
     on side, evenly spread, all raised mounts
   Weight of broadside 7.002 lbs / 3.176 kg
   Shells per gun, main battery: 100
   2 - 18,0" / 457,2 mm submerged torpedo tubes

Armour:
   - Belts:      Width (max)   Length (avg)      Height (avg)
   Main:   14,3" / 363 mm   220,00 ft / 67,06 m   7,50 ft / 2,29 m
   Ends:   5,50" / 140 mm   190,00 ft / 57,91 m   7,50 ft / 2,29 m
   Upper:   2,00" / 51 mm   220,00 ft / 67,06 m   4,00 ft / 1,22 m
     Main Belt covers 83% of normal length

   - Gun armour:   Face (max)   Other gunhouse (avg)   Barbette/hoist (max)
   Main:   14,5" / 368 mm   11,0" / 279 mm      8,75" / 222 mm
   2nd:   14,5" / 368 mm   11,0" / 279 mm      8,00" / 203 mm
   3rd:   2,00" / 51 mm         -               -

   - Armour deck: 3,00" / 76 mm, Conning tower: 13,80" / 351 mm

Machinery:
   Coal fired boilers, complex reciprocating steam engines,
   Direct drive, 2 shafts, 9.389 ihp / 7.004 Kw = 16,11 kts
   Range 6.000nm at 12,00 kts
   Bunker at max displacement = 3.273 tons (100% coal)

Complement:
   676 - 880

Cost:
   £1,406 million / $5,626 million

Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
   Armament: 876 tons, 5,8%
   Armour: 4.535 tons, 30,2%
      - Belts: 1.484 tons, 9,9%
      - Torpedo bulkhead: 0 tons, 0,0%
      - Armament: 1.584 tons, 10,6%
      - Armour Deck: 1.286 tons, 8,6%
      - Conning Tower: 181 tons, 1,2%
   Machinery: 1.677 tons, 11,2%
   Hull, fittings & equipment: 5.372 tons, 35,8%
   Fuel, ammunition & stores: 2.532 tons, 16,9%
   Miscellaneous weights: 0 tons, 0,0%

Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
   Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
     16.176 lbs / 7.337 Kg = 18,7 x 12,0 " / 305 mm shells or 2,2 torpedoes
   Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1,09
   Metacentric height 3,8 ft / 1,2 m
   Roll period: 16,1 seconds
   Steadiness   - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 84 %
         - Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0,77
   Seaboat quality  (Average = 1.00): 1,69

Hull form characteristics:
   Hull has raised forecastle
   Block coefficient: 0,632
   Length to Beam Ratio: 5,47 : 1
   'Natural speed' for length: 20,25 kts
   Power going to wave formation at top speed: 42 %
   Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 50
   Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): 0,00 degrees
   Stern overhang: 0,00 ft / 0,00 m
   Freeboard (% = measuring location as a percentage of overall length):
      - Stem:      21,00 ft / 6,40 m
      - Forecastle (20%):   18,00 ft / 5,49 m (16,00 ft / 4,88 m aft of break)
      - Mid (50%):      16,00 ft / 4,88 m
      - Quarterdeck (15%):   16,00 ft / 4,88 m
      - Stern:      16,00 ft / 4,88 m
      - Average freeboard:   16,64 ft / 5,07 m
   Ship tends to be wet forward

Ship space, strength and comments:
   Space   - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 82,5%
      - Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 104,5%
   Waterplane Area: 23.169 Square feet or 2.152 Square metres
   Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 101%
   Structure weight / hull surface area: 160 lbs/sq ft or 783 Kg/sq metre
   Hull strength (Relative):
      - Cross-sectional: 0,91
      - Longitudinal: 2,44
      - Overall: 1,01
   Hull space for machinery, storage, compartmentation is excellent
   Room for accommodation and workspaces is adequate
   Ship has slow, easy roll, a good, steady gun platform
   Excellent seaboat, comfortable, can fire her guns in the heaviest weather

[Borys]

Ahoj!
The guns are from a different age.
I say scrap.
Borys

[maddox]

And how am I going to fill in the gap?  That would mean France loses 8 battleships in 1 year time.

With the changed rules-  build speed of ships is effectively halved with 3 or 5 bp each half year opposit to a quarter- France cannot build 6 BB's in a reasonable time anymore.

[Borys]

Ahoj!
In that case rebuild.
Replace VTE engine with new model. That should save weight.
Use the saved weight for more coal and for bulges.
And macaroni :)

Not sure if it would be possible to replace the two old 30/35 calibre 12 inchers with a new one. So maybe use new 275mm twins instead of the old 305mm guns.
Maybe it would be possible to have 2x2, 2x1 of the new 275mm guns?

Borys

[Korpen]

And how am I going to fill in the gap?  That would mean France loses 8 battleships in 1 year time.

With the changed rules-  build speed of ships is effectively halved with 3 or 5 bp each half year opposit to a quarter- France cannot build 6 BB's in a reasonable time anymore.

Wait with the scrapping then.
But I agree with Borys, they are no worth the effort to either refit or rebuild.
For the cost of a refit you could build a nice BCs. :)

[P3D]

Scrap the four.

Build two cheapo battleship with reusing the armor and the 12" turrets and guns of the old one. It would save you about 6BP and $6 for each ship. Two of these would cost as much as the rebuilt of the old ones.

Formidable French BB laid down 1908 (Engine 1905)

Displacement:
   16,999 t light; 17,881 t standard; 20,040 t normal; 21,767 t full load

Dimensions: Length overall / water x beam x draught
   480.00 ft / 480.00 ft x 85.00 ft x 27.00 ft (normal load)
   146.30 m / 146.30 m x 25.91 m  x 8.23 m

Armament:
      8 - 12.00" / 305 mm guns (4x2 guns), 864.00lbs / 391.90kg shells, 1908 Model
     Breech loading guns in turrets (on barbettes)
     on centreline ends, evenly spread, 2 raised mounts - superfiring
      16 - 5.51" / 140 mm guns in single mounts, 83.64lbs / 37.94kg shells, 1908 Model
     Breech loading guns in casemate mounts
     on side, all amidships
      12 - 2.76" / 70.1 mm guns in single mounts, 10.51lbs / 4.77kg shells, 1908 Model
     Breech loading guns in deck mounts
     on side, evenly spread
   Weight of broadside 8,376 lbs / 3,799 kg
   Shells per gun, main battery: 100

Armour:
   - Belts:      Width (max)   Length (avg)      Height (avg)
   Main:   14.3" / 363 mm   300.00 ft / 91.44 m   10.00 ft / 3.05 m
   Ends:   5.50" / 140 mm   180.00 ft / 54.86 m   10.00 ft / 3.05 m
   Upper:   5.50" / 140 mm   300.00 ft / 91.44 m   8.00 ft / 2.44 m
     Main Belt covers 96 % of normal length

   - Gun armour:   Face (max)   Other gunhouse (avg)   Barbette/hoist (max)
   Main:   14.5" / 368 mm   11.0" / 279 mm      12.0" / 305 mm

   - Armour deck: 3.00" / 76 mm, Conning tower: 13.80" / 351 mm

Machinery:
   Coal fired boilers, steam turbines,
   Direct drive, 2 shafts, 29,783 shp / 22,218 Kw = 21.00 kts
   Range 6,000nm at 12.00 kts
   Bunker at max displacement = 3,886 tons (100% coal)

Complement:
   841 - 1,094

Cost:
   £1.822 million / $7.288 million

Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
   Armament: 1,047 tons, 5.2 %
   Armour: 6,817 tons, 34.0 %
      - Belts: 2,890 tons, 14.4 %
      - Torpedo bulkhead: 0 tons, 0.0 %
      - Armament: 1,995 tons, 10.0 %
      - Armour Deck: 1,714 tons, 8.6 %
      - Conning Tower: 219 tons, 1.1 %
   Machinery: 2,482 tons, 12.4 %
   Hull, fittings & equipment: 6,573 tons, 32.8 %
   Fuel, ammunition & stores: 3,041 tons, 15.2 %
   Miscellaneous weights: 80 tons, 0.4 %

Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
   Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
     22,066 lbs / 10,009 Kg = 25.5 x 12.0 " / 305 mm shells or 2.7 torpedoes
   Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1.11
   Metacentric height 4.8 ft / 1.5 m
   Roll period: 16.3 seconds
   Steadiness   - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 50 %
         - Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0.48
   Seaboat quality  (Average = 1.00): 1.10

Hull form characteristics:
   Hull has a flush deck
   Block coefficient: 0.637
   Length to Beam Ratio: 5.65 : 1
   'Natural speed' for length: 21.91 kts
   Power going to wave formation at top speed: 52 %
   Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 45
   Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): 0.00 degrees
   Stern overhang: 0.00 ft / 0.00 m
   Freeboard (% = measuring location as a percentage of overall length):
      - Stem:      24.10 ft / 7.35 m
      - Forecastle (20 %):   15.34 ft / 4.68 m
      - Mid (50 %):      15.34 ft / 4.68 m
      - Quarterdeck (15 %):   15.34 ft / 4.68 m
      - Stern:      15.34 ft / 4.68 m
      - Average freeboard:   16.04 ft / 4.89 m

Ship space, strength and comments:
   Space   - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 80.2 %
      - Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 107.3 %
   Waterplane Area: 30,876 Square feet or 2,868 Square metres
   Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 99 %
   Structure weight / hull surface area: 156 lbs/sq ft or 762 Kg/sq metre
   Hull strength (Relative):
      - Cross-sectional: 0.95
      - Longitudinal: 1.66
      - Overall: 1.00
   Hull space for machinery, storage, compartmentation is excellent
   Room for accommodation and workspaces is adequate

[Earl822]

Using turbines France could aquire from the UNK, this design of ship would be possible.

Formidable, France BB/BC laid down 1908 (Engine 1909)

Displacement:
   23,221 t light; 24,727 t standard; 27,662 t normal; 30,010 t full load

Dimensions: Length overall / water x beam x draught
   623.36 ft / 623.36 ft x 88.58 ft (Bulges 95.64 ft) x 29.53 ft (normal load)
   190.00 m / 190.00 m x 27.00 m (Bulges 29.15 m)  x 9.00 m

Armament:
      6 - 13.39" / 340 mm guns (3x2 guns), 1,400.00lbs / 635.03kg shells, 1908 Model
     Breech loading guns in turrets (on barbettes)
     on centreline, evenly spread
     Aft Main mounts separated by engine room
      8 - 10.83" / 275 mm guns (4x2 guns), 800.00lbs / 362.87kg shells, 1908 Model
     Breech loading guns in turrets (on barbettes)
     on side, all amidships
      16 - 5.51" / 140 mm guns in single mounts, 83.72lbs / 37.98kg shells, 1908 Model
     Breech loading guns in casemate mounts
     on side, evenly spread
     16 guns in hull casemates - Limited use in heavy seas
      12 - 2.76" / 70.0 mm guns in single mounts, 10.47lbs / 4.75kg shells, 1908 Model
     Quick firing guns in deck mounts
     on side, evenly spread, all raised mounts
   Weight of broadside 16,265 lbs / 7,378 kg
   Shells per gun, main battery: 100

Armour:
   - Belts:      Width (max)   Length (avg)      Height (avg)
   Main:   12.0" / 305 mm   377.30 ft / 115.00 m   9.84 ft / 3.00 m
   Ends:   2.76" / 70 mm   246.06 ft / 75.00 m   9.84 ft / 3.00 m
   Upper:   5.51" / 140 mm   262.47 ft / 80.00 m   7.38 ft / 2.25 m
     Main Belt covers 93 % of normal length

   - Torpedo Bulkhead and Bulges:
      0.98" / 25 mm   377.30 ft / 115.00 m   22.97 ft / 7.00 m

   - Gun armour:   Face (max)   Other gunhouse (avg)   Barbette/hoist (max)
   Main:   13.4" / 340 mm   10.8" / 275 mm      12.0" / 305 mm
   2nd:   12.0" / 305 mm   9.84" / 250 mm      10.8" / 275 mm
   3rd:   2.76" / 70 mm   0.98" / 25 mm      1.97" / 50 mm
   4th:   0.59" / 15 mm         -               -

   - Armour deck: 2.76" / 70 mm, Conning tower: 13.39" / 340 mm

Machinery:
   Coal fired boilers, steam turbines,
   Direct drive, 4 shafts, 38,337 shp / 28,600 Kw = 22.00 kts
   Range 6,000nm at 14.00 kts
   Bunker at max displacement = 5,283 tons (100% coal)

Complement:
   1,072 - 1,394

Cost:
   £2.523 million / $10.094 million

Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
   Armament: 1,717 tons, 6.2 %
   Armour: 8,690 tons, 31.4 %
      - Belts: 2,712 tons, 9.8 %
      - Torpedo bulkhead: 316 tons, 1.1 %
      - Armament: 3,433 tons, 12.4 %
      - Armour Deck: 1,965 tons, 7.1 %
      - Conning Tower: 264 tons, 1.0 %
   Machinery: 1,917 tons, 6.9 %
   Hull, fittings & equipment: 10,748 tons, 38.9 %
   Fuel, ammunition & stores: 4,441 tons, 16.1 %
   Miscellaneous weights: 150 tons, 0.5 %

Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
   Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
     34,978 lbs / 15,866 Kg = 29.2 x 13.4 " / 340 mm shells or 5.5 torpedoes
   Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1.08
   Metacentric height 4.9 ft / 1.5 m
   Roll period: 18.2 seconds
   Steadiness   - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 70 %
         - Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0.72
   Seaboat quality  (Average = 1.00): 1.26

Hull form characteristics:
   Hull has low quarterdeck
   Block coefficient: 0.550
   Length to Beam Ratio: 6.52 : 1
   'Natural speed' for length: 24.97 kts
   Power going to wave formation at top speed: 43 %
   Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 56
   Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): 0.00 degrees
   Stern overhang: 0.00 ft / 0.00 m
   Freeboard (% = measuring location as a percentage of overall length):
      - Stem:      19.69 ft / 6.00 m
      - Forecastle (20 %):   18.04 ft / 5.50 m
      - Mid (50 %):      18.04 ft / 5.50 m
      - Quarterdeck (25 %):   13.12 ft / 4.00 m (18.04 ft / 5.50 m before break)
      - Stern:      13.12 ft / 4.00 m
      - Average freeboard:   16.95 ft / 5.17 m
   Ship tends to be wet forward

Ship space, strength and comments:
   Space   - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 91.4 %
      - Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 123.6 %
   Waterplane Area: 38,537 Square feet or 3,580 Square metres
   Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 105 %
   Structure weight / hull surface area: 195 lbs/sq ft or 950 Kg/sq metre
   Hull strength (Relative):
      - Cross-sectional: 0.97
      - Longitudinal: 1.36
      - Overall: 1.00
   Hull space for machinery, storage, compartmentation is adequate
   Room for accommodation and workspaces is excellent
   Ship has slow, easy roll, a good, steady gun platform
   Good seaboat, rides out heavy weather easily

[maddox]

Bit heavy, why shouldn't I do a direct upgrade/purpose build of the Valeur class?

[swamphen]

Krupp's of Brandenburg considers French options and submits the following design for consideration. Noting that the current situation in South-East Asia/the Pacific makes construction in a Brandenburgian yard infeasible, however supply of reliable Krupp's turbines is certainly negiotiable.

The projection calls for two ships. Re-using the entire main armament package from the Carnots. The 305mm guns installed in Anton and Dora positions, with the 275mm guns superfiring them in Bruno and Caesar, their reduced calibre providing weight savings. The 305mm barbettes are also reused, while the 275mm are extended to suit their increased height.

The end and upper belts from the Carnots are also reused, however a new main belt was necessary due to the increased length of the ship. The conning towers are also to be reused.

A torpedo bulkhead was considered and rejected after projections showed it would cause a reduction in torpedo resistance. Instead the bulges are projected to be fitted with light, positive-buyonacy material.

A powerful Markoni installation, complete flagship facilities and climatisation for the hot conditions in the colonies of Glorious France are also provided for.

The design is telegraphed to the DKB Embassy in Paris as some of Krupp's 'old heads' shake said heads over ever desigining a (not booby-trapped) ship for the French. How times have changed...

Riviera, French Glorious Battleship laid down 1908 (Engine 1909)

Displacement:
   17,820 t light; 18,936 t standard; 22,433 t normal; 25,230 t full load

Dimensions: Length overall / water x beam x draught
   561.02 ft / 557.74 ft x 78.74 ft (Bulges 88.58 ft) x 25.43 ft (normal load)
   171.00 m / 170.00 m x 24.00 m (Bulges 27.00 m)  x 7.75 m

Armament:
      4 - 12.01" / 305 mm guns (2x2 guns), 865.70lbs / 392.68kg shells, 1892 Model
     Breech loading guns in turrets (on barbettes)
     on centreline ends, evenly spread
      4 - 10.83" / 275 mm guns (2x2 guns), 634.55lbs / 287.83kg shells, 1892 Model
     Breech loading guns in turrets (on barbettes)
     on centreline ends, evenly spread, all raised mounts
      16 - 5.51" / 140 mm guns in single mounts, 83.72lbs / 37.98kg shells, 1908 Model
     Breech loading guns in deck mounts
     on side, evenly spread
     10 guns in hull casemates - Limited use in heavy seas
      12 - 2.76" / 70.0 mm guns in single mounts, 10.47lbs / 4.75kg shells, 1908 Model
     Quick firing guns in deck mounts
     on side, evenly spread, 8 raised mounts
      4 - 1.85" / 47.0 mm guns in single mounts, 3.17lbs / 1.44kg shells, 1908 Model
     Quick firing guns in deck mounts
     on side, evenly spread, all raised mounts
   Weight of broadside 7,479 lbs / 3,392 kg
   Shells per gun, main battery: 150
   2 - 19.7" / 500 mm submerged torpedo tubes

Armour:
   - Belts:      Width (max)   Length (avg)      Height (avg)
   Main:   14.2" / 360 mm   367.45 ft / 112.00 m   11.48 ft / 3.50 m
   Ends:   5.51" / 140 mm   189.99 ft / 57.91 m   7.51 ft / 2.29 m
   Upper:   2.01" / 51 mm   220.01 ft / 67.06 m   4.00 ft / 1.22 m
     Main Belt covers 101 % of normal length

   - Gun armour:   Face (max)   Other gunhouse (avg)   Barbette/hoist (max)
   Main:   14.5" / 368 mm   11.0" / 279 mm      8.74" / 222 mm
   2nd:   14.5" / 368 mm   11.0" / 279 mm      7.99" / 203 mm
   3rd:   2.95" / 75 mm         -               -

   - Armour deck: 2.99" / 76 mm, Conning tower: 13.82" / 351 mm

Machinery:
   Coal and oil fired boilers, steam turbines,
   Direct drive, 4 shafts, 48,000 shp / 35,808 Kw = 23.68 kts
   Range 12,000nm at 12.00 kts (Bunkerage = 6,294 tons) (90% coal)

Complement:
   916 - 1,191

Cost:
   £1.742 million / $6.967 million

Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
   Armament: 935 tons, 4.2 %
   Armour: 6,852 tons, 30.5 %
      - Belts: 2,962 tons, 13.2 %
      - Torpedo bulkhead: 0 tons, 0.0 %
      - Armament: 1,833 tons, 8.2 %
      - Armour Deck: 1,820 tons, 8.1 %
      - Conning Tower: 237 tons, 1.1 %
   Machinery: 2,376 tons, 10.6 %
   Hull, fittings & equipment: 7,532 tons, 33.6 %
   Fuel, ammunition & stores: 4,613 tons, 20.6 %
   Miscellaneous weights: 125 tons, 0.6 %

Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
   Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
     29,934 lbs / 13,578 Kg = 34.6 x 12.0 " / 305 mm shells or 3.5 torpedoes
   Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1.13
   Metacentric height 4.4 ft / 1.4 m
   Roll period: 17.7 seconds
   Steadiness   - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 71 %
         - Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0.46
   Seaboat quality  (Average = 1.00): 1.20

Hull form characteristics:
   Hull has a flush deck
   Block coefficient: 0.625
   Length to Beam Ratio: 6.30 : 1
   'Natural speed' for length: 23.62 kts
   Power going to wave formation at top speed: 52 %
   Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 59
   Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): -5.00 degrees
   Stern overhang: 3.28 ft / 1.00 m
   Freeboard (% = measuring location as a percentage of overall length):
      - Stem:      26.25 ft / 8.00 m
      - Forecastle (20 %):   18.86 ft / 5.75 m
      - Mid (50 %):      17.22 ft / 5.25 m
      - Quarterdeck (15 %):   17.22 ft / 5.25 m
      - Stern:      17.22 ft / 5.25 m
      - Average freeboard:   18.39 ft / 5.61 m

Ship space, strength and comments:
   Space   - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 69.2 %
      - Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 120.3 %
   Waterplane Area: 32,876 Square feet or 3,054 Square metres
   Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 117 %
   Structure weight / hull surface area: 156 lbs/sq ft or 760 Kg/sq metre
   Hull strength (Relative):
      - Cross-sectional: 0.96
      - Longitudinal: 1.43
      - Overall: 1.00
   Hull space for machinery, storage, compartmentation is excellent
   Room for accommodation and workspaces is excellent
   Ship has slow, easy roll, a good, steady gun platform

[maddox]

I do like your design Swamphen.
But I have the plans for a med based Valeur here.

Nile, French Battleship laid down 1908 (Engine 1909)

Displacement:
   16.955 t light; 17.968 t standard; 19.104 t normal; 20.013 t full load

Dimensions: Length overall / water x beam x draught
   498,69 ft / 492,13 ft x 88,58 ft x 27,89 ft (normal load)
   152,00 m / 150,00 m x 27,00 m  x 8,50 m

Armament:
      6 - 13,39" / 340 mm guns (3x2 guns), 1.199,24lbs / 543,97kg shells, 1905 Model
     Breech loading guns in turrets (on barbettes)
     on centreline, evenly spread
     Aft Main mounts separated by engine room
      12 - 6,50" / 165 mm guns in single mounts, 137,06lbs / 62,17kg shells, 1906 Model
     Breech loading guns in casemate mounts
     on side, all amidships
     4 guns in hull casemates - Limited use in all but light seas
      18 - 5,51" / 140 mm guns in single mounts, 92,59lbs / 42,00kg shells, 1903 Model
     Quick firing guns in deck mounts with hoists
     on side, evenly spread, 6 raised mounts
      20 - 2,76" / 70,0 mm guns (4 mounts), 10,47lbs / 4,75kg shells, 1906 Model
     Quick firing guns in deck mounts
     on side, evenly spread, 12 raised guns
   Weight of broadside 10.716 lbs / 4.861 kg
   Shells per gun, main battery: 100

Armour:
   - Belts:      Width (max)   Length (avg)      Height (avg)
   Main:   11,0" / 279 mm   319,88 ft / 97,50 m   11,29 ft / 3,44 m
   Ends:   8,00" / 203 mm   172,21 ft / 52,49 m   11,29 ft / 3,44 m
   Upper:   8,00" / 203 mm   319,88 ft / 97,50 m   8,01 ft / 2,44 m
     Main Belt covers 100% of normal length

   - Torpedo Bulkhead:
      1,50" / 38 mm   400,00 ft / 121,92 m   32,00 ft / 9,75 m

   - Gun armour:   Face (max)   Other gunhouse (avg)   Barbette/hoist (max)
   Main:   12,0" / 305 mm   9,00" / 229 mm      10,0" / 254 mm
   2nd:   8,00" / 203 mm   2,00" / 51 mm      2,00" / 51 mm
   3rd:   2,00" / 51 mm   2,00" / 51 mm      2,00" / 51 mm

   - Armour deck: 2,50" / 64 mm, Conning tower: 11,00" / 279 mm

Machinery:
   Coal fired boilers, steam turbines,
   Direct drive, 2 shafts, 22.998 shp / 17.157 Kw = 20,00 kts
   Range 4.000nm at 12,00 kts
   Bunker at max displacement = 2.045 tons (100% coal)

Complement:
   812 - 1.056

Cost:
   £1,863 million / $7,451 million

Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
   Armament: 1.320 tons, 6,9%
   Armour: 7.444 tons, 39,0%
      - Belts: 3.240 tons, 17,0%
      - Torpedo bulkhead: 710 tons, 3,7%
      - Armament: 1.917 tons, 10,0%
      - Armour Deck: 1.407 tons, 7,4%
      - Conning Tower: 169 tons, 0,9%
   Machinery: 1.150 tons, 6,0%
   Hull, fittings & equipment: 6.942 tons, 36,3%
   Fuel, ammunition & stores: 2.149 tons, 11,2%
   Miscellaneous weights: 100 tons, 0,5%

Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
   Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
     24.625 lbs / 11.170 Kg = 20,5 x 13,4 " / 340 mm shells or 4,7 torpedoes
   Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1,13
   Metacentric height 5,2 ft / 1,6 m
   Roll period: 16,3 seconds
   Steadiness   - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 73 %
         - Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0,58
   Seaboat quality  (Average = 1.00): 1,47

Hull form characteristics:
   Hull has rise forward of midbreak
   Block coefficient: 0,550
   Length to Beam Ratio: 5,56 : 1
   'Natural speed' for length: 22,18 kts
   Power going to wave formation at top speed: 46 %
   Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 50
   Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): -5,00 degrees
   Stern overhang: 6,56 ft / 2,00 m
   Freeboard (% = measuring location as a percentage of overall length):
      - Stem:      26,90 ft / 8,20 m
      - Forecastle (20%):   19,69 ft / 6,00 m
      - Mid (50%):      16,40 ft / 5,00 m (15,52 ft / 4,73 m aft of break)
      - Quarterdeck (15%):   15,52 ft / 4,73 m
      - Stern:      15,52 ft / 4,73 m
      - Average freeboard:   17,69 ft / 5,39 m

Ship space, strength and comments:
   Space   - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 93,6%
      - Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 119,1%
   Waterplane Area: 30.424 Square feet or 2.826 Square metres
   Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 94%
   Structure weight / hull surface area: 163 lbs/sq ft or 798 Kg/sq metre
   Hull strength (Relative):
      - Cross-sectional: 0,93
      - Longitudinal: 1,92
      - Overall: 1,00
   Hull space for machinery, storage, compartmentation is adequate
   Room for accommodation and workspaces is adequate
   Ship has slow, easy roll, a good, steady gun platform
   Good seaboat, rides out heavy weather easily

[Borys]

Ahoj!
I do not think it possible, without reconstruction, to fit turbines into ex-VTE ships. To start with, the shafts for VTE run differently, have a high starting point on run at a sharper angle versus the bottom.
Shafts from the turbines start much nearer the bottom, and a have a course more paralle to the bottom.
Borys

[maddox]

The Valeurs are originaly turbine build.

[Borys]

Ahoj!
Blame it on switch from 19 inch 1280-1024 screen to 15 inch and 800-600 :)
Borys